Teen out of control

[Teencrisis]

Not really Aibu but want opinions on what to do. Ds is 16. I have been aware he has smoked weed for a while. I have talked to him constantly about county lines, damage to his developing brain etc etc. Nothing has worked. We can’t stop him going out but he lies about where is going and is become more aggressive .We have stopped giving him any money and he doesn’t have any income.Last night he came home and was clearly under the influence of something. I tried calmly talking to him about how worried I was. I asked him if he had eaten anything this evening as he went out before tea. He said he bought food but I asked him where he got money from. He said he had money in his bank account and showed me his online bank balance of £19. I asked him where that money had come from but he wouldn’t say. My mind is fearing all sorts of scenarios. I can’t get into bank details. I’m so worried and I’m not sure who to turn to. He was a lovely bright boy who comes from a loving family. Wwyd?

He was a lovely bright boy who comes from a loving family

Keep that in mind - while he's obviously still at risk, he should hopefully have an underlying strong sence of morals, looking after himself and respect from your past parenting of him.

He evidently smoked weed last night. When did he before that? Does he smoke daily? Weekly? How regularly? It's important in putting this in the context of how serious it is.

Obviously everyone wants to raise children with no flaws who make no poor choices - but we should all know that's unrealistic. Does he do anything else that concerns you? How's he doing at school? What are his friends like? Does he drink or risk take in other ways?

you mention aggression, that in itself wants tackling too. What have you said to him about this?

@Woush - thanks so much for replying. I think his habit is becoming at least a few times a week.
He has been at a good grammar school until now but his gcse grades were a little disappointing so will now be going to the local college next week instead.
He used to be so polite and caring but he is now rude, swears at me and if we question him he becomes unreasonable and aggressive. The money in his bank account is worrying me too

he is now rude, swears at me and if we question him he becomes unreasonable and aggressive.

There's entitlement in that behaviour. I assume you pull him up on it? Aggression to others in particular shouldn't be allowed to pass unchallenged.

Smoking weed is not unusual in the age group (I'm a DSL in a large secondary and also Mum to three teens). It's effectively the step up from vaping. That doesn't make it ok, but wanted to give you a context to realise its not the end of the world.

Cutting out him funding is definitely a good plan, but has to be balanced with the fact that teens this age ususlly need some cash for their social lives - very few who go out will have no money. He could well have sold something (clothing?) to get himself some money, so don't assume dealing.

He's of an age to have a part time job - how are you going to encourage positive behaviour when his money is his own?

If you're worried about county lines - are there any other red flags? Does he go missing, stay out overnight, associate with much older people, is found in a completely different geographical area?

It's possible that his mental health has taken a nosedive (due to GCSE run up, exams, results, not getting into sixth firm etc) and he's self medicating to make himself feel less "weak" as a young male. This may resolve itself as he settles into college. I would strongly encourage new friends. I'd also look for ways to fill him time and encourage self esteem - usually done via sport, volunteering and work - either all three or some combination of.

Fully understand your concerns & worry, one tiny bit of insight from experience is that when the person is under the influence of something it is not the time to bring up your concerns re their behaviour or expect to have any meaningful conversation. Wait until they are sober.

I went through a similar thing. It's hard and I sympathise.

Conversations under the influence are pointless.

I said that what he did outside the house was up to him, but I wasn't condoning drug taking etc., and if he ended up in police cells or a hospital trolley, then don't expect me to drop everything and come running.

But I made it clear that what he did indoors was my concern, and I expected a basic level of respect and courtesy. And, if I found anything in his room/pockets that I couldn't account for, it was being binned or flushed.

He was worst from around 14 - 16. It was getting better about 16 onwards. So maybe if you can stick with it, he might settle once in college etc.

Thanks so much for the replies. It’s good to know that his behaviour is not so abnormal but hope he will improve with a fresh start. He is going out tonight but I’m worrying about what he will get up to already but I feel powerless as he won’t say where etc. How does everyone else cope ?

He should be telling you where he is going (and agreed time to be home). You're his parent, it's your job to keep him safe and this is part of it.

I'd be concerned that you got to the stage where he doesnt think it normal to let you know where he is.

Is he just refusing to tell you when you ask? What are you doing when this happens?

@Woush the conversations would be …
ds I’m going out
me ok where are you going please
ds just out
me well I need to know and also agree a time back please
ds right I’m going now … be back at 8.

He will then be 2 hours later but still refuse to say where he is or he will lie and I will check out his story.

I just don’t know how to make him see he is being unreasonable. I’ve tried saying I won’t do anything for him but it just makes him more unpleasant to be around and he becomes isolated from the rest of us.

When he is out I’m so anxious and have been known to drive around his usual hanging places to see if I can see him. It’s a really hard place to be right now

There's a lot to unpick there. Much of it is to do with if his behaviour is normal (ish) for age and you are struggling to allow him that increasing independence. Or if he's genuinely involved in crime and dangerous behaviour. I don't know if you OP, are self aware enough to be able to know. It's hard to judge when you're in the middle of this. What's your instinct OP?

For what it's worth OP, if we go with the fact that he's a generally decent boy, intelligent, knows how to ask and accept help - then I suspect the former of the above options, rather than the latter.

What then needs unpicking about why he lies or won't tell you where he is. It could be to do with your reaction.

We use Life360 with my 17yo DS (and DS13 and DD18). It's family tracking - you all know where everyone is all the time. I have the agreement with older teens that I won't pass comment on where they are, as long as they keep it on.

Thanks for your wise words @Woush . They make a lot of sense. I have always been a bit overprotective I guess and I was always a very sensible teenager. We did have 360 for a while and it worked brilliantly as I could let him be as I could see he was safe. The rest of our family still use it and my daughter is happy to use it. He then stated to come home stoned. I would be cross and try questioning him. He then became more secretive and would turn off his permission for 360. He has been at his friends house tonight … we dropped him off and have just picked him up. He is stoned again. Do I just let this go. It feels wrong to just ignore it.

That explains why he's refusing to tell you where he's going/been. To your son, it's perfectly reasonable and logical to not tell you - because its easier for him to face your wrath for secrecy than your wrath of "what you doing at so-and-so's house". He gets your wrath either way, just lesser of two evils.

The way youth workers tackle this is to build a trusting and respectful relationship. Then try to educate teens out of drug use and peer pressure. Rather than authoritarian approaches. That said, aspects you can and do control need strict boundaries - like your behaviour in your home, treatment of family members etc. But to assert those boundaries he needs to have some respect for you and care about your opinions.

If he doesn't like you, knows you don't like him, it's going to be difficult to get him to respect you enough to do things you ask. As they get older "because I said so" often doesn't cut it. Personally, I'd work on bonding with him, building a relationship and trust.

A good way to start might be life360 - I'll not pass comment on where you are as long as you have it on so I know you're safe. Then stick to your word. So it means your side of the agreement is not having a go at him when he's said his mates.

Then build some rules around weed - for example it can never be in your house and explain why (educational moment) - the legal side, safety around children, animals etc, social aspects (smell when guests here), moral aspects. Don't lecture - just depart facts.

Also - make an effort to take an interest in his changing lifestyle - what's he into? Who are his new mates? Would they come to your house? Offer a trip out with new mate(s), or pizza and chill night with them, teen only BBQ, take to football match, or whatever he's into. I'm aware some of those sound twee, but he will be into something, so engage him in it and embrace (metaphorically) this new mate instead of demonising him. He might be a decent boy just like yours.

With the weed - bottom line is, if he wants to do it you won't stop him. He will likely experiment and grow out of it. Don't let this battle destroy your relationship with your son - because that could be the spiral that keeps him smoking and worse. Instead use a positive relationship to keep chipping away and reminding him all the negatives so he can eventually make his own choice to stop.

don't give false reassurances, there is no limit to the damage weed can do, educationally, mentally, and in terms of criminal involvement. I am sure you know that. And if you are DSL you know that on the other end of the supply there are child slaves working without pay, medical care, or proper nutrition or education - and possibly officially "On role" at your school

And yes, it is unusual. Most teens don't do this

sorry @Teencrisis , not much help to you I know, but could not let such an ignorant and blase post pass unchallenged.

Are you prepared to move area? If you think he is dealing, then this is something that needs to be offered and discussed with him, It is not as easy as he decides not to continue then is allowed to stop

There are good posts here, with good advice, particularly from @Woush and @Createausername1970 . We are going through some of it too, and I would echo everything they have said, especially denying funds. You have to keep going unfortunately, whilst constantly re-inforcing the boundaries calmly, especially around the aggression, and offering food he likes etc. and trying to support him. I would hope that if he is going to a different place to study shortly, he will find a new friendship group where it might not be such a thing. If so, encourage enthusiastically. If he had been staying in school you could have a word with them, they are used to this and do provide help. Other people talking to him that are not his parents can make a difference. It is not a silver bullet, but an outsider saying stuff can make a difference. Although with just £19 in his bank account, I would not automatically assume he is dealing, or that he is doing harder drugs, some of them do a very low level of dealing, which means they buy some, then they offer a joint to friends for payment. A bit like getting some cigs from abroad and selling them at a profit. Yes, it is still, technically dealing and I understand how awful that is, but £19 is not screaming Class A drug dealer here. Unfortunately, you will soon know enough if he is trying to do a bigger thing as he will crying for money to pay someone off. Finally, it's awful, but I would not leave money or valuables in easy access. I've also got cameras in my house. Whereas some would advocate retracting all support and love (and believe me I have considered it), where does it actually leave you ? You cannot actually throw them out, they cannot live on their own, and you would be worried witless. I feel for you, it's hard. xxx

There are multiple issues here, but if you think there is a chance he could be involved in county lines I would be taking that concern outside the family, you can't deal with that alone.

I always thought as babies it was a hard time looking after them ..I used to think once they grow older it will get easier...... The heck it does it only gets worse 😕 I hope things get better soon 🙏

Obviously, as his parent, you are doing the right thing, but at the same time, it's going to make him more determined and rebel.

Explain your concerns again, then let him know he is old enough to make his own choices and old enough to deal with the consequences. Let him make the mistakes (to a point, obviously) and let him learn from them.

Kids this age smoke weed and get drunk. He needs to be sensible about it. He'll grow out of it. I know it's not nice when it's your own child but it is what teenagers do unfortunately

Op like you it's the money I would be worried about.
Have you spoken about country line, does he kmow about it.

Woush speaks a lot of sense. I'm a behaviour support worker.

You have to pick your battles and take one step at a time.

Prioritise your necessities.

Would you rather he stopped smoking weed or rather know where he is and what time he'll be home?

It's very obvious you need to stop the smoking for all sorts of reasons but right now he'll see that as you controlling him as well as controlling who he can and can't go with. When he's 16 and getting to the age of wanting to be independent and have an identity separate to being attached to his parents.

I agree start with life360 rule.

I'd tell ds that your main concern is wanting to know he's safe because you love him. You do t want to stop his allowance. So agree if he keeps 360 logged in you will reinstate his pocket money.

Say to him that it's clear he's losing respect for you and you want to earn that respect back but it works both ways and you will respect his independence if he earns back your trust.

One of the biggest things I teach when I train staff on behaviour management is connection before correction.

You need to build back up that connection and build back the trusting and loving relationship you had but be mindful of the fact it'll be a different type of relationship as he's now a young adult and will be an actual adult in the next 2 years.

Also consider that if he didn't do as well as he expected in his GCSEs it may have affected his self esteem - he may go to college and be the model student as he doesn't want that feeling again in 2 years time. Or he may not put in the effort because he doesn't think it's worth it because he can't achieve what he wants - or worse - what he's feels as a weight of expectation on him.

That's where all the building the bridges and building up a connection will help because it'll build up his self esteem.

Behaviour is a form of communication so you just need to figure out what he's communicating. And that won't happen in the way that natural for parents to think it'll happen - constant questioning. It'll happen by allowing him to know that whatever he comes to you and says that you'll support him and help.

I don't agree weed is very common in this age group (ime anyway) but it's not uncommon for this to be the age they start experimenting if they are going to.

Don't cut love and support. I went through this, as did others I know. Mostly it's a phase and if you have stayed a consistent and supportive parent, then it makes it easier when they come out the other side.

Being supportive doesn't mean approving or accepting behaviours, to me it means acknowledging that it's happening, being very clear about the negatives and that fact that this is a choice he is making - but also making it clear that I still love him and I am concerned about his welfare and that if he has found himself in a situation he can't extract himself from - peer pressure etc., then please tell me as I will be happy to help him. This chat was usually accompanied by a hot chocolate.

In my own DS's case it was peer pressure and low self-esteem on his part and just wanting to fit in, mixed with not feeling ready to grow up.

We are now 5 years later, he is 21 has been diagnosed with autism and is on a waiting list for an ASD assessment. We have had a couple of rocky patches, but he knows he can confide in me if he has done something stupid and I will be practical rather than cross.

He says the fact that I stuck by him when he was being an arse means a lot to him.

A fresh start? You sound deluded, what makes you think it will get any better when he starts college. That will just give him more freedom, then this will become much worse. You say you are overprotective, you sound wet and powerless, but you do have choices, you just haven't exercised them. Be firm. How does he behave to his dad? My 2 wouldn't dare speak to me in such a fashion because they know Dh wouldn't tolerate it.

So you use DH not yourself as the authority?
Some of us don't have a good Dad in their lives to aid that.

Woush speaks a lot of sense. I didn't realise how many teens do weed until recently I have had my eyes opened. It's a lot more than I ever imagined.

You can't call parents wet unless you havr lived it. It's great saying you would so this and that but honestly with mental health it is down to a lot of luck. Luck you will never realise you had.

@Oblomov23 . I welcome any advice. So could you tell me a little about your family and how you would deal with my situation. I don’t need to say to my kids wait until your dad gets home. My husband is away a lot for work and so a lot of the time he is 1000 of miles away. My kids until now have always responded to me and have always behaved .

No. Sorry. Maybe I didn't explain that very well. I hold my own, say something if they ever talk to me disrespectfully. But I also use Dh aswell. If he does hear it, or I later tell him, just a look from him, or a : 'do you really think that's an appropriate way to speak to your mum' resolves a lot.

Okay, so sorry, so for both of you , last 2 posters, the dad trick doesn't work very well. In which case you need an alternative technique.

He's got problems. He's lost his way a bit, is very bright, but not utilising that, hanging out with the wrong people, a bit of lack of self-worth. liking weed instead of realising all the good stuff that he's got! plus is the addiction side of it, smoking weed is fine it's easy but before long it becomes a problem.

Have you talked to him calmly about instigating more ground rules - saying that actually he won't be able to go out at all! unless he's done the basics i.e. his school work, and getting good grades, and that going out is a privilege that you only get if you are nice at home, doing your home jobs (eg emptying dishwasher), doing all the basics. Eg getting decent grades at school.

Plus he's being aggressive to you. That's just not allowed. Have you tried sitting him down and saying to him - this behaviour simply not acceptable and we won't tolerate it in or you will have to consider leaving if it carries on. I may have to look at you getting a job, finding your own flat.

What does he want to do? Does he need good A-levels? does he want to go onto university? or a course. That should be his first priority. what does he want to do? how he's going to get there?

whilst trying to claw back some of the respect, that you deserve from him. and even if he has got problems, there's still a certain level of respect of how he must talk to you even when there are problems and issues. No rudeness or aggression.

That kind of thing?

That is a thing, isn't it? the other children. Do you have dc3 op? Is he ds1?

Because in the past, years ago, when I had trouble with DS1, Dh and I talked about how we couldn't let this happen because we couldn't let his behaviour continue and us condone it because if DS2 saw it gives the wrong impression to him (ds2) that this kind of behaviour is ok.