Do you assume diabetics with horrible complications are to blame?

[BlueberryIsMyFavourite]

I'm just curious about this. And as this is an anonymous forum I thought people would answer truthfully, whereas in person I think people at least sometimes want to be more gentle.

I have type 1 diabetes for a long time now, 28 years, since childhood. I have always been incredibly sensitive to insulin and for a long time in old fashioned terms would have been called "brittle" but doctors don't tend to use that term anymore.

I have very good diabetes management now thanks to new technology. However, plenty of damage was done early on.

There just seems to be a general sense that people think diabetes is quite simple to control, and if you are struggling it's because you aren't doing something right.

Whereas, there are so, so many factors that can cause blood sugar to rise or drop apart from food - as an example, brushing my teeth can cause me to start dropping quickly, which then needs some glucose or juice to treat and stabilise it, and try brushing teeth again later. Because of course, diabetes also can destroy oral health, so good oral hygiene is very important. This is obviously a small, mundane example.

It is relentless and there are no days off.

Do you just assume diabetics with complications are essentially irresponsible?

Mine qas caused by immunosuppression. Steroids but its g9ne back to normal now I'm off them. Thank you God🙏🏿

The only 2 people I know with type 1 complications are completely self inflicted. I do still have lots of sympathy though as it must be really difficult and tiresome to manage. One smoked 40 a day and ended up losing both legs (and has sadly died) and the other is a friend of DPs who goes on coke/ alcholol binges most weekends. He's ended up in a&e multiple times and been in ICU twice. Fairly recently he was found passed out on his driveway the morning after a heavy night out. It's really sad to watch as he's only in his 30s 😔

T1. Tiresome. Intrusive. 24/7, 365, no break. The moment I open my eyes: am I low, was I low in the night, make sure I have more breakfast because I'm cycling ds2 to school. Must run myself a bit higher this afternoon because I have an important work meeting. Monitoring constantly. 60+ similar thoughts and decisions made every single day. Sometimes wish it would just piss off.

I did the NHS EMPOWER course and it was common sense advice basically swopping white pasta and breads for wholemeal, so lots of fibre etc 1170gm carbs, no mention of artificial sweenteners and basically sensible about red meats and cutting out sugar, drinking enough water and getting enough sleep.

I spoke to the dietician while i was in hospital and then 3 months later had another appointment. I wasnt diagnosed with T2 a until i ended up in hospital with a uti and DK without A.. I was straight onto insulin and metformin.
My HAIbc had gone from 106 to 39 and he said to me you actually listened to me! so many people dont. In fact said I was too good and didnt need to be so strict with myself as i was in danger of Hypos.
I did the EMPOWER course a year later (which was a bit later). It endorsed what i had been doing for the last year.

I try to keep under 25g of added sugar a day. I drink flavoured fizzy water with no sugar or sweeteners. I have a low sugar muesli/granola with berries and plain yoghurt or unsweetened almond milk. If i have something sweet i tend to eat a handful of nuts with it to slow the release of glucose into my blood stream etc
I used a free libre for 2 weeks and I was in range for 97% of the time 2% was too low rather than too high.
So following NHS advice has worked for me

Nor do they recommend low fat diet. They recommend a 3rd of calories should come from fats and explain the difference between good fats and bad fats.

I try to keep under 25g of added sugar a day. I drink flavoured fizzy water with no sugar or sweeteners. I have a low sugar muesli/granola with berries and plain yoghurt or unsweetened almond milk. If i have something sweet i tend to eat a handful of nuts with it to slow the release of glucose into my blood stream etc

This....would wildly not work for my Type 1 or a lot of Type 1s I know.

Slow release glucose foods, like porridge, are FAR more difficult to match insulin to for a majority of Type 1s in my experience.

It just means hours of nursing blood sugars along and having to make it the main focus of my attention for about 5 or 6 hours after eating - despite being on a pump with a CGM making corrections every 5 minutes. If I didn't intervene I'd easily be in the high teens or hit the 20s so it's just not an option to sit back.

It's a massive pain in the arse and I'm bitter about it because I love a bowl of porridge on a winter's morning!

Instead, I make a mix of flaxseed, coconut and almond flour with a very small amount of oats (maybe 15%) of the overall mixture. It sates the porridge urge on mornings I really want it - worth trying for anyone else who struggles with porridge.

Bruffin I'm glad you had good advice. Unfortunately, the NHS has been giving low fat advice for decades and lots of people were taught that way. That's relevant to a thread about whether people are responsible for the complications of their disease.

And, sadly, some parts of the NHS still haven't caught up.

Everytime I spoken to someone within the NHS I've been told something different regarding diet. Low fat. Not low fat. Low carb. Don't worry about carbs. Low sugar including avoiding fruit. Eat fruit it's good for you.

Not to mention being told my annual review is due and then them not having any appointments for the last 3 months.

Sorry forgot to mention, i always have a boiled egg with my breakfast for the protein.

As a Type 1 I have nothing but compassion for Type 2s. It is a different disease that requires very different management, but we all suffer the same shitty outcomes and we all know exactly how frightening it is to have our eyes or limbs or kidneys threatened.

@happyl Hope you don’t mind me asking but are you in the UK? DS was diagnosed T1 last year and we were told he was ineligible for a pump as over 12 (diagnosed at 12 years and I month!) and also that adults don’t get them unless a clinical need which seems to have a very high threshold. I’m hoping that may change.at the end of this month when new guidelines are published but interested to know if other people get them.

Yes it is really frustratingly hard to get pumps and dexcom.

Unforgivable to be honest.

Get over yourself. “People like me.” Everyone forms an opinion about everyone the in exactly same way you have with me. Being thin doesn’t mean healthy we all know that. Equally I know people have different reasons for getting it.

But T2 is a now bloody massive problem for the NHS . It’s really important we have pre diabetic interventions. So actually being very dismissive and saying it’s genetics doesn’t actually help does it. Here’s a link to show what does help. Bugger me if it’s not healthy eating and exercise.

https://www.england.nhs.uk/2023/02/nhs-scheme-reduces-chances-of-type-2-diabetes-for-at-risk-adults/

No. I go by what I see or what people tell me.

What on earth do people think I do? I don’t go round screaming at T2 sufferers or throwing lettuce at them.

So back to what I said - you can't possibly judge a stranger when you know nothing of the circumstances. You can't see their medical history or genetics.

@BurbleBumleBleep

readinv comprehension really isn't your strong point is it?

where did I say it was genetics??

Oh the vote is a bit disappointing 😕

Exactly!!

Right. So clearly about 50% people DO blame diabetics for shitty complications.

Depressing as fuck. Well, life will catch up with that 50% and one day somebody they love will suffer from an illness and they'll feel how random and unfair it is when it strikes, and then it will dawn on them how shite it really can be.

None of us get out alive, after all!

It is such a gift to be so unwittingly clueless you actually find it reasonable to blame people despite lots of us explaining the reality of diabetes, it can only mean you are in such excellent health and so are all your family that you just can't conceive of anything bad happening to you - because of your superiour, stellar choices. Lol.

Don't take it to heart. All it means is that there are a quite a few uneducated, narrow-minded posters on mumsnet.

It stems from ignorance for the most part. Its no reflection on you.

@BlueberryIsMyFavourite i think it might also reflect that the vote was a bit confusing. I voted YABU because to to think that people are to blame for their complications is unreasonable but not because you are unreasonable. A few PP said they were also confused.

Im going to go with this explanation because it is a more generous view of humanity ;)

We have a genetic predisposition to type 2 diabetes I am half Asian, my GF and three of my older siblings have developed it. Myself and two other siblings and my Mother haven’t so far. What’s has it taken? a lot of self control and my Mother and my other siblings and myself while not teetotal are the have a drink at weddings only type and stay as slim as possible. There is a lot of denial.

One of my brothers died prematurely because of complications and was on dialysis four times a week. He was very regretful towards the end that he had not listened to the Doctors much sooner. He drank probably three nights a week and ate exactly what he wanted. He was a really excellent cook and there was always lots of sugar and fats being used to make fabulous food, he also smoked. He never got to see any of his grandchildren who were born about 5 years after he died.

When my brother died my sister radically changed the way she lived and lost 5 stone. Her diabetes was never going to regress and not exist but her readings improved so much her dose of meds was reduced.

Issue you have here is people do not understand the difference between type 1 and type 2 diabetes.

Also Covid hasnt helped at all.
My preferred exercise is swimming, do i ciuldnt that for neatly a year, although i do walk a bit , i do 12k when i go to work and esdnt doing that wfh
I actually got diagnosef within a weeks of getting covid last year.

You're asking a pretty nuanced question - I for one have no idea about the differences between T1 & T2 diabetes, and until reading this thread, I had no idea just how much I don't know.

My assumptions about diabetes mainly come from (I think) T2 diabetics who have poor eating habits and whose diabetes could be reversed by making better lifestyle choices,. In that instance, I'd absolutely believe people are responsible for managing their health condition and limiting the impact of diabetes.

However, reading this thread I understand that there's a huge difference between T1 & T2 and that there are complications I had no idea about for both, so I wouldn't answer that way at all now.

This is interesting and it's 100% right that we have compassion towards bulimics with type 1.I

But I wonder; I'm type 2 , on metformin, 25 stone, and I have always struggled with urges to manage my emotions, feelings of emptiness with bingeing or grazing on large quantities of food, either bingeing in a 2 or 3 hour period or grazing on and off all day. I don't make myself sick afterwards . Yet I have examined the DSM/ICD10 criteria for bulimia and the only symptom I don't fit is the vomiting, diuretics or exercise after my binges.

I would say my obesity is an eating disorder which causes me to have trouble with my weight and sugars. I was abused as a small child and my eating issues started then pretty much.

Yet someone would look at a hefty 27 stone type 2 diabetic like me and judge.

Do I have responsibility to care for my weight and sugars? Yes. Absolutely . But am I to blame? I don't think blame is helpful, I already hate myself utterly and miss meals to compensate for bingeing and self harm in other ways because I feel intense shame . I am in my 40s now but couldn't even make eye contact until my 20s. So for me it's not about judgement but responsibility .

I know someone like me except pre diabetic but she reversed it utterly after being in Overeaters Anonymous for about 5 years. That's maybe the way forward for me I think.