20 days annual leave is Dickensian

[Palacelife]

Most firms now start on 25. I think 20 just smacks of a mean firm and not a place you want to be. AIBU?

When I was a graduate in NZ it was 15 days plus about 5 national holidays. We had to take 10 days over Christmas as the firm shut down (common in most professional services). So I had the grand sum of 5 days for the rest of the year plus a few long weekends.

when I started work in uk I had a talking to from HR about why I wasn’t getting through my 30 day plus bank hols allowance. I didn’t know what to do with myself! Now I have DC I don’t have the same issue.

but to answer your OP, I don’t think 20 days is Dickensian, if it is in addition to bank holidays.

I have about 16 not including bank holidays. So 16 that I am free to do what I want with. The rest are bank holidays and Xmas.

Completely agree. My husband has worked for many small family run businesses (manufacturing/joinery trade) and until recently has only ever had the minimum 20+8 days. Plus a requirement to take a handful of them in the Christmas period when they shut down. Zero working from home too, of course. Makes it difficult to plan and take holiday together, when we finally manage it he's often too knackered to do much e.g. trips out.

Ask an American how much annual leave they get & you might see it in a different light.

I'm American. 29 days per year, plus 11 federal holidays and the day after Thanksgiving.

Reading what those of you say is the legal number of days, can someone tell me if a person started work on the 20th Feb this year, how many days holiday should they have had by now? Son has had Easter Monday and Tuesday, one bank holiday and 5 other days. Does anyone know if this is correct. He works through a recruitment agency. I think 20 days is too low.

I'm an American and you can ask me - I get 6 weeks of vacation time plus government holidays I also get four personal days a year and then we have additional bereavement leave sick leave short-term disability all that too. Even when I worked at a grocery store I got 3 weeks of vacation when I was in high school.

but you surely know that the average allowance is ten days?

(5.6 weeks min) 20 days + 8 Bank Holidays... so 28 days. When the government sets a minimum, some employers take the low bar as a target. Min AL... min wage... all goes hand in hand.

You and they - do not expect much in the way of staff retention, incentive or loyalty in those sorts of jobs. Leaving mine next year. Was a good stopgap, but if you want to keep people, you increase pay or improve working conditions or perks.

Great.

But again not the experience of the average American.

I know Americans on MN get annoyed at all the US bashing but in general Americans don't have it good when it comes to annual leave.

Ask an American how much annual leave they get & you might see it in a different light.

I get Twenty-five days of AL, eleven federal holidays, and four personal days. And my birthday, and unlimited sick leave.

It really isn't 'self-explanatory' for most of us.

I mean, why would an employer pay someone for working 5 days a month, when another employee works an average of 17 or 18 days a month ?

How would it work for all those of us who always have work to do, and don't have "a quiet month" ?
How does it work for customers / patients / clients / service users is the person dealing with their situation toddles off for 6 weeks because they don't feel like coming in ?
How does it work for the person that organises the rota or cover or schedules the theatre list, or manages the project if a crucial part of the team is taking 3 months off, or a crucial part of the work isn't done before the next part is due ?

It doesn't make any sense to me (and I'm a big fan of flexible working).

I know plenty of adults who’d exploit this 😂

They're not far off.

For a full time worker the legal minimum is 5.6 weeks which translates to 28 days. A lot, if not most, companies dictate you must use one day per bank holiday each year, leaving you 20 other days to take. If you work bank holidays you can just take your 28 days.

Yes it is. What do you think it is?

I cba to work it out properly but it'll be around 24 days he's entitled to for the full year (providing the holiday calendar runs in line with Jan-Dec), minus the 8 bank holidays in 2023 he would have 16 to take whenever he wanted (or when his contract specifies). I say 8 bank holidays because there are 9 this year minus Jan 1st as he wasn't employed at that point.

The caveat being I've assumed he gets 20+8 as his holiday allowance!

https://www.gov.uk/holiday-entitlement-rights

Under ‘statutory annual leave entitlement’. It’s 28 days including bank holidays for someone who works a 5 day week as stated.

I'm also intrigued by how unlimited annual leave works as I've never heard of it.

How does it work if everyone is a parent and everyone wants all school holidays off for example? Is it still based on first come first served with an alloted number of people allowed off at one time? And is there really no limit?

I’m sure I had 21 plus BH when I started work! What is the minimum?

https://www.gov.uk/holiday-entitlement-rights#:~:text=Almost%20all%20people%20classed%20as,leave%20entitlement%20or%20annual%20leave).

Employees market at the moment.
Working conditions, hours....if Company B is better than Company A , Company B will attract more potential staff.

I remember working with Civil Service staff who get days off for the Queen's Birthday and Maundy Thursday I think as well?

|I currently get 27 plus bh + birthday, next year i will qualify for 30 days plus bh and birthday.

What's the legal minimum?

In Dickensian times you'd have got Sunday off to go to church and that would be your lot.

I have zero paid annual leave.