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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To say you shouldn't have a child to heal yourself?

67 replies

ncrelative · 01/08/2023 07:15

NC as outing
I have a relative who has sadly had a very unfortunate life in many respects. Poor upbringing, lack of ability to do things in life, emotional problems.

She is now in a relationship and wants to have a child. She is very positive about this as a way too heal her past life and experiences as she feels others have always had a lucky life and she has always been unlucky and not had what others have. I have been extremely supportive but in our last conversation I got a bit frustrated and told her as a parent it's not how she thinks it is, it is hard work and not about healing yourself but about raising a child who needs you to be their everything.

Her partner also has issues from being abused so neither of them have experience of how to raise a healthy child.

She got really angry at this saying I was privileged to have a family and all she wants is what we all were born having.

I said it was unfair but a child isn't therapy or a healing mechanism and that it's no one's right to have a child in order to heal themselves. Further, if you have never been raised with any idea of successful parenting it isn't right to bring a helpless child into the world to potentially repeat the cycle.

(In the past she has done things like bought a 10 year old relative a range of adult nail polish for Christmas, had no idea how to cook raw chicken at 23yo and thought you could cook it in the microwave, has never babysat or had any experience)

She is extremely angry and upset with me now and predictably won't speak to me. I want to apologise if I hurt her but at the same time I can't support having a child as a kind of therapy. AIBU?

OP posts:
LovingLivingLife · 01/08/2023 07:54

idea to have a child to heal yourself, so many things can go wrong with that.

But your examples and reasoning as to why she would be a bad mum are terrible. Anyone who motivated to be a good parent can be, especially with the love and support of their family.

Pippa12 · 01/08/2023 07:58

You should apologise. But to be honest you sound quite young yourself and I remember having very black and white views in my early 20’s.

The examples you gave really are not reasons to not have children.

Perhaps you should consider that she’s had a crash course in how not to parent, and might be bloody brilliant at it!

Original poster
ncrelative · 01/08/2023 08:01

I see what everyone is saying and will try to apologise (though she's not speaking to me at the moment!)

I think personally I would view it from the perspective of being heartbreaking and unfair, but if I were in that position I would accept that it's not right to have children in my circumstances, like a career athlete having to give up a sport if they get injured due to no fault of their own. But I completely agree that it's a personal choice and there's no right or wrong and there may be therapy and parenting groups she can access. I will see if I can look a few of these up for her.

The nail polish and chicken were just random examples so probably shouldn't have included them. I just worry having a child is another fad like the latest supplement she is trying or illness in the news she's convinced she's got and now needs to treat to fix everything.

OP posts:
IAmAnIdiot123 · 01/08/2023 08:11

ncrelative · 01/08/2023 08:01

I see what everyone is saying and will try to apologise (though she's not speaking to me at the moment!)

I think personally I would view it from the perspective of being heartbreaking and unfair, but if I were in that position I would accept that it's not right to have children in my circumstances, like a career athlete having to give up a sport if they get injured due to no fault of their own. But I completely agree that it's a personal choice and there's no right or wrong and there may be therapy and parenting groups she can access. I will see if I can look a few of these up for her.

The nail polish and chicken were just random examples so probably shouldn't have included them. I just worry having a child is another fad like the latest supplement she is trying or illness in the news she's convinced she's got and now needs to treat to fix everything.

What a load of rubbish, you have no idea what you would do in her position because you are in the privileged position to not have had an awful family background and now have a loving family of your own.

I don't know why nail varnish and chicken are proof that she is following a fad, still can't quite wrap my head around that.

Everyone has children for one selfish reason or another, including you.

LiloP · 01/08/2023 08:11

What are her circumstances exactly? You have not said anything that made me think she can’t have children unless this is a massive drip feed and she is homeless or a drug addict.

i can’t get over how judgmental you are. A lot of us have not had perfect childhoods or even far from and can still parent well with the right support and help. Nobody is destined “to fail” at parenting. Maybe she is better off cutting you out as you clearly can’t be supportive.

itsmyp4rty · 01/08/2023 08:14

I was pretty lost when I had DS, I was educated but really struggled with work and finding a job (probably ND) - didn't know what to do with myself and so decided having a child was the answer. Then I had DS and it was hell! He was a really, really difficult baby and I thought he'd ruined my life. Then he got to 3 and everything got better and he's been the best thing ever for the last 14 years. He gave my life a focus and purpose and I worked so hard at being a really good mum as it was so important to me. He's off to uni soon and I'm so proud of him (he's ND too).

It could be the making of her or it could be the breaking of her - or perhaps a combination of both! but no one can predict that. I don't think anyone ever has any idea how much having a baby will change their life! Much better for you to be there to help and support her, tell her your experiences and suggest some things that really worked for you.

I would buy her a really good baby book and send it to her her with an apology card saying how sorry you are and that you were just worried that she might not realise how hard having a baby can be because you found it very difficult yourself (or relate it to your own experience in some way).

Saoirse82 · 01/08/2023 08:18

Further, if you have never been raised with any idea of successful parenting it isn't right to bring a helpless child into the world to potentially repeat the cycle.

No wonder she isn't speaking to you. I'd cut you dead after the way you've behaved.

Are you saying that people who have experienced abuse or trauma in childhood aren't fit to be parents?

I have a friend who had a terrible childhood, absolutely awful in every way and she's a wonderful loving mother.

You're beyond rude and judgemental. I'm angry on behalf of your relative. You need to apologise but don't be surprised if she doesn't accept your apology.

Ohhelpicantthinkofaname · 01/08/2023 08:19

I think this is none of your business OP and you should keep your beaky nose out of it.

you cannot police who can and can’t have children. Some people who have terrible upbringings make wonderful parents who are determined not to let history repeat. Loads of people with no experience of children have babies. Get over yourself and you superior attitude. No wonder she’s upset with you.

please apologise to her for being so judgemental. If you want to help then support her to be the best parent she can be.

AverseNotAdverse · 01/08/2023 08:25

ncrelative · 01/08/2023 08:01

I see what everyone is saying and will try to apologise (though she's not speaking to me at the moment!)

I think personally I would view it from the perspective of being heartbreaking and unfair, but if I were in that position I would accept that it's not right to have children in my circumstances, like a career athlete having to give up a sport if they get injured due to no fault of their own. But I completely agree that it's a personal choice and there's no right or wrong and there may be therapy and parenting groups she can access. I will see if I can look a few of these up for her.

The nail polish and chicken were just random examples so probably shouldn't have included them. I just worry having a child is another fad like the latest supplement she is trying or illness in the news she's convinced she's got and now needs to treat to fix everything.

You sound really sanctimonious. The chicken and nail polish and childcare comments actually undermine your argument. If that’s all you can come up with, she sounds pretty sorted.

Yes people shouldn’t have kids as therapy. But many people with bad childhoods are great parents. Some make better parents for doing the opposite of what their own mum and dad did.

Believe it or not, she could end up a better parent than you.

Ohhelpicantthinkofaname · 01/08/2023 08:29

ncrelative · 01/08/2023 08:01

I see what everyone is saying and will try to apologise (though she's not speaking to me at the moment!)

I think personally I would view it from the perspective of being heartbreaking and unfair, but if I were in that position I would accept that it's not right to have children in my circumstances, like a career athlete having to give up a sport if they get injured due to no fault of their own. But I completely agree that it's a personal choice and there's no right or wrong and there may be therapy and parenting groups she can access. I will see if I can look a few of these up for her.

The nail polish and chicken were just random examples so probably shouldn't have included them. I just worry having a child is another fad like the latest supplement she is trying or illness in the news she's convinced she's got and now needs to treat to fix everything.

Get over yourself. You have no idea how you would feel in her position and you have no right to dictate who should and should have children.

unless of course you haven’t mentioned a drug or alcohol problem, or that her relationship is violent and not safe for kids to be brought into, or she’s homeless or something. Is there an issue like that? If not butt out.

Saoirse82 · 01/08/2023 08:31

ncrelative · 01/08/2023 08:01

I see what everyone is saying and will try to apologise (though she's not speaking to me at the moment!)

I think personally I would view it from the perspective of being heartbreaking and unfair, but if I were in that position I would accept that it's not right to have children in my circumstances, like a career athlete having to give up a sport if they get injured due to no fault of their own. But I completely agree that it's a personal choice and there's no right or wrong and there may be therapy and parenting groups she can access. I will see if I can look a few of these up for her.

The nail polish and chicken were just random examples so probably shouldn't have included them. I just worry having a child is another fad like the latest supplement she is trying or illness in the news she's convinced she's got and now needs to treat to fix everything.

You're making yourself sound worse as you go along. How dare you say from your privileged position that if you were her that you wouldn't have children!

I wouldn't bother looking up parenting classes for her, I can't imagine that going down too well after what you've already said.

I honestly think she's better off without someone like you in her life, you sound smug and judgemental and quite frankly awful!

Ngmi · 01/08/2023 08:32

I think you are being very judgmental.

ShiteRider · 01/08/2023 08:35

You’re really out of order. The headline isn’t actually what you’re saying. From the body of the text it sounds like she wants to give a child a positive start in life not heal herself.

I see the intergenerational impact of poor parenting every day and it’s far more complex than if you’ve never experienced positive parenting you shouldn’t have kids.

You’re coming across as incredibly judgey and it sounds like you’ve never actually tried to help her, just looked down on her for having a different life from you

Sazza26xx · 01/08/2023 08:41

I can see why you're concerned, however it doesn't mean she will continue the cycle or be a bad parent, many people break the cycle of neglect and abuse

Wertie · 01/08/2023 09:11

It’s callous and unpleasant. Frankly she’s doing better than many, planning and thinking for what will be a wanted child.
If it were my relative I’d be saying ‘I know you had a hard time. I’m here for any questions or concerns you have, or just to share what I had- I’d you ever need that’. You could just have talked through the positives and offered ideas for anything she may find difficult

Wertie · 01/08/2023 09:12

I wish her all the best. I know people that have had awful childhood experiences, and gone on to be fantastic parents. To be honest I think you just need to leave her alone. Judgement is just going to destroy the self esteem she builds up. Leave her be

LemonLight · 01/08/2023 09:15

Wow you've been extremely horrible to her! If I were her this would end the friendship for me. You are extremely judgemental and I think you need to get over yourself tbh!

MrsMcisaCt · 01/08/2023 09:23

Luckily OP, it's not up to you whether she has children or not. I hope she ignores you and goes on to have a lovely family life.

thecatsthecats · 01/08/2023 09:24

I'm pregnant, and if I had a quid for every time someone shoved a baby at me saying that I could do with the practice, the kid would have a trust fund. (I have plenty of baby holding experience, it's hardly rocket science, and since I'm being kicked from within, I don't want to be kicked from without too!)

Because my husband and I take it easy when we're with family and friends (lie ins, meals out, have a cleaner), people have this infantalising idea that we won't cope with a baby. That because we've waited to have a kid, that we've selfishly clung on to our childfree lives and therefore will be unprepared for it.

Which is bollocks, and so distant from our everyday lives. THEY all went straight from clubbing to nappies. We have gradually petered down to an existence of gardening and animal care.

Point being? You have a very small, very filtered perception of this woman. Chances are she may make a great mother. The things you slight her for doing wrong are easy enough to learn.

Random789 · 01/08/2023 09:25

I feel a bit bad now for being harsh. In fairness to the op I suspect she is quite young and that her children are young. It is easy at that stage in life to get caught up in quite a fiercely righteous sense of the demands of perfect parenting.
It takes longer to work out the hideously muddy nature of all of our lives.

OP, a frank and sincere uncaveated apology may heal the rift. You could even show her this thread, as a kind of penance and to reassure her of all the many many other parents here who think she will do just fine.

SueVineer · 01/08/2023 09:28

What you said was offensive and wrong.

PinkPink1 · 01/08/2023 09:29

You're right that you should be as mentally well as possible before having children, but I wore adult nail polish in primary school and I had never baby sat or even held a newborn before having my own baby. I'm in my 20s and I haven't met many newborns in my life.

fireflyloo · 01/08/2023 09:32

I think you're being very judgemental. The nail polish and chicken examples are crap.

Rightly or wrongly, people have children for many different reasons. It's a selfish act in general.

I've seen parents who were brought up in privileged homes, nice parents and good education and they're pretty shit as parents. Conversely I've worked with 2 care leavers who had very traumatic upbringings and they are the most loving, caring and empathic parents.

Reugny · 01/08/2023 09:34

YANBU about having a child as therapy.

YABU about your other comments.

Some 10 year olds are into make up, others aren't. Children are people and people are individuals.

Lots of adults particularly younger ones don't know how do various household chores until they are shown by someone or decided to look it up on social media.

Oh and it is common now for people to not have babysat due to coming from smaller families where siblings and cousins are born within the same 5-10 years and the fact that adults are now kinder and more sensible about who they leave younger children with.

Un7breakable · 01/08/2023 09:38

You need to step away from this. It's not your place and it's never going to end well sharing your thoughts with her.

The midwife will ask about abuse and trauma indicators at the booking in appointment and be able to provide support.