So is formula milk UPF?

[bumgripes]

It is, right? I mean, the ingredients list certainly is. And it’s listed on the BBC website as an UPF.

Going to be interested to see if this influences the BF/FF debate now that it looks like awareness of UPF is about to skyrocket. Does it even matter when they’re only on it for about a year? Does that fact that it’s an UPF actually add any info to the pre-existing evidence on BF/FF?

It’s good this information is getting out there. If you can’t then fair enough, but if you can but choose not to you should know the risks.

There is a lot of information comparing breastmilk and formula. This is the information that needs to be out there.

The real danger of labelling formula as a 'UPF' is if anyone is misguided or even coerced into feeding their child with something other than breast milk or formula that may not be a 'UPF' but which is not nutritionally appropriate for a human baby.

My daughter was born with a cleft palate. I had to formula feed as she couldn't suck or latch. A thread like this would have made me feel even worse than I did already at not being able to breast feed despite it not being my fault.

And yes, I did try to pump milk but it is no substitute for a latching baby, and my supply dwindled to nothing.

Some women truly have no choice in the matter.

All this is is another stick to beat new mothers with.

We had this thread last week. It was goady then and it's goady now.

Yes! I think so too.

But why is it ok for mothers who can't, but not okay for mothers who don't want to?

Surely if it's harmful then you shouldn't be making that distinction and getting a network of wet nurses going to feed those babies? 🤨

Not bothering to come back and take part in the debate you have started eh OP?

I echo PP that you've made this post to beat mothers with who can't or don't want to BF.

Surely this doesn't come as a surprise to anybody...I don't understand the posts saying things like if I'd read this 3 months ago I would've been devastated...surely you didn't think formula was a natural product?

If there are people out there who don't understand what formula is then better labelling might help an informed decision?

It is in the same way as those nutrient dense drinks for the elderly and very sick are UPF. It is also beneficial and necessary. It is not junk food.🙄

I don't know why women want to put other women down for using formula.

It's not an informed decision for many women it's a necessity - although I suppose we could take the natural route and let babies starve.

I'm sure sweeping generalisations like this won't add to the anxiety of new mums who struggle to breastfeed at all 🙄

Most mums that formula feed do so because they don’t want to breastfeed. Not because they can’t.

I think that's a simplification. Not wanting to breastfeed can come in many forms and can be influenced by many outside sources. I didn't want to breastfeed because of how it affected my mood. With both dc, my milk coming in brought despair and suicidal thoughts. I struggled on for 4 months with both but I loathed every single second of it. I'd sit there feeding with tears pouring down my face. With dc2 in particular it was horrendous as I was on this euphoric wave until day 3 and then emotionally I tanked until my milk dried up months later.

Even ignoring the above, I had to breastfeed upstairs in my parents house (and in my own if they visited) because of their attitudes to breastfeeding.

Then there is the lack of tangible support. Dc2 had an awful latch. I went to breastfeeding groups and asked for help. Skin to skin...keep trying they said until one woman whispered "nipple shields" in my ear before following up with "don't tell anyone I told you". I wouldn't have made it to 4 months without them. When my cousin came to me for advice re breastfeeding and described her latch issues, I suggested she try them too...3 months later she's happily feeding without them but credits them with getting her this far. She too went to a breastfeeding group but she got the same advice I did.

But by all means, let's pretend we're living in a country where there's bags of well-informed, bespoke support for all women struggling to breastfeed, and where women whose babies are low birthweight (as mine was) are not pushed from the outset by midwives and health visitors to supplement with formula. And that the only reason some women don't persevere with breastfeeding is that they don't care enough about their babies to do it.

Nobody is suggesting you do that though are they

As it's a necessity there's no need to feel anything negative about it.

It is an ultra processed food and for that reason it shouldn’t be promoted. It’s wrong that it is the default in this country and hopefully more people will think about it like that.

It’s vital for babies in some cases where breastmilk isn’t possible but I can’t understand anyone actively choosing to feed it. I would have only used formula if I had no other option and fortunately I had good breastfeeding support so it wasn’t needed.

Same here. I was determined to breastfeed and thank fully even with tongue tie I managed to do it. Was painful but was giving in. I would only use formula as the last resort. But only if I couldn't express.

Wasn't*

Well if it makes our government take infant feeding more seriously than it can only be a good thing.

More money for maternity and paternity, more time off for fathers, more support and education in hospitals for learning to breastfeed and what to expect, more basic training for midwives and health visitors, understanding of normal biological sleep and feeding needs, cultural changes of what we can expect from our babies in terms of feeding and sleep. Also more education on co-sleeping because fuck me, you're just setting most women up to fail telling them to breastfeed but not to co-sleep.

If it changes any of those things then marvellous, if it makes some poor new mother trying her best feel like shit then it's a pretty pointless fact tbh.

We all know breastmilk is far superior to an engineered powdered milk made in a factory, and we all know that it does matter, which is why it's an emotive subject but we need to stop pointing the finger at women and start pointing it at all these men in suits with money and power.

Don't even get me started on that moron from Iceland

So what if it is? i don't understand what the alternative would be? The baby starves?!

Agree with others, this is a goady thread and the faux-naivety is transparent.

OP - probably worth looking inward and reflecting on your need to feel superior at the expense of others.

This

Imagine your life being that dull that the only way you can get a kick is to feel superior because you breastfed. I breastfed for a while with both mine but also used formula and I am no more proud above them eating from my breast than from a tub! I couldn't give a shit. OP if this was your intention then get a bloody life. You breastfed, woohoo yay, go you! When your kid is an adult it will not matter one jot and they will not give a flying fuck in which way you fed them and neither will anyone else. IF YOU do still care about it by then, then get a life x5

The whole UPF thing makes little sense to me. Whether something qualifies seems to depend on how educated you are about food ingredients and how experimental you are in your kitchen — they say things like "oh, it's when something's got scary industrial chemical ingredients you don't recognise and wouldn't use in your kitchen at home".

I would recognise E300, know that it's ascorbic acid, know that that's another name for vitamin c, and be familiar with its use as a bread improver (among other things) that I used to have a pot of in my kitchen cupboard, next to the sodium bicarbonate and the potassium bitartrate. So it's no more UPF from my perspective than a cake that's got a little cream of tartar in it, or a scone with some bicarb. But to someone else with different experiences, it's a UPF

There are, I have noticed, a small but instantly recognisable number of posters who insert themselves into every formula feeding or birth trauma thread, desperate to share their wonderful experience of EBF/homebirth/whatever under the guise of ‘just being interested’ or ‘helping other women by sharing my story’.

It’s very clear they’re just trying to give other mums a sly kick while lapping up the envy and attention they feel they deserve. It’s really mean spirited and completely blatant.