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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

We should abolish military specific ‘offense’

57 replies

Theworried2 · 15/08/2023 20:59

Watching the new Channel 5 show ‘Court Martial: Soldiers behind bars’ has made me think how unjust it is that soldiers are locked up for things that would not be an offence in civilian life like going AWOL or being drunk at work.
Surely soldiers should get the same rights as normal civilians and only ever be jailed for civilian crimes.
To be clear, those who commit murder as a soldier should be jailed as it is a civilian crime too, but those who go on AWOL for example should not as this would not be a crime in normal life.

OP posts:
PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog · 15/08/2023 21:01

Miltary service is not normal life. If they are too drunk to do their job or run away in conflict, we are all fucked.

Original poster
Theworried2 · 15/08/2023 21:03

@PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog Then the soldier who goes AWOL should just be sacked rather than put them in prison. Or alternatively we should just make it easier for people to quit at any time rather than give lengthy contracts

OP posts:
CalistoNoSolo · 15/08/2023 21:08

They sign up knowing the consequences. You 've got to be seriously flakey to show up on duty still pissed. And how the fuck is the army going to function if the guys you're about to send to the front line decide they're going to quit there and then?

PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog · 15/08/2023 21:08

Those options would not and could not work. The contract lengths offset training costs and AWOL is to prevent desertion, you can't have people leaving their comrades in the lurch. How would you sack them if they buggered off? Hmm The military needs a certain type of person, like any job, they know what they are getting into and the discipline system, just as people in civvy life understand if you do x or y you could go to jail

JackyinaTracky · 15/08/2023 21:09

They sign up to it, it’s part of the deal. It’s why being ex military holds any sort of kudos in civvy life. They are held to a different standard because they have lives in their hands, they have access to weapons, secrets and information that means their professionalism doesn’t apply 9-5.
It doesn’t matter if they are in charge of a sub or serving in the mess they are all part of a team that requires standards at all times. Their own safety and the lives of their colleagues literally depends on their ability to follow orders and abide by the rules.
whether you agree with the orders and the rules is what your vote is for, but if you sign up you do it.

CandyflossKaren · 15/08/2023 21:09

Drink at work.....with loaded firearms...hmmm

KrisAkabusi · 15/08/2023 21:09

It takes a lot of time and money to properly train a soldier. There needs to be disincentives to leaving to avoid wasting all that.

CandyflossKaren · 15/08/2023 21:10

Going awol....with said firearms?

PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog · 15/08/2023 21:11

Are you very young @Theworried2? All of this is very obvious.

Blossomtoes · 15/08/2023 21:12

Disingenuous rather than young is my guess.

BungleandGeorge · 15/08/2023 21:13

They so go in knowing that. Just the same as professionals have to adhere to professional standards and would be judged more harshly for breaching them in their professional and personal life

LifeExperience · 15/08/2023 21:17

Retired military officer here. The military is not civilian life and cannot be compared. A soldier going awol in the field, for example, can affect the safety of the rest of his/her unit.

Military members know this when they sign up.

Original poster
Theworried2 · 15/08/2023 21:19

@PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog No I’m just the parent of a young adult who feels it is harsh that young adults in the army have to deal with these, in my opinion punitive rules.

In addition, I feel that it should be a point of principle that everyone has the same rights , military or civilian. Maybe if we changed the tough attitudes in the army, fewer ex veterans would have mental health issues.

OP posts:
PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog · 15/08/2023 21:20

You can't possibly be a genuine poster @Theworried2 no one is that naive, surely.

CandyflossKaren · 15/08/2023 21:20

Why did they join up then? 🤷‍♀️

Blossomtoes · 15/08/2023 21:21

Theworried2 · 15/08/2023 21:19

@PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog No I’m just the parent of a young adult who feels it is harsh that young adults in the army have to deal with these, in my opinion punitive rules.

In addition, I feel that it should be a point of principle that everyone has the same rights , military or civilian. Maybe if we changed the tough attitudes in the army, fewer ex veterans would have mental health issues.

And maybe if we changed those tough attitudes - that have worked for well over a century - we may as well not have a national defence because it would be useless.

PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog · 15/08/2023 21:21

Ex veterans have MH issues due to trauma, not the rules of the job...

CandyflossKaren · 15/08/2023 21:21

Blimey! Op is wanting to turn the Armed forces into a bunch of snowflakes!!

How would that work then?

Ifeelsuchflutterings · 15/08/2023 21:24

Theworried2 · 15/08/2023 21:19

@PipinwasAuntieMabelsdog No I’m just the parent of a young adult who feels it is harsh that young adults in the army have to deal with these, in my opinion punitive rules.

In addition, I feel that it should be a point of principle that everyone has the same rights , military or civilian. Maybe if we changed the tough attitudes in the army, fewer ex veterans would have mental health issues.

I'm pretty sure the reason so many veterans have mental health issues is not because they might go to jail if they are drunk on duty

If you want to campaign for anything campaign for better support for people when they are leaving the military and reintegration into civilian life

CranfordScones · 15/08/2023 21:24

You sound like someone who has no military experience but is somehow fully qualified to run the entire show. Politics or senior management roles would welcome you with open arms.

But the unique circumstances of the military aren't the same as civvy street.

asecretslob · 15/08/2023 21:47

I shouldn't post as I'm sure they are on the wind up
I am sure being the parent of a young adult really gives you an insight into military life

asecretslob · 15/08/2023 21:48

@ or to
Put it more simply you are chatting absolute shite

DinnaeFashYersel · 15/08/2023 21:51

Discipline and following orders without question is absolutely essential in the military. Or people die.

Hankunamatata · 15/08/2023 22:01

Your life isn't your own, you are literally owned by the military (and family are excess baggage). Unless you have been in it then I don't think anyone really understands. Its also why lots soldiers don't do well in civilian life as there is no one to tell them what to do

MissKittyCat · 15/08/2023 22:04

You could be sent to prison for being drunk at work if you were say a bus driver, so I don't think it is unreasonable to be sent to prison for being drunk at work if your job involves handling lethal weapons.