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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Cleaner let cats into living room

648 replies

slithytoveisascientist · 12/10/2023 11:27

Last week she let them into bedroom and luckily I caught it before anything happened. I reminded her and she was very apologetic and promised to be more careful.

This week she has left the living room door open and the cats have gone in and scratched my leather sofa. It’s never had any damage before and I’m gutted.

AIBU to ask to claim on her insurance for a repair, and will I even have any success?

Cleaner let cats into living room
OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 14/10/2023 11:55

laclochette · 14/10/2023 09:13

@junbean I have to say I find this a strange attitude: a cleaner is a professional, hired to carry out work to a professional standard. If you took someone on in your workplace to do a job and asked them to follow a similar instruction, and they repeatedly didn't do it, would your response be, "well, if you want something done right you have to do it yourself"? That's certainly one option. Another option is to hire someone and pay them to do it, and it's ok to hold professional people to professional standards ie following clear instructions. If this was an incredibly onerous or unreasonable ask that would be a different matter, but it's simply closing a door.

Every cleaner will have a different sense of their professional scope and as long as it's agreed at the outset between both parties then it's reasonable to expect that agreement to be honoured. My cleaner also feeds and checks in on my cat when she visits if that's called for, as it's part of the service she offers. Her remit is to care for my home, and my cat is part of my home!

Edited

This is also one of the reasons we went with an insured registered company rather than someone setting up as a cash in hand sole trader with probably no protection

OP posts:
gamerchick · 14/10/2023 12:26

FrodoBagginsToeHair · 14/10/2023 11:23

This thread is the absolute worst of MN what a bunch of cunts you’ve had responding here. if I could tell each one individually I would but I’d get banned because people don’t like to hear they’re cunts.

hope you find a decent cleaner who can manage to shut two doors. And I hope you can find a therapist for your poor cats they’re so deprived of space. Let’s not even get onto your POOR kids eh

honestly I was frustrated that you are having to respond to these clowns over and over so I can only imagine how you’ve felt!

I dunno,. I just gleaned that people live in absolute shitholes because people should accept cat behaviour and let them wreck the house...

Got a bit more pride in my house than that

laclochette · 14/10/2023 12:46

@slithytoveisascientist Yes, same...not sure what my cleaner's insurance actually covers tbh but I like knowing she has it, just as it's important to know any other contractor working on your home has the right insurance in place.

laclochette · 14/10/2023 12:50

@slithytoveisascientist ahha right. I think a lot of the comments here are rooted in some kind of belief that having a cleaner is bad...not sure where that comes from. There's certainly no moral value in cleaning. There's nothing wrong with doing cleaning either, I just like to focus on doing my job and have a professional who does hers: my cleaning. I actually think a lot of it is rooted in structural misogyny which frames domestic work as a) less valid and not worthy of economic recompense in the way that other jobs we pay people to do, from construction to accounting, are and b) that connects women's moral value in this world to doing their own cleaning.

Mswest · 14/10/2023 13:49

slithytoveisascientist · 14/10/2023 11:46

@Mswest it's not sacking and the other ones were trials, I'm not alone in having a hard time finding a cleaner. It seems there is a perception anyone can just set themselves up and do the job and that's not the case, it takes ability and organisation to be good.

For what it's worth this cleaner managed the doors for two months...

So she made a one off mistake then. You asked whether it was unreasonable to ask the cleaner to cover the repair cost of your couch. In my opinion yes, it is. Not her responsibility to manage your pets alongside doing her actual job of cleaning. Maybe next time you recruit one explain leaving doors open is a red line for you and be sure they are ok with that, I suspect the good ones will probably not call back though, it all sounds a bit high maintenance, especially as you say good cleaners are hard to find and are in demand. Fwiw I have an excellent cleaner who has stayed with me for years, just in case anyone accuses me of being against having a cleaner 🙄

itsmyp4rty · 14/10/2023 14:03

I just can't imagine living in a house where your pets can't come in the living room and certain doors have to be kept closed at all times. If they're not allowed in your bedroom how come they're fine in the other two bedrooms? How come they don't scratch up furniture in any of the rooms they are allowed in? It all sounds very mysterious to me.
Why don't you just tell her about the damage and ask her about claiming on her insurance as it was due to her not shutting the doors as asked. It's impossible to know what she'll say and whether or not you'll get anywhere.

Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 14/10/2023 15:04

@Mswest this (door being left open, no damage occurred then) happened last week and she apologised and said it wouldn't happen again.

And it would be her insurance, not her.

Insurance IS to cover damage though I've been told it wouldn't cover this particular damage.

OP posts:
Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 14/10/2023 15:05

itsmyp4rty · 14/10/2023 14:03

I just can't imagine living in a house where your pets can't come in the living room and certain doors have to be kept closed at all times. If they're not allowed in your bedroom how come they're fine in the other two bedrooms? How come they don't scratch up furniture in any of the rooms they are allowed in? It all sounds very mysterious to me.
Why don't you just tell her about the damage and ask her about claiming on her insurance as it was due to her not shutting the doors as asked. It's impossible to know what she'll say and whether or not you'll get anywhere.

Our bed is leather frame the others are wood.

We couldn't get a wooden one in the style and size we wanted.

The cats don't scratch wood.

So the other bedrooms are fine.

OP posts:
junbean · 14/10/2023 18:26

laclochette · 14/10/2023 09:13

@junbean I have to say I find this a strange attitude: a cleaner is a professional, hired to carry out work to a professional standard. If you took someone on in your workplace to do a job and asked them to follow a similar instruction, and they repeatedly didn't do it, would your response be, "well, if you want something done right you have to do it yourself"? That's certainly one option. Another option is to hire someone and pay them to do it, and it's ok to hold professional people to professional standards ie following clear instructions. If this was an incredibly onerous or unreasonable ask that would be a different matter, but it's simply closing a door.

Every cleaner will have a different sense of their professional scope and as long as it's agreed at the outset between both parties then it's reasonable to expect that agreement to be honoured. My cleaner also feeds and checks in on my cat when she visits if that's called for, as it's part of the service she offers. Her remit is to care for my home, and my cat is part of my home!

Edited

If it's outside their job description it would be abusive to punish them. It's not that complicated.

Frequency · 14/10/2023 19:13

@junbean But it is not outside of the job description. OP has stated several times that she asked the cleaner before hiring her if she would be ok remembering to close the door so the cat does not get in. She also reminded her again last week and the cleaner agreed.

Although, if the cleaner believes that closing a door is so far outside of her job description that she cannot possibly do it, then she should not be cleaning other people's homes. How ever will she close the front door after herself?

Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 14/10/2023 19:15

@junbean What on earth is punishment? An insurance claim on a business? Choosing not to work with them again?

And if they agreed to the scope of the job it's then their responsibility and becomes part of the job description.

Working in someone else's home has a broad remit.

The cleaning job description might include-

Cleaning hob, windows, skirtings, light switches
Locking up and putting a key in to a key safe
In the process, not allowing animals to escape
Changing beds
Ironing

It might not include any of those things.

If the cleaner agrees to it, it's the job description.

If a cleaner agreed to lock the house when she left and then forgot, is that ok? Would that deserve what you call 'punishment'?

Mine agreed to shut the door when finished. She didn't. That is on her not me.

OP posts:
Baffy11 · 15/10/2023 04:26

I'm not sure why you came on here to ask for people's opinions, when you are simply going to argue with every view that is contrary to yours.

That aside, even if it provided cover (not certain), the deductible/excess of any liability policy she has will very likely be higher than the cost of repair, so she (or you) would end up paying for it anyway.

Boymum2104 · 15/10/2023 07:33

She’s a cleaner not a cat sitter. I’m sure she has enough to think about without having to manage cats as well

Greywhippet · 15/10/2023 08:00

Your cats, your problem. Your poor cleaner! Clean your own house

DSN88 · 15/10/2023 08:22

I am not a cat person at all, so would be really annoyed if a cat did this (I have dogs, they obviously don’t do this kind of thing), but it’s not the cleaners fault. If I had a cleaner and I didn’t want my dogs bolting it out the front door, or into any no go room for that matter, I’d put the dogs into the garage for the duration the cleaner is here. You’ve said which rooms they are allowed in, garage being one…so they’re clearly used to it, just put them in there whilst the cleaner’s with you. It’s not up to the cleaner to herd them, she may be scared of them, not like them etc so you can’t expect her to be responsible for them whilst she has a job to do.

FrodoBagginsToeHair · 15/10/2023 08:36

Boymum2104 · 15/10/2023 07:33

She’s a cleaner not a cat sitter. I’m sure she has enough to think about without having to manage cats as well

She wasn’t asking her to be a cat sitter she was asking for them to close a door.

FrodoBagginsToeHair · 15/10/2023 08:37

Greywhippet · 15/10/2023 08:00

Your cats, your problem. Your poor cleaner! Clean your own house

OP has already gone through why she has a cleaner - perhaps you should have read the thread before making your “contribution”

Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 15/10/2023 10:30

Baffy11 · 15/10/2023 04:26

I'm not sure why you came on here to ask for people's opinions, when you are simply going to argue with every view that is contrary to yours.

That aside, even if it provided cover (not certain), the deductible/excess of any liability policy she has will very likely be higher than the cost of repair, so she (or you) would end up paying for it anyway.

I asked about WIBU to claim

Was told yes

Accepted that

I didn't ask for opinions about the door closing or cat ownership or cleaner existence or rates or house size or anything else

So you aren't quite right

OP posts:
Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 15/10/2023 10:31

DSN88 · 15/10/2023 08:22

I am not a cat person at all, so would be really annoyed if a cat did this (I have dogs, they obviously don’t do this kind of thing), but it’s not the cleaners fault. If I had a cleaner and I didn’t want my dogs bolting it out the front door, or into any no go room for that matter, I’d put the dogs into the garage for the duration the cleaner is here. You’ve said which rooms they are allowed in, garage being one…so they’re clearly used to it, just put them in there whilst the cleaner’s with you. It’s not up to the cleaner to herd them, she may be scared of them, not like them etc so you can’t expect her to be responsible for them whilst she has a job to do.

Is closing a door herding an animal? She never sees the cats. Never interacts.

She agreed to close this door.

OP posts:
zingally · 15/10/2023 11:26

Presumably your cleaners job is to clean, not police the locations of your multiple cats.
There's that phrase "like herding cats" to imply something difficult. She's got other things to think about than the cats. If you don't want them getting past her, just shut them in one room while she's around, and tell her not to worry about that room.
Easy fix for a mountain out of a molehill.

Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 15/10/2023 11:27

zingally · 15/10/2023 11:26

Presumably your cleaners job is to clean, not police the locations of your multiple cats.
There's that phrase "like herding cats" to imply something difficult. She's got other things to think about than the cats. If you don't want them getting past her, just shut them in one room while she's around, and tell her not to worry about that room.
Easy fix for a mountain out of a molehill.

Two cats

She doesn't see them

Never has to my knowledge

She doesn't need to police their locations

She had to close a door that she agreed to close

OP posts:
PylaSheight · 15/10/2023 12:41

YANBU @slithytoveisascientist and this thread has been full of arseholes behaving like arseholes 🙄
I don't know about asking her to claim on her business insurance unless you want to lose the cleaner, but thankfully the sofa doesn't look badly damaged from the pic and I suspect with a trim it'll look fine (apologies if you've said somewhere it's not easily fixable)

Nothing wrong with your cats being indoor cats

Nothing wrong with them having the run of all of a decent sized house (plus garden) except for 2 rooms

Nothing wrong with not wanting them in the lounge and your bedroom, especially for the reasons you've explained

Nothing wrong with asking the cleaner to keep the doors closed, and not surprising you're pissed off that a simple request couldn't be done especially as you'd reminded her (and the doors were shut when she arrived)

Good idea to have them cats in with you when the cleaner is there

Good idea to get an automatic door closer

YANBU to be irritated that your cleaner "forgot" your reasonable request twice. I can see how you'd lose confidence in someone who did that and also wonder what else they'd forget to do which could result in damage to your property or harm to your cats.

Baba197 · 15/10/2023 13:33

Yes she should’ve shut the door if has specifically been asked to but I don’t think you can claim on her insurance, if you want to try then you will prob loose your cleaner at the very least and is that worth the stress of finding a new one? If she isn’t that great then maybe look for a new one. Personally I would keep them in the garage whilst she is there (assuming she doesn’t clean in there) or the garden and only let them back in when she’s gone and doors have been checked if you are particularly fussy over your furniture

Sbera · 15/10/2023 18:03

Forgive me as I’ve not read the entire thread so this may have been covered. I’m sorry your settees have been ruined.

I don’t think you are being unreasonable as you’ve effectively given an employee/contractor some clear instructions that they haven’t followed, whether people agree with the instructions or not.

So the insurance question and whether you’d have any luck. For context I work in the nanny industry and look after our insurance for nannies in the family home. So a very similar set up.

It’s likely the insurance the cleaner/cleaning company has is public liability insurance.

How this works is as follows.

  1. You claim on your own insurance for the damage to the settees
  2. There will be a difference between the actual cost and what your insurance pays out. For example, your excess. Possibly your time that you could charge for for waiting in for a repair company or replacement delivery.
  3. You effectively sue the cleaner for this difference. You have to take the cleaner to (usually small claims) court at your cost.

Case study.
A nanny split some cleaning product on some wooden work tops and damaged them.
The family claimed on their own insurance which had an excess of £300. The family also took a day of work to be in when replacement worktops were fitted at a cost of £300 for a days work. (They had to prove this was an unpaid day off work rather than just I’ll work from home that day)

The family sued the nanny for the £600 additional cost. To take the nanny to court cost them a £1000 solicitor bill.

The nanny had public liability insurance which she kicked in. This had an excess of £50 on the policy.
Nanny paid this £50 and the public liability paid the remainder of £1550.

It’s lengthy and annoying but just the way public liability in a domestic premises works.

Just an FYI it may be worth checking your own insurance policy to see if it has either employer liability insurance or mirror public liability. It you don’t have this then the cleaner could quite easily counter claim they are not protected in your home causing a far bigger headache. Most home insurance policies have this as standard to cover things like tradespeople but there are a couple where it is an added feature.

Hope that helps understand the process.

Original poster
slithytoveisascientist · 15/10/2023 18:29

That's really helpful just in general @Sbera , thank you. Will be checking my policy to ensure trades are covered

OP posts: