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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

All old people should sell up family homes for families.

712 replies

benigogo · 27/07/2023 13:13

Not really an AIBU, more a hypothetical question really. This view comes up a lot on MN, and I'm interested in the detail of what people actually imagine when they say it. What type of property should they be giving up? What type of property should they be moving to? How old is old? What about younger people who under occupy a property? For example 2 friend couples, have recently downsized. Both from a 4 bed detached, one to a 4 bed semi, and the other to a 3 bed semi. Their homes were bought, one by a young professional couple, and the other by a couple in their seventies, themselves downsizing. If you hold this view what do you visualise?

OP posts:
PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:06

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 17:44

I'm surprised younger people haven't recognised the wisdom of your plan, and clubbed together with friends to buy shared houses.This would have the added bonus of sharing bills so would be cheaper and would also free up homes so less house building would be needed so we'd all have more green spaces.

Loads of young people are already doing this @2bazookas

I know quite a few people who bought a 2 bed flat with a friend because they wouldn't have been able to afford it alone.

I don't know one single 'younger' person who has done this. Yeah a few are flat-sharing/housing sharing because they've got fuck-all choice, as they can't afford to live alone - like everyone else couldn't when they were younger with one wage...

But I know NO-ONE who is buying a home with someone else. Not one person. I am sure some posters will come along and say they know DOZENS of people they know are doing this... 🙄

Funny how no-one mentioned it at ALL, until posters started saying 'OK young people why don't YOU do communal living seeing as you expect 'OLD' people to.' Funny that eh? Hmm

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:07

When I say I know a few young folk who are flat sharing/house sharing. I mean RENTING with other people obvs! NO-ONE is buying anywhere with a 'friend.'

AutumnCrow · 28/07/2023 19:19

The last friends I knew who bought together - it was back in the 1980s / 1990s. Different economic world.

Daisybuttercup12345 · 28/07/2023 19:27

curaçao · 27/07/2023 13:33

Well there's a continuous stream of people dying and their houses bring sold, so what difference would a continuous stream of (say) 70 year olds sell8ng their homes be?

Life is short. You will get to that age soon enough. Then comment.

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:44

I suppose for me I always question these houses that are falling apart because the owners can't afford to maintain them, rattling around in a 4 bedroomed house where they can only afford to heat one room living in poverty and I just think, if you downsized to even 2 bedrooms you could live like a king in comfort and still have £200-300k to play with. Why would you choose the rotten house you cannot afford that's falling to bits?

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:45

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:44

I suppose for me I always question these houses that are falling apart because the owners can't afford to maintain them, rattling around in a 4 bedroomed house where they can only afford to heat one room living in poverty and I just think, if you downsized to even 2 bedrooms you could live like a king in comfort and still have £200-300k to play with. Why would you choose the rotten house you cannot afford that's falling to bits?

What planet are YOU living on?

Is the sun out there?

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:46

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:45

What planet are YOU living on?

Is the sun out there?

I could walk to the next street and take pictures of 2 such houses.

coeurnoir · 28/07/2023 19:49

I get so sick of the ageism and discrimination against both older people and those who don't have children on this site.

I'm 51 (just). I had my kids when I was fairly young by todays standards so this was late 90's. My ex husband and I graduated at the end of a recession and there were few jobs for graduates and we both spent a year or so doing low paid temping and living in a bedsit. By the time we married we had jobs in our field - medical research, but as our contracts were only 3 years and our salaries pitiful, we had to stay in that bedsit. When our first was born we were able to upgrade to a three bedroom flat in a dodgy area. We stayed there for our second child and until we split up a few years later because we still couldn't afford to move.

When my first child was 3 and when I was pregnant with my son, I decided that if we were ever going to buy anything one of us needed a full time permanent job. That was me because research is not family friendly and his career was going well (no mat leaves) so I trained on the job as a teacher on £16k.

When we split up in 2004 I had to move back to live with my parents because I could not afford even the shitty three bed flat anymore on my teachers salary. This wasn't even the South East btw.

I stayed with my parents and I quit that career to work in the NHS as the money was better than a teachers salary. It was also a better place to work but that's a different thread.

It wasn't until I had met my second husband 15 years ago that I was able to finally move into a proper house and get a mortgage. We were 35 and 40. Both professionals, but public sector so 🤷‍♀️.

My children remember how i was always worried about whether I could ever move out of my parents house ans the three,of us have one of our own. We didn't even think about buying then, I'd have been grateful to have afforded to rent that shitty three bed flat again.

My parents weren't able to help us because they had lost their house, that they had worked hard to buy, when the interest rates hit 15% and my father had to give up work because he had a heart attack. My mother worked, but being a middle aged woman who had taken a few years out of the workplace to raise 4 children she couldn't earn enough to cover the mortgage herself. My sister was able to help for a little while, but she was single and could barely afford her own rent. So the house ( a modest three bed terrace) went.

My sister is now married but has no children. Her husband inherited a beautiful large house in the middle of a national park. She is frequently told that she is selfish and that they should sell up, downsize and let a proper family live there. As if a couple aren't a family and don't matter to society. As it is my parents are in the process of moving into an annexe next to my sisters house ans she and her husband will provide care when they get older. It's entirely her and her husbands decision and she has told our parents that they are to use what money they have now to have fun and travel - as they've never been able to.

My children do have it tough now, at 22 and 25. But so did my generation and my parents generation.

For every "boomer" sat in a multi million pound house that they bought for £10, there are millions more older people in poverty. People who never had the opportunity to buy a house. People who scrimped and saved to do so, only to lose it in a recession.

Many of the people on here moaning about boomers will have those huge houses passed onto them. I bet the moaning will stop then.

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 19:54

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:07

When I say I know a few young folk who are flat sharing/house sharing. I mean RENTING with other people obvs! NO-ONE is buying anywhere with a 'friend.'

Well I'm assuming you're a good bit older than me and maybe live in a different area so maybe we don't know the same type of people 🤷🏻‍♀️

What can I say? I do know multiple people who bought a flat with their mate in London. It makes loads of sense - neither could afford to buy alone and they would probably be living with them anyway - may as well pay a mortgage than rent. I actually considered doing it with a friend about 10 years ago but decided not to.

It's a thing young people have always done there as far as I know. Really not that outlandish!

And I didn't say I think older people should do this. I certainly wouldn't want to now, let alone in 30 years. But the previous poster thought she had a clever 'gotcha' and she didn't. The fact you think this is made up just makes you sound massively out of touch.

RosesAndHellebores · 28/07/2023 19:58

@PurpleButterflyWings quite a lot of young people did as you suggest and bought a flat or house together as friends. I remember it well. About half ended in tears. It was all the rage in the late 80s.

My neighbour is 93. Her five bedroom house and large garden are absolutely perfect and she's as rich as croesus.

Within 10 years a family are welcome to move into our house when DH and I downsize. They will just have to find about £1.8m at todays prices and they can have the keys.

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 20:06

@PurpleButterflyWings

I tried to find some data on this and unfortunately mortgage lenders don't collect data on relationship type. But here are some articles to demonstrate that this is A THING and didn't just happen in the 80s.

https://www.standard.co.uk/homesandproperty/buying-mortgages/buying-a-home-with-friends-london-legal-mortgage-how-to-b1016260.html

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46895770.amp

If you google 'buying house with friends' you'll see this is indeed not something I invented to make someone on Mumsnet look silly.

User16496743 · 28/07/2023 20:08

My niece bought a small townhouse type house with a friend about five years ago as that was the only way she could afford one

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 20:16

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:44

I suppose for me I always question these houses that are falling apart because the owners can't afford to maintain them, rattling around in a 4 bedroomed house where they can only afford to heat one room living in poverty and I just think, if you downsized to even 2 bedrooms you could live like a king in comfort and still have £200-300k to play with. Why would you choose the rotten house you cannot afford that's falling to bits?

I live next door to a house exactly like this.

Cornishclio · 28/07/2023 20:25

We live in a 4 bed house just DH and I retired in our 60s. It is owned outright. We keep a spare room for our DD to visit as she lives a distance away and DH has a hobby room and one room for my books, piano and grandkids toys and bed. We have no intention of moving and would give short shrift to anyone trying to make us. I cannot imagine any government of the UK would bring in mandatory moving at a certain age. There is certainly no way it could be enforced. Never going to happen thankfully.

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 20:28

For every "boomer" sat in a multi million pound house that they bought for £10, there are millions more older people in poverty.

Not true. Pensioners are less likely to be in poverty than any other cohort. Overall around 20% of people live in poverty, but the rate is 15% for pensioners and 27% for children.

I'll repeat that last bit for the hard of caring. Children are the group most likely to live in poverty in this country.

https://www.jrf.org.uk/data/overall-uk-poverty-rates#:~:text=In%202020%2F21%2C%20around%20one,living%20in%20poverty%20(27%25)..*

gemstoneju · 28/07/2023 20:57

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:45

What planet are YOU living on?

Is the sun out there?

No, that's perfectly true. Not all elderly people are wealthy. many (most?) live on a pretty basic state pension and paltry occupational one. Their only capital IS their house. Replacing kitchens and modifying bathrooms, updating antiquated heating systems and having to pay for repairs and tradesmen requires spending completely out of their league. I think downsizing is sensible for many people. I appreciate that I may change my mind if I get to that age, but Christ I'd be out of there like a shot, give some money to my kids, and take a sheltered rental, far cheaper to heat and maintain. No point scrimping when you have an asset you can realise.

Namddf · 28/07/2023 22:03

Goldenspearmint · 27/07/2023 16:56

It may not be down to kids but may be they should stop buying the latest iPhone, or expecting a 4 bed detached in a nice area as their first home out of Uni and new car.

Generation I want it all, but I want it now now when I'm old like a boomer 😂

Now this is ageist. So insulting.

Namddf · 28/07/2023 22:05

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:46

I could walk to the next street and take pictures of 2 such houses.

Me too.

SauronsArsehole · 29/07/2023 05:08

Namddf · 28/07/2023 22:05

Me too.

Same. My neighbour only heated one room of her house. Her house doesn’t have central heating. No real insulation in the loft. 1970s kitchen that’s falling apart. The house needs significant work. She’s selling up and it’s on the market for 200k and finally going to live with her daughter.

TeenDivided · 29/07/2023 05:57

gemstoneju · 28/07/2023 20:57

No, that's perfectly true. Not all elderly people are wealthy. many (most?) live on a pretty basic state pension and paltry occupational one. Their only capital IS their house. Replacing kitchens and modifying bathrooms, updating antiquated heating systems and having to pay for repairs and tradesmen requires spending completely out of their league. I think downsizing is sensible for many people. I appreciate that I may change my mind if I get to that age, but Christ I'd be out of there like a shot, give some money to my kids, and take a sheltered rental, far cheaper to heat and maintain. No point scrimping when you have an asset you can realise.

My parents don't want to replace their 1960s kitchen or bathroom. They don't care that the central heating pipes are visible. It's been good enough for 60 years, it will do another 10.

And I agree. We've been in our house for 25+ years. It was a new build estate. I think we must have one of the few original kitchens and bathrooms left given all the skips I've seen over the years.

Xenia · 29/07/2023 07:33

The previous owners of my house were looking at it outside last weekend so I let them come in to have a look (one had lived here 25 years ago) - there were about 15 - 20 of them so it was a very fun showing of the house to so many people but they were lovely. Anyway my point is that I very happily still have the 1990 kitchen, bathrooms and carpet and curtains, not because I am poor or silly but because they still work and I am perhaps eco or wise enough not to replace things because a trend says a kitchen should now look like XYZ. I think they were surprised it was the same but in some ways pleased that choices they made over 30 years ago were still going strong.

However, I get the point people are making - some older people ma have the older fittings BUT also cannot afford or do not choose to make repairs and the fabric of the house might be affected such as by a leak in the roof. Mind you plenty of younger home owners cannot afford to fix things I am not sure this issue is confined to the old.

For those saying older people in a 3 or 4 bed house move to a 2 bed place some areas only have bog standard 3 bed semis or terraced houses and in some areas places with 1 bed room are flats and most of them are not accessible for the old so a house where you can sleep on the ground floor is often the best option.

RosesAndHellebores · 29/07/2023 07:53

MIL lives in the house that time forgot. Red velvet curtains with pelmets, apple green dining room (the teak 60s furniture is very in again!), black and white tiles in the hall, textured paper with a square and flower pattern embossed (now painted over). It's in fairly good nick but just very dated. And that's exactly how she wants it and exactly what DH will support her to keep and will ensure she stays there.

The fact is she and late FIL bought it in 1959. They moved in as newly weds, their three dc were born there, their church is round the corner and although she and two neighbours (one is 92) are the last standing, she will never leave. She probably should have when FIL died but stayed due to neighbours who have either died or moved on.

She has been on her own since the mid noughties. It's a bog standard 30's three bed semi. Its biggest draw back is that there's no downstairs bog.

MIL lives quite "poor" and nobody would guess she has a bean but if she were house proud and/or wanted to she could have the entire house renovated. It's just not what people fancy in their late 80s. DH makes sure it's watertight, warm and its fabric is maintained.

I only hopped back on this thread to see what @SauronsArsehole said because I thought your name was awesome, scrolling through.

OMG12 · 29/07/2023 07:56

I’m finding the agism and stupidity on this thread gobsmacking!!!

User16496743 · 29/07/2023 08:05

Why would people throw away perfectly good fixtures and fittings just because they aren't the latest style

PurpleButterflyWings · 29/07/2023 09:18

MsRosley · 28/07/2023 11:53

'which was nice'

😆 Oh yeah that braggy man from The Fast Show sprung to mind for me too when @escapingthecity was waffling on about her and her family and their massive homes and their hundreds of guests, at all their parties al over the years...........blah blah blah blah blah............. 😬