WTF? £600 winter fuel allowance for all pensioners!

[user1497207191]

No wonder the country has no money and the deficit/debt is getting bigger.

MIL just phoned up saying she'd got a letter telling her £600 was on the way to her and asking why, when she doesn't need it?

Just why??? She's not claiming means tested benefits. Her state and her husband's occupational pension are already far more than she needs to live on, meaning she saves a few hundred pounds a month into ISAs (which already stand at over £100k). Owns her own house, so no rent/mortgage.

Why the hell can't this money be directed at those who actually need it or more worthy causes? It's insane to keep throwing money at people who don't need it.

She doesn't need it, she doesn't want it. She wouldn't miss it if it wasn't paid to her.

If they can means test the child benefit and claw it back from those earning over £50k, why can't they come up with a way of ensuring winter fuel allowance is only paid to those who may need it? Why not only paid to those pensioners claiming pension credits, or rent allowance, or whatever?

Some of it this year and last year is cost of living payment and people on benefits have got this.

In fact some people on benefits have had a small fortune in cost of living payments so I am not quite sure why the anger for pensioners, most of whom have worked many many years. My parents both worked over 50 years. How many youngsters will do that when they don't even start work often until in their 20's.

With child benefit they put the burden on the tax payers so if you claim it, you have to declare it and pay back part/all if over the allowance. If you own a second property the onus is on you to fill in a tax form too.
They can easily do the same with pensioners? Anyone with income above x, needs to pay it back? Lots of pensioners with savings and no debt will be far richer now interest rates have risen. Anyone with interest above a certain amount added to pension needs to surely fill in a tax form anyway?

Still a choice whether you have children or not though. I really doubt anyone is having children so that future pensions can be paid

Well, the parents made a choice but technically the children didn't make the choice to be born. The child benefit is for the child's benefit (clue is in the name) not for the parents.

exactly

bloody ploy from the tories i so hope they lose and losemassivley next election

Strange that when her mum was surprised about it.

I think wealthy pensioners on the whole will make better use of it than the government would. I shall add some Christmas gifts to the food banks as well as my usual donations and buy some Christmas gifts on the Dunelm appeal.
The rest I will give to whichever of my children is hosting Christmas this year.

And I don't vote Tory, I think it's a very working class thing to do. 😂

I second this - can people not see that 'average' means very little when applied to the pensioner demographic.

Pension credit pensioners comprise about 1.5million out of a total of 12 million. They get lots of extra help as many have been unable or unwilling to save or invest in a personal pension.

The remaining pensioners if single have an average income of £16k per annum ( which they are taxed on). Couples are slightly better off as they each have a tax-free allowance and probably twice the income (2 pensions).

75% of pensioners are not millionaires - stop harping on about the 25% who own million pound houses and have generous pensions

By all means OP you can single out those as rich as your example who are paying 40% TAX but do not assume that anyone not on pension credit is not in need of the WFA

YABVU

@viques 👏

In your scenario, what about the OAP on their 50K income who’s never had children and spends 6 months a year abroad as the cost of living is cheaper? Should they pay as much Tax an NI as someone with 5 children all of whom need to be born, then educated at the tax payers expense?

You can write your last, true, sentence as often as you like but it doesn't fit the MN mantra so will be rubbished, the same thickos think that all pensioners voted for Brexit when I knew of only one who did, and we gave him hell!

This. Care home fees are astronomical.

Believe me, HMRC do come after you if you don’t declare it. I made a mistake one year as I forgot to take into account my employer provided private medical cover when calculating my overall earnings so I went just over the £50k and they contacted me during the next tax year threatening fines, penalties etc!

Totally this.

The previous poster said getting pregnant was not a choice.
It is
I did not dispute the global necessity in my post

Most pensioners use it for Christmas and see it like their Christmas bonus. It would probably be cheaper for the government to pay the energy companies directly so the OAPs bill is reduced.

Why? Lots of pensioners are receiving state pension without ever having paid NIC, i.e. those who qualified due to caring responsibilities, unemployment, or wages high enough to qualify for NIC credits, but not high enough to pay NIC. There are lots of ways to gain "credits" but not actually pay any NIC.

It's no different to changing the state retirement age, or increasing basic rate tax rates, or changing personal allowances. Nothing is cast in stone that can never change.

Pensioners are most likely to vote Tory, simple as that. It’s like bribery.

I recently retired so here is another take on this:

1. To the best of my knowledge the Winter Fuel payment is £300 . I do not know if this is paid per pensioner, so if your MIL is married to someone who it also retired they are getting £300 each.
2. I really need this money, I have my state pension and a small NHS pension as for many years as a single mum I could not afford to make any pension contributions due to really struggling as I did not get any child support and also worked in a few jobs where there were no pension schemes. Planning for retirement is tought now, during the many years I I worked it was even more fraught and complicated. I paid for everything while raising my child and often had no spare cash for anything. However I did pay in while I had my NHS job
3. I still pay income tax, I pay full council tax and of course I pay VAT just like anybody else. The only thing I don't pay is NI
4. I have a small amount of savings, again I could not begin to save until much later in my life due to the reasons explained in point 2.
5. When I retired I had done all my calculations but like many people, young, middle aged, and old , I was blindsided by the COC and have had to radically cut back. My due fuel DD is now £240 a month, it used to be £80. Last winter, even with the govt help was wretched, I had to wear fingerless gloves and a hat in the house and spent most of my time huddled under a heated throw. I became very depressed. To run my heating for two hours a day, cook a meal, heat some water, wash clothes boil a kettle etc, averaged out at £10 a day, I dread to think what it would cost me to actually have a warm home that I felt comfortable in,
6. When I get the £300 I will immediately pay it over to Octopus, I am grateful for it and use it for what it was intended for
7. Should we means test it? I don't know, I think this complex and where would the cut off point be?
8. I do not and never will vote Tory, I really object to the agesism that is behind this cliche, who do you think marched against the National Front, protested against apartheid, demonstrated against the Poll Tax and fought for women's rights? It was people from my generation, like all generations we are a real mix of views, attitudes and opinions, not some blob of wealthy right wing reactionaries.
9. One day, impossible as it may seem now, you too will be old.
10. If you have read this far, thank you

It's not £600 for all - £600 for over 80s. I think all 80 year olds deserve some comfort in life. Unlike us youngsters it's not so easy for them to go and earn it if they want something, even if that something is turning up the thermostat 1 degree.

My mum is 79 so she'll get £500. She could survive without it but why should she just have to "survive". She's still working, from home, and feels the cold much more than I do. We go and see her often, she looks after my kids after school 2 days a week. We'll all benefit from it somehow!

Fuck me end the thread everybody, fucking Einstein has spoken.

Brilliant post @Lifeomars

I'm nearly 61 not claiming anything myself but looking for work. Yes, Looking for work after having looked after elderly relatives for a few years. I have sufficient NI payments for my state pension in five years time. My husband is 68. Worked in low paid jobs since he was 15. He receives the state pension and a very tiny work pension from his last job.
So - that is our joint income. Less than 12K per year. We are not eligible for pension credit, and we pay full council tax £2K.

Hands up - who thinks we should not receive £300 fuel allowance this year when the unemployed have had help, and 10 per cent increase on their benefit?

Do you have a link for this research ?

Lifeomars,

Thank you for your post, however you don’t have to explain yourself to anyone.

I don’t begrudge retired people anything. They deserve it.

It does appear that the government don't want to support working families. It seems there is a lack of equity. We are being taxed to the hilt to support pensioners, only to he told we have to work until we are 70 plus.
It is hard for us to see people who have retired at 55 with final salary pensions.
There is 0 support for the squeezed working fighting to pay mortgages.

*AutumIsOrange · Today 13:35

Because Tories need the pensioners vote to win the next election*

This but also it is administratively cheaper not to means test

Well at least part of your username is apt.