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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

How the fuck do people put up with all this shit? Friendship stuff

71 replies

Merryoldgoat · 07/10/2023 17:08

Not a TAAT but I’ve read three posts where someone’s friend has been disgustingly rude to them, has a history of shitty behaviour, and yet still seems to have OP worried about maintaining the friendship in some way.

How does this happen?

In my life:

Person acts like a cunt to me, I either tell them to fuck off and leave me alone, or just don’t see them again.

If they ask ‘what’s wrong’ in a faux naive way I tell them and we either sort it or don’t.

I have a fair number of friends but maybe only 4/5 good friends I’m in touch with weekly. Literally none of us would do this.

I’ve had a few in the past who can be twats but I shut it down fast and we’re done.

I literally cannot imagine someone shouting at me in a group and not retaliating in kind and never talking to them again.

Mad.

OP posts:
Mumtobabyhavoc · 08/10/2023 00:48

@Merryoldgoat you must've read the hobby group whatsapp thread! 😱
Bonkers!

2021x · 08/10/2023 01:18

Yeah for me it was a self esteem issue i.e. if I am not friends with them, then I noone will like me.

My parents have poor boundaires management with their friends, so a lot of this behaviour is learned.

Also I have in the past called people out for their bad behaviour towards me and then have been told I was in the wrong by others- or it was difficult to other people as we were in a group of friends, making me feel like I was the problem because "I just couldn't move on from it".

It Took me time, distance and a lot of effort (talking therapy) to build a spine and understand that certain behaviours e.g. consistently being late, answering phone calls in the middle of discussions are just disrespectful and to make choices about whether I put up or not.

Not everyone has this opportunity to sit back and re-evaluate their life, and in the short-term its just easier to keep the peace.

RandyAndTheRainbows · 08/10/2023 01:34

For me I have put up with less than perfect friendships and toxic friendships for three main reasons

1/ low self worth

2/ fear of losing them altogether

3/ guilt. I was brought up to feel boundaries were selfish and wrong. I didn't see boundaries modelled on the family home, a lot of abuse was enabled, I grew up doubting my needs, not sure if I had them or if they were ok to have. I think because my parents were involved in helping a lot of very needy people and in contrast I didn't have as much legitimate needs because I was lucky to come from a good family. If I did express distress it was often laughed at, mocked or responded to with anger, gaslighting or denial.

I still struggle a bit with 3. I'm not a pushover. But I tend to set a boundary and then back track on it because I feel horribly guilty and like my needs are less than. Or I doubt my needs are real? I feel like a big fat fake. A fraud.

Plonkandplonkers · 08/10/2023 01:39

I know friendships and romantic relationships are not the same, but don't people stay in unpleasant friendships for largely the same reasons they stay in abusive relationships?

RandyAndTheRainbows · 08/10/2023 01:52

Plonkandplonkers · 08/10/2023 01:39

I know friendships and romantic relationships are not the same, but don't people stay in unpleasant friendships for largely the same reasons they stay in abusive relationships?

You may be onto something there.

Disturbia81 · 08/10/2023 01:52

Same! It means I only have good vibes people in my life. The minute someone makes trouble I'm gone. Makes life much less stressful!

Yellowdaysaregood · 08/10/2023 01:59

I do that, but I'm not neurotypical, I don't have any friends because I'm not able to give and take, seeing things in black and white is not good

Ramalangadingdong · 08/10/2023 02:15

Iknowthis1 · 07/10/2023 23:47

Not everyone is as strong as you.

This!

HoneycrispApple · 08/10/2023 02:38

I have really low self esteem. I am terrified of confrontation. I think that’s why I’ve put up with it in the past but now trying to change things

Mothership4two · 08/10/2023 02:38

I'm quite often surprised on MN when the someone lists a "friends" truly awful behaviour towards them and asks for advice about what to say because they don't want to rock the boat or have them kick off. They seem blind to the inequality in respect they show to each other.

However, saying that, when I was younger (teens-20s) my best friend used to tell me that I was far too loyal to some people. I would give close friends 2nd and 3rd chances that I wouldn't have given to other friends. I don't think it was to do with self esteem, more that I felt that you forgive friends and move on. I have become less forgiving and will/have cut people out of my life even the close ones. It has to be something pretty unforgivable though.

QOD · 08/10/2023 03:28

Op I’ve had counselling about this
i find it very hard to let people go as I have abandonment issues going back to my childhood
i make so many excuses for me 😩

HettyWainty · 08/10/2023 05:35

Why do so many posters seem to be shocked that not everyone is exactly the same as them?

anareen · 08/10/2023 05:48

I think a lot of it has to do with lack of boundaries.

Tlolljs · 08/10/2023 06:06

You really shouldn’t regret sticking up for your dd though @Stepbystepfan

Darkdiamond · 08/10/2023 06:53

I had an incredibly toxic friend that I actually lived with in uni 20 years ago. Looking back, it was almost like a coercive control/domestic abuse situation. I'd been friends with her since I was 15. I hadn't been very cool or popular and had very low self esteem. We became friends and eventually she tried to own me.

I was constantly walking on eggshells. She had complete meltdowns over everything, especially if she thought I was leaving her out. Mood swings, silent treatment, rude comments, shouting at me. If she was in a bad mood, she would just swear at me. I remember asking a question like 'what time are we going out at tomorrow night'? She answered 'shut the f**k up or I'll smash your head in'. I just sat there, reeling. This was normal.

So many weird things would happen that looking back, i think she was responsible for. She would go through my wardrobe and just wear my clothes without asking. She would go my phone in the days before passcodes. Letters from my then boyfriend would go missing from my drawer. She did everything to isolate me from everyone else in my life. If she had any positive qualities, they were dwarfed by her manipulative, possessive and territorial nature. I started to actually hate her and started to actually wish she was dead.

Exactly 20 years ago, it came to a head when I confronted her about how she had told people very personal information about me. I moved out. I told her I never wanted to speak to her again and I never did. I actually cannot begin to describe the sense of freedom and liberation I experienced without her in my life! We have no links to eachother at all and share no mutual friends, as they were all happy to dump her too. We all absolutely despised her by the end.

20 years later, I still dream about her when I'm stressed, and the dream is always that she wants to be friends again and I let her back in my life. I always wake up with the most enormous sense of relief and freedom that she is gone! Sometimes I still get that shuddery, shivery feeling when I think about what it would be like to have someone in my life like that again.

About 10 years later, I moved to a different country and had been living there for a few years. She popped back into my head and I kept thinking about her, as I had this horrible sense that she was near me! I couldn't shake it off. I looked her up on social media and she had put a post up the previous week that she had also just moved to an hour awat from where I was now living. I still can't explain it but I knew she was close! Luckily, I moved abroad to a third country shortly afterwards, and to my knowledge, she hasn't moved here!

Basically, if my alarm bells go off, that person is cut out. My friends are all lovely, and if they aren't, they're not my friends any more.

Sorry for the essay. I never talk about this period of my life and can't believe how cathartic it was to write it down. The whole thing was actually traumatic for me and it took me a while to heal from her damage. I learned a lot though: your life is precious. Closely guard who you let into it.

xigris · 08/10/2023 07:11

I had a friend like this for years. She could be horrific but she could also be great fun and brilliant company. She’d had tricky childhood and also had some other issues so I guess that’s what kept me around so long.

Then one day she went too far - screaming and yelling. Utterly abusive. In front of my DC. So that was that. I told her a good few home truths and I have never, and will never, speak to her again. She’s tried to get in touch several times but I’ve blocked her.

Interestingly none of my other friends or my family liked her much……..

whichwayiwonder · 08/10/2023 07:14

Stepbystepfan · 07/10/2023 23:41

I am a nice person but introverted and quiet. I fucked off a group of friends last year because one of their daughters was bullying my daughter and she believed her daughter wasn’t. They all abandoned me. They were my best friends. Now I’m lonely and regret it.

You put your daughter and morals first. Don't regret doing this, you'll find more friends in time.

Darkdiamond · 08/10/2023 07:15

xigris · 08/10/2023 07:11

I had a friend like this for years. She could be horrific but she could also be great fun and brilliant company. She’d had tricky childhood and also had some other issues so I guess that’s what kept me around so long.

Then one day she went too far - screaming and yelling. Utterly abusive. In front of my DC. So that was that. I told her a good few home truths and I have never, and will never, speak to her again. She’s tried to get in touch several times but I’ve blocked her.

Interestingly none of my other friends or my family liked her much……..

Actually, my friend was really good fun too. We had so many hilarious nights out and so many in-jokes. My parents actually liked her as she came across as being so innocent, with a baby voice and all the nice manners. Our friends who knew her all thought she was completely deranged and dangerous by the end.

I'm glad that you got shot of your toxic friend when she crossed the line!

MorrisWallpaper · 08/10/2023 07:18

A lot of Mners are either friendless or struggle with friendships, and there seems to be a significant proportion who use ‘friend’ to mean ‘someone I don’t like very much and who doesn’t behave well to me’. Which then leads some of the friendless Mners to pride themselves on not having any friends and being contented with ‘just our little family’, because ‘friends are too much drama’.

Deathraystare · 08/10/2023 07:19

I have a friend who can be a problem but I am older and less tolerant of her behaviour. I don't see her that often for that very reason and would certainly never go on holiday with her again. I kept in touch because her son is my Godson. He had many problems with her, growing up but now he is older, in his own home and she knows not to step out of line with him anymore.

Underneath all her bluff is a very insecure person. However I know she is like that with everyone so it is not personal. On her birthday we went out with some of her friends and she layed into one of them. When someone shouts at you, you tend to be quiet right? Then she asked the poor woman why she was so quiet, what was wrong with her!

Whenever we went anywhere (including on holiday) there would be an 'edge' to her and she would either mimic my voice in a silly way (no she is not 4 years old but in her 70's!!!) or just snipe the whole time.

Funnily enough when she went on holiday with other people, 'they' were the problem!!!!

Joeylove88 · 08/10/2023 07:21

When I was in school I had friends who were awful but I just put up with it for the sake of not rocking the boat even though i look back and think wtf was i doing. In my 20s I was in a close group of friends who all knew eachother from school and one of them always used to enjoy making snide little comments but again I let it go for the sake of the group and eventuallywe all fell out with her anyway. I now have a very low tolerance for even friends who are flaky or blow hot and cold. Iv finally realised that it's just not worth having people in my life who aren't being completely authentic so I have either ditched friends or keep them well at arms length, that said I would never tolerate anyone being so blatantly horrible to me they would be gone in a second.

teenysaladandsniffofarose · 08/10/2023 07:37

You have to remember a lot of those threads are made up, so although there are some shitty friends out there, mumsnet isn't the best place to get an idea of how many of them exist.

SurprisedWithAHorse · 08/10/2023 07:42

A lot of people pleasers don't realise how unlikeable it makes them, which is funny since being disliked - even by someone they can't stand - is exactly what they fear.

They think it's a kind of "to a fault" virtue but it isn't. It's just insincerity masquerading as niceness. It's clear in many of these cases that the OP hasn't liked this person for a long time and yet thinks it's somehow nice of them to maintain a "friendship" in which they actually can't wait to slag this person off if they think there'll be no consequences.

SurprisedWithAHorse · 08/10/2023 07:44

MorrisWallpaper · 08/10/2023 07:18

A lot of Mners are either friendless or struggle with friendships, and there seems to be a significant proportion who use ‘friend’ to mean ‘someone I don’t like very much and who doesn’t behave well to me’. Which then leads some of the friendless Mners to pride themselves on not having any friends and being contented with ‘just our little family’, because ‘friends are too much drama’.

Yes. Well put.

Lentilweaver · 08/10/2023 07:45

MorrisWallpaper · 08/10/2023 07:18

A lot of Mners are either friendless or struggle with friendships, and there seems to be a significant proportion who use ‘friend’ to mean ‘someone I don’t like very much and who doesn’t behave well to me’. Which then leads some of the friendless Mners to pride themselves on not having any friends and being contented with ‘just our little family’, because ‘friends are too much drama’.

Totally agree. There is no drama in any of my friendships any more.