To want a therapist with a PhD

[GalGadont]

It’s always been my understanding that you see a therapist or counsellor, not a psychiatrist or psychologist, for stuff like mild depression (rather than severe problems). However I find some counsellors, to be really frank, not that bright, and it’s not really clear to me how rigorous or thorough their training is. WIBU to want to see someone with the fullest qualifications (privately, I obviously wouldn’t expect an NHS referral)? Do people do this? How do you find someone?

Not meaning to offend anyone: I’m sure there are good counsellors, but I’ve felt like there’s something missing in my experience so far. If I’m having to pay anyway, it feels like I might as well be paying for someone with the most thorough grounding and knowledge.

I think it entirely depends on what therapy you are hoping for.

I think "wanting a doctorate" is a bit "only a special person can understand me", surely you look at the qualifications of the person in the thing you want to see them for?

@Daphnis156 I enjoyed the comment

Are either of you offering to pay for my sessions? Thanks! In that case I’ll take your opinions on board.

Assuming it’s my money I’m spending, I’ll look for the qualifications I want.

A doctorate in psychology is the qualification of the person in the thing I want to see them for.

Assume you also think that wanting a doctor to have a medical degree is a bit ‘only a special person can understand me’.

As the responses to this thread have amply illustrated, some people are quite a bit more understanding and intelligent than others.

It's not really about that thought ita qbout the click
You are going to tell a stranger everything about you qnd they are going to question and challenge you in stuff in your life.
They could have 10 fancy qualifications or 1 diploma and that might be the one you.click with. Dont write someone off cos they aren't super educated they.mihht the one for you

Or cos they can't type on their phone🤣

I highly recommend seeking out a "counselling psychologist".

It's true that a qualification doesn't make someone good with people, or that you'll necessarily click with them (and you can't know that before 3rd session in my experience). What it does is demonstrate a dedication and striving for excellence. That's a good basis to start from when you're looking to become vulnerable through the disclosure of deeply personal information.

Not only are they well trained, but that training has involved significant supervision. Supervision is where the therapist discusses issues relating to their caseload with a more highly trained therapist who has studied supervision. It's supportive, challenging and educational. It's not therapy though, if they need that they have to go to someone else.

It's absolutely true that there are lots of people out there who are good. But there are also people really not. And figuring out who they are can be painful, never mind expensive. A counselling psychologist at least has a very, very solid basis.

Crucially, what makes a good therapist is someone who knows what they don't know. There are faaar to many people with some type of "counsellor" label out there who simply don't know what they don't know and are actively dangerous because of it. The deeper and broader someone's background is, the more likely they are to recognise their boundaries, especially if they have experience working in a healthcare setting. I've come across far to many people who say they treat trauma who shouldn't be allowed near anybody with a traumatic history, but they did a weekend/online course in EMDR or some kind of "reprocessing" and think they're qualified. The difference between them and someone who specialises in it who has a psychology doctorate behind them is that the latter know what to do if goes wrong (people can have many different responses in trauma work) - and not because they're winging it. And even if they were to be winging it, they're doing that with a lot more info!

I think it should be criminal to work with trauma in particular, when you don't have significant practical training and supervision at a postgraduate level in it.

I think you need to look for qualifications, experience and soft skills/ click with them, given therapy isn't usually a quick fix and can be a big investment.

It doesn't help that the system is a minefield - lots of titles aren't protected, including psychologist. anyone can call themselves one, so you need to check people out. A properly qualified clinical or counselling Psychologist should be registered as such with the HCPC.

Good luck. Don't be afriad to shop around and ask the person you see exactly what their experience is. It's hard to do when you're feeling vulnerable but a good therapist will also want to ensure they are a good fit for you.

Psychiatrist, like any medical consultant, has to have a medical degree, and then further specialist training. A consultant psychiatrist is probably going to be the most qualified professional you can see, and you can see them privately. A clinical psychologist generally has to have a first class degree, and then further study, again generally at PhD or doctorate level.
Psychotherapist can be any Tom, Dick or Harry walking off the street and deciding to call themself a psychotherapist (same as a counsellor) some therapy treatments do require a certain level of training, and technically you can only use that training on completion of the course and xx or xxx no. of client contact hours, but it's not well regulated, so it can be a bit iffy.
However just because someone has a long string of letters after their name, doesn't mean they're any good for the therapy you are wanting. Similarly someone calling themselves a psychotherapist but no professional registration numbers / details is probably best avoided.
The best way to find a suitable therapist, is too jot down what you are looking for, then consider if you want F2F or online appointments, if it's F2F look at the geographical area you're happy to travel to, and then start your search in that area for someone suitable. Don't be afraid to ring the practice / person and ask questions to see if they are the right fit for your needs.
CBT can be a real cure for some people it can be completely useless for others, much like other forms of talking therapy, psychoanalytic therapy, etc etc It's not just about a professionals qualifications it's about the therapeutic treatment they offer; the therapeutic relationship and if it would work for your particular requirements.
Hope you find someone suitable.

I am in a similar position to @GrumpyOldCrone .

My PhD is in one of the ‘hard’ fields and my bereavement counsellor has a Master’s. But she is experienced and excellent and I think I made a great choice. It isn’t all about academic qualifications.

OP, if you will have more confidence in someone with a doctorate that is interesting and possibly important for you. Fighting it could be a mistake. But objectively no, I don’t think it is a key consideration.

Of course you’re not unreasonable. I’ve only used psychologists and psychiatrists because I have several factors that make it necessary. A counsellor or therapist that has less formal education in psychology than I have would not be very helpful in my situation.

You also need to find one that you click with. Pick a few from the listings that you think might work and book a few sessions. Choose the one that you can tell will be most helpful to you.

i think I also understand because when you look at the big list google returns they are CBT specialists or PTSD specials or whatever but I want some more generally because I don’t know what I have. I have explained to the gp who said depression and anxiety which definitely checked out but maybe are symptoms of something else. Or maybe I just want to be a bit more special than “simple” anxiety and depression. Someone more qualified with a broader experience would hopefully be anle to sort that out.

I had CBT and I know it works for some people - it changed my best friends whole outlook in 8 weeks, but it did nothing for me. It felt like I was be treated like a toddler who had to have explained that some things are just thoughts. I bought books after in case it was the therapist but I never got past that feeling. So anyone who is a proponent of CBT is going to put me because I’ll be waiting for the airport biscuits story again.

The fact that to become a ‘counsellor’ you don’t need any previous qualifications, just need to be 18 years old, and can complete a level 2 course in 160 hours, says to me they’re not likely to be rigorously qualified and certainly not experienced
@Hibiscrubbed
Well technically that's not true is it, as to be qualified as a counsellor, you need to have completed a level 4 at minimum, so it's a bit more than 160 hours. At least get your facts right before posting such a stupid comment...

I'd much rather see the 50 year old counsellor with life experience than the 26 year old doctor who's ink is still wet on their PHD

I think there are a lot of qualities that most therapists really need to have, and a lot more qualities a therapist might need to have that are specific to working with certain types of problems or clients. If there's a quality that's particularly important to you, and you can identify some external feature (like, say, a specific qualification) that tends to mean that therapists who have that feature are more likely to have that particular quality (and you're willing to pay the extra, if applicable), then it might make sense to go for it.

IMO, one of the many things that makes someone a good therapist is that they can easily follow an explanation or an argument and understand it (and the subtext, and what's not been said, and so on), quickly and accurately make relevant connections between parts of that information and other information that they already have, and create new understanding from the synthesis of these pieces of information. To make someone feel understood, or help them see things a different way or learn to do things differently, these kinds of mental skills are IMO usually pretty important, and they often correlate well with what's generally thought of as "intelligence" (though you need other cognitive qualities on top of sheer mental quickness, obviously). Since completing doctoral-level studies requires a certain level of a very similar type of cognitive ability, a therapist with a doctorate may be less likely to struggle with these particular skills. There's no guarantee, and there's any number of other qualities they may be missing, but the likelihood that they're good at taking in, understanding and analysing information is high. So I see what you're saying here and think some people have been unnecessarily snarky about it.

But that's not to say that other types of therapist are automatically incapable of it. People probably wouldn't last long in private practice without it.

Sorry, that was pretty rambly and my sentences ran away with me a bit; hope it makes sense.

Hi, I am a clinical psychologist.

There is no local list, I’m afraid, but most private CPs will have a website, so you can Google local ones. All should be professionally accredited by the HCPC (not the British Psychological Society (BPS) who used to accredit us - this is important as you can be a member of the BPS without being fully qualified). All will have been trained to doctoral level (unless they qualified mid-90s) and will have provided evidence of ongoing continued professional development to maintain their registration. The HCPC do hold an online database that you can double check your therapist’s credentials on.

Counselling psychologists are also HCPC registered, but (IMHO), their training is arguably less-competitive and comprehensive than Clinical Psychologists, despite being to doctoral standard.

Be aware that “psychologist” is not a protected title. Anyone can call themselves this, even with a basic BSc or Masters degree. Clinical Psychologist and Counselling Psychologist are protected titles. Likewise, anyone can call themselves a counsellor or therapist. The accrediting bodies for counsellors and psychotherapists are the UKCP and the BACP.

In the loosest sense, counselling is helpful for talking through a known issue. Support from psychologists and psychotherapists is more appropriate for a psychological ‘intervention’ (i.e. moderate to severe and complex mental health problems). Counsellors and Psychotherapists tend to train in one modality (or ‘type’) of therapy (E.g., CBT), whereas psychologists are trained in multiple modalities and are able to tailor treatment approaches to the individual.

I hope this helps.

Integrative psychotherapists train in multiple moralities too.

I'm a bit on the fence...

YANBU for wanting a counsellor who is very well qualified and suited to the role, who will be able understand any complexities etc. You can choose or rejects a counsellor for any reason really.

YABU for wanting a PhD specifically. One of my family members is an amazing counsellor. She has 35 years of experience, countless qualifications and thousands upon thousands of hours of counselling behind her. She's written extensively on the subject, and taught courses etc. But she works for a volunteer organisation and always has. When she went to university at 18 after leaving school with incredible grades, she dropped out after a year (being a pregnant catholic in the 70s will do that). So - in defence of her - no you don't need a PhD (although she is incredibly well qualified).

My own experience of counselling has been that 'clicking' with the counsellor has been the main thing.

Good luck OP. I hope you find the help you're seeking.

Integrative psychotherapists train in multiple moralities too.

They do, and there’s a lot of integrated Level 4 or 5 courses at FE colleges, but within two years, you only learn a bit of each particular theory. I’d steer clear of anyone with this qualification.

I'm not sure it's about academic qualifications but more about experience of helping people with complex situations.

I've tried counselling three times and of the three, only found one who really challenged and helped me. Sadly she's no longer in practice.

Most recent attempt was with a counsellor who came highly recommended but it involved her saying things like, 'you need to stop thinking this way'. Or 'you should do things to cheer yourself up'. Oh ok then! 🙄

I did two excruciating sessions and then cancelled it.

YANBU. I did a short counselling course a number of years ago, and some of the participants who went further with it and now practice I wouldn't trust with my dogs mental health😅

Many choose this career path as they are a bit crackers themselves and they believe this makes them experts. The only girl who I would actually trust was a lovely, bright, psychology graduate who had her head firmly screwed on.

I look at letters after their name - the more the better, also age and experience.
look them up online - are they also employed by the nhs too.

That’s for medical doctors

Psychologist is a protected title!!! Only forensic, educational, counselling, clinical, neuro with doctorate level qualifications can call themselves psychologists!!!

Something that really comes across in your posts Op, is that you feel frustrated and misunderstood. It's so important to find the right therapist and be able to trust them, so you feel able to be vulnerable with them. It sounds like for you, having these additional qualifications will enable you to feel safer and more trusting that they are able to help you. If that's what feels right for you then go with it and explore it. It can be a bit of a minefield as there are so many practitioners and different modalities. To further complicate things Counsellor and Psychotherapist aren't protected terms but the various routes to become one ethically all involve a rigorous training that includes many hours of personal therapy for that individual (potentially one of the most important elements as you want to be working with someone who is highly self aware and who doesn't position themselves as an expert, you're the expert in yourself they will support you to find your own answers). There are many excellent counsellors who don't have PHDs they will have other qualifications and good experience which will give them a good grounding in their modality/modalities alongside good experience. Look at the BACP and UKCP websites as a guide for the person who feels right for you then speak to a few people and get a feel for who is the best fit. Good luck, the right therapist is out there for you.