holiday with dad

[KD1995]

Hi, am I being unreasonable?
so basically my youngests Nan booked a trip to Disney for them to take my youngest on their own (dad going too). This has really rubbed me up the wrong way. 1. It was booked with out any sort of conversation with me, to ask if it was ok it was done behind my back 2. He’s only 4 I have huge anxiety after loosing my mum so I wouldn’t feel comfortable with him being out of the country and I can’t get there if something happens 3. I’ve always wanted to go and take my boys and I think it’s not really fair on my oldest that he wouldn’t be able to have the same opportunity. So I orginally said no and it caused a massive argument I was made out to feel like a shit mum that I would let my child miss out. So In the end I tried to compromise And said what if I book the same trip but stay in a different hotel with my oldest so he gets to go and then just see if I could have my youngest for 2 days out of the trip and they have him the rest of the days but it wasn’t good enough. Dad is telling me that he’s going to take him regardless that I said no and that he has every right too. It’s getting really sour and I’m panicking. I thought you had to have permission from the other parent that the child can go out of the country with the other parent. I don’t know where I stand with it? Am I wrong here? (Sorry long post to read 😣) just need some advice/opinions- thanks

YANBU

Your made a very reasonable compromise suggestion, allowing for DS4s young age to be going to a busy resort for holiday and keeping things equal between him and his brother, and its been ignored.

On this basis I'm with the poster who said get in quick and apply for his passport yourself, so that you can stop him going.

Yeah we've never ever had to give permission for dsd to go on holiday with her mum, or vice versa

If the other parent objects, they can get a court order to stop the child from being taken abroad.

Obviously in most cases this isn’t necessary. However, OP is concerned about the impact of this trip on both her children and her XP doesn’t seem open to discussion.

@44PumpLane even though I’ve said I’ve wanted to take them, my main point was to him that I would be worried something would happen in a different country and I wouldn’t be able to just drop everything to get there if something did happen. I would be broken. my mums death was so unexpected that I look things so differently now. I was just trying to think of a way to please everyone. I wouldn’t want to be in their pockets, they would have their holiday and I would have mine with my oldest doing our thing! I wouldn’t even stay in the same hotel, Disneyland Paris is a massive place. I just wanted to make a memory with both my boys at Disneyland at least one/two days. I even suggested myself in the past that we would all go and I included his mum just it never fell through. I won’t even be able to take them a different time due to starting a new job. Then the year after my oldest be 11, I know you can never be too old for Disney but I’m not sure how old is to old for my oldest. My two boys have such different interests I find it a struggle to spilt my time.

Because your feelings are about you.

Yes, he should have more respect and discuss things with you. Yes he should be willing to listen to your worries and fears.

But they’re not reasons that your child should miss out. It’s not safety reasons. He’s not an unfit parent who gets drunk every night and loses your child. He’s not going to starve your child or do anything dangerous with him.

If he went to court for permission, which he can do, then none of the reasons you’ve given him would make a judge say no.

You can’t stop your son doing things because his dad is rude and pisses you off. Even if we may want to sometimes.

Would you want your ex gatecrashing your holiday? The OP's suggestion just isn't workable. It is unreasonable to expect her exes to miss out on doing things with their own children just because she chose to have kids with 2 men. The OP needs to treat her kids fairly, her exes don't.

@Scienceadvisory

The ex is clearly happy to go on holiday as a family if you read up thread.

And yes, while the child was young, I would.

@YetMoreNewBeginnings Sorry but I should be able to stick up for myself in these situations. That’s just allowing his dad to treat me like shit and get away with it just because we have a kid together. And if I do so I’m hindering my sons happiness 🤔 emotional abuse is a thing. my kid doesn’t miss out on anything because he has had a lot of opportunities with his dad despite how I feel because I do value my son having a relationship with his dad. You’re basing off a post, you don’t know anything behind closed doors. I’m allowed to think of my feelings too when I’ve had a lot of situations where I’ve been backed into a corner with abuse from them to get their own way. it wears me down. I would do anything to let my kids have happiness but I’ve gotten to a point where enough is enough. it makes it hard for me to make decisions as a mum as I’m always being disregarded! But I think we can just leave it there! your allowed your opinion, thanks for your input :)!

“2. He’s only 4 I have huge anxiety after loosing my mum so I wouldn’t feel comfortable with him being out of the country”

The way to manage that is therapy / medication / whatever focus on you. Not stopping him from doing something.

When you chose to have children with different fathers, you chose this possibility. That’s not a moral judgement on you, and of course when you chose to have the younger child you didn’t plan to split. But it’s so common to split, that it should have been in your decision making.

Mine went at 5 & 7 to Disney - and that was Florida! For 10 days. He had every right to take them, and they had a ball. They called me briefly 2x - too busy otherwise!

He’s old enough to be away without you, and your ex doesn’t have to include your other son in plans. That said - would he take both, without you, if you paid the extra?

I would plan a trip there with both later. Then older one knows he’s not missing out, and younger one can have the excitement of telling you what’s good when he gets back.

@KD1995 I just started using MN after a 6 year gap and am shocked at the lack of empathy on here. I think there is a lone parent part of MN where people may be more informed, though think I will be heading back to FB (where I recommend the "Bridging the Gap" group for helpful advice re manipulative partners/ex's)

“My two boys have such different interests I find it a struggle to spilt my time.”

Spend the time the youngest is away doing something that it completely geared towards the oldest’s interests.

@Scienceadvisory
Yes I wouldn’t give two hoots because we had talks of going but it never fell through. And if you read previously we all went away together earlier this year. yes I had two kids with two different dads but that’s irrelevant . my youngest family and his dad have just dropped my oldest out which isn’t fair when they did bother with him when I lost my mum. You can’t treat a kid a certain way and then just stop caring. My oldest son always says to me why does my youngest gets treated differently. Ok he needs to understand him and his brother have a different family. But my compromise of taking my oldest doesn’t affect my youngests dad! They still get time with him, I get time with my boy and then the boys can spend a day together too. Why wouldn’t they want it so they both can enjoy Disney together? They are brothers. I wouldn’t have another opportunity to take them and nor would his dad. So why can’t it work out for both of us. I won’t be following them everywhere, I won’t be attached to their hips. Disneyland Paris is a big place. I could bump into them I could not. I be doing my own thing with my oldest. 1/2 days wouldn’t hurt.

Your anxiety is not his problem
Your decision to have children by multiple fathers is not his problem

If he were to go to court for a specific unissued order he would almost certainly obtain it and you would not look good.

You need to understand that anything he provides for his child is separate to your eldest and you can not punish him for that

Then book a serperate independent holdiay. Do not infringe on his holiday time with his child

And they dropped him because you were no longer a couple. That understandable .

Couldn't have put this better.

Grow up @KD1995 and stop weaponising your children and interfering with your son's relationship with his Dad.

there really isn’t any empathy on here what so ever. I’m now getting judgy comments because I’ve had kids with two different dads. Lol it happens there’s worser scenarios. my oldest is not my youngest dads problem. But he did take him on at a point in my sons life and just dropped him. he is 10 years old his feelings are valid too . And if I want to take them into considering too because I’m his mother then I will. If I didn’t you all be saying different you can’t win! Lol me having two fathers is irrelevant 🙈 but apparently because I’ve made that choice I should lump it. I didn’t choose to have my relationships to break up for this kind of thing to happen. It is what it is. Im just a single mum trying to make both my boys happy while trying to keep everyone else happy and it just doesn’t work.

I absolutely get what you're saying OP and I would feel completely the same.
I think that you asking to go alone, albeit separately is a really good compromise. Going to Disney is a major thing, once on a life time for most. It's totally reasonable that you would want to join in and why you may have reservations and I think the ex and his family are just thinking of themselves.
Your child would be so much happier enjoying such a big occasion with you all.
Also 4.... it's so young! What if they need you?!
I 100% get it and agree with you!!!!

Your compromise was unreasonable. The 2 days of their holiday when you wanted to take your youngest… what are they supposed to do? Can’t see then riding It’s A Small World together! I mean, Paris is awesome - but The Louvre isn’t for everyone 🤷🏻‍♀️ Taking 2 days of their time was unlikely to work for them - especially if they plan to stay on site so they’d be paying DLP premium to be staying on a park for kids without a kid!

I think you’re over estimating the fun of being together with both boys too. They’re 4 and 10? Or 4 and 9? It’s not clear. So you’ve got one probably tall enough for everything- and might want to be at Marvel Studios anyway - and one who’ll just want to go on the tea cups whilst the older boy is bored. You can leave the older one beside a kiddy ride or bring him on - but you can’t do that with a 4yo. Which means the younger one dictates the trip.

Of course loads of single parents take a mix of ages and make it work… but it’s not necessarily ideal.

I have lots of empathy. For your Ex.
There is nothing wrong with having multiple father's for your children. But there is in the way you are handling it.

Yes because he wanted you. He was a condition of the relationship, yes? So No more relationship with you meant no more relationship required with him.
You can and should take your sons feelings into consideration. But you're trying to make it your Exs problem. And they just aren't. How far are you going to take this? Your son is going to get things and go on holidays his half brother is not. So how are you going to manage his expectations and subsequent disappointment. Because you won't be able to control your Ex for long if he's smart enough to involve the courts.

The two fathers is literally all its about.
A man wants to take his son on a wonderful holiday. But you're interfering because of a child he's not related to.

“I’m now getting judgy comments because I’ve had kids with two different dads.”

You’re not though. No-one is judging you. Some of us are saying that this is the reality you chose, and you need to work with that. And that includes a perfectly reasonable request from your youngest son’s father, to take him on holiday.

You’ve posted in AIBU, and you opening by asking if you are. So why post if you don’t want anyone to say yes actually - you are?

It would be lovely if you could coparent and include each other and both the boys in things. But for how long for, and to what extent? Especially with a 5/6 year age gap. It’s just not practical.

@Wibblywobblylikejelly
nothing to do with my oldest just being a part of my ex because it came with the relationship. If you read he came on holiday with us in July without being together. There wasn’t a problem then with it being all of us. I’m not making it my exs problem. But my son is still only a child, you’re all siding with an adult man’s feelings but judging me because I’m thinking of my child’s feelings? I don’t get the sense in that?

Me and my ex plan holidays and just tell each other no pre planning as such.
I’m the main parent but he takes them away for a week where as normal contact is only two days a fortnight.
tbf it’s never bothered me and sometimes dad will do firsts that you won’t be able to do now you’re separated but maybe do something with your eldest whilst they’re away.

I was about to say the same.

I might have got some details wrong, but I know of someone who went abroad with her daughter and it flagged up because she didn't have permission from the father or something.

Plus OP I was going to say well it wouldn't be possible in my exes case because I have the passport and if it wasn't for me he wouldn't be able to apply for the child's passport anyway so 🤷🏻‍♀️
But I do wonder if he took any photocopy of anything, but then he would still need the actual passport.

Because you're his child's mother.
That's great he gave it a go.
But he doesn't have to. He can just want him and his son.

And you can rehash that past all you want. The important thing is he doesn't want either of you there now. And that's OK.

Your son is a child.
Not his child though. So why are you trying to force him to think of him?

You don't get to take from your youngest to give to your eldest. That's not his Dad. What happens when he takes him on bigger and better holdiays? When are you going to accept youngest may have more than your eldest?

@Testina
I have said I’m very open to people not agreeing with me otherwise I wouldn’t have posted. But I think it’s uncalled for by the way people are handling the responses they are giving to me. You’re allowed your opinion, but doesn’t mean it should be done in a way to tear someone down. I feel like I’m having to defend myself to a bunch of strangers