To worry DD25 could get a driving ban?

[showslope]

DD26 has been driving for five years. She's usually a great driver & a sensible person all round.

On her way to work nights a couple of weeks ago, she went through a red light at speed. She knows how dangerous this was & was beating herself up about it. She couldn't slow down in time to stop safely (I know this is a speed issue).

She was rushing to get to work as she was going to be late & there were hardly any cars & no people around. However, she did think it was a 40 zone as the signage wasn't great, the other side of the road was a 40 limit, and the area used to be a 40 when she was last there many years ago.

Last week, she got the letter through asking for her to confirm she was driving when this happened. The letter mentions the speed but there's no clear mention of her going through the red light (though it was a speed and red light camera that caught her).

She hasn't had any previous driving offences. She isn't eligible for a speed awareness course as the speed is too high for that.

Understandably, she's now terrified she's going to get a driving ban (needs the car for work). Of course she knows it'd be her own fault, but she's sick with worry and has to wait for the next letter to find out what will happen.

Anyone know what the most likely answer is?

there isnt a percentage allowance anymore

OP as someone whose life was ruined for a few years, along with life changing injuries I have to live with (which ironically mean I now cannot drive) due to a dangerous driver who I'm sure would say they were normally a good driver (as everyone caught says that) why do you think your daughter is entitled to not get a ban?

It is sheer, dumb luck that means her actions didn't result in other drivers or pedestrians being seriously injured or killed. The fact the outcome was luckily ok doesn't mean her actions were any less dangerous.

I'm not saying she's a terrible person. But she made a decision so dangerous that she absolutely is unsafe to drive IMO as her reflex was to do something incredibly dangerous.

Why do you feel she is entitled not to be banned?

Going at that speed in a 30 limit - I wish she would get a ban - but sadly she won't.

Put it this way. If your daughter had been crossing that road on foot or driving in the path of the red light, and another driver had been doing nearly double the 30 speed limit (or even thought they were in a 40), which is exactly what could have happened with her behaviour, would you want them to be banned? Or would you feel a fine and points were an acceptable consequence for the driver? Be honest, would you?

@showslope

im sorry, I have no idea. These threads never help, too many pike in with what they think she deserves rather than the law & also magistrates are inconsistent.

I'm 54 & drive a LOT. I have only ever had one speeding ticket (34 in a 30). Several years ago and I am careful about limits.

but 2 weeks ago I drove on a familiar A road, but much further along it than usual. I was driving around 40 as signposted, I must have missed a 30 sign. It's not a residential area & leads up to a motorway, so I still can't understand why it's a 30.💁🏻‍♀️ I've had a letter asking to confirm I was driving at the time. They'll only give photographic evidence if it goes to court.

but they have me down as 38 in a 30 zone.

im just now waiting to see if I can do a speed awareness course, I should be able to I hope as I'm a) within the limit to be allowed b) haven't done one in the past 3 years. 🤞🏼

i hope she just gets points & a fine, but if she gets a ban I hope it's short & family & friends can help her out getting to work.

i also hope she's had enough of a scare to mind her speed.

That isnt accurate
Some are based on income
https://www.gov.uk/speeding-penalties

That’s a ridiculous speed, not what you want to hear but she bloody should get a ban! Reckless and a danger to other people.

I hope she just gets points & a fine, but if she gets a ban I hope it's short & family & friends can help her out getting to work.

I'll ask you the same question I asked OP.

If your daughter had been crossing that road on foot or driving in the path of the red light, and another driver had been doing nearly double the 30 speed limit (or even thought they were in a 40), which is exactly what could have happened with her behaviour, would you want them to be banned?

Or would you feel a fine and points were an acceptable consequence for the driver? Be honest, would you?

This is to @FFSwhatisthis

I’m a magistrate, and here is the official guidance we would use in sentencing speeding:

https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/offences/magistrates-court/item/speeding-revised-2017/

That says 6 points or an up to 56 day ban. I’d probably give the points or a short ban (less than a month) for what you suggest.

This is the sort of speed that would go to court, and we would give a penalty based on income (rather than a fixed penalty).

What evidence is being presented to say that your daughter was driving at 54mph?

This, it’s almost twice the speed limit!

Surprised by anyone not knowing if a road is a 30mph zone.
If there's no repeater signs then you assume it's a 30 unless there's no street lights anywhere in which case you're likely on a country road where you'll know it's a National speed limit area.
And at 25 your daughter has done a theory and hazard perception test so does already know this.
Hope this is the wake up call for her to give driving the respect and sense it deserves.

@monsteramunch I'm really sorry about what happened to you.

my godson who I live like one if my iwn, was in a car accident, he's luckily to be alive (we were told they'd turn life support off, we stopped them) he has life changing injuries including brain injuries which mean he'll never live independently. I have also had injuries which are life changing.

so, it's really not theoretic for me.

banning for 7-56 days isn't going to change his injuries or mine. It's just going to put the drivers job in jeopardy & inconvenience their social life for a short period. How does losing their job help with anything?

OP said it was a speed and red light camera, so not disputable other than being maybe a slight MPH out, which would barely make a difference as she was almost double the speed limit even if a MPH or so less.

I'm so sorry to hear about you and your godson, that is terrible

I meant a permanent, not temporary ban. It means that yes, one driver is permanently inconvenienced when it comes to driving. But it also means that all the pedestrians and other drivers they could potentially have come into contact with in future have slightly less risk of being injured or worse.

I think on balance that's a fair outcome.

I can't drive now, permanently, due to the driver. It seems insane to me that despite me having never presented any risk through my driving, a driver whose behaviour was so dangerous and thoughtless that that happened is allowed to continue driving.

Not as some sort of revenge / retribution for me personally, but on balance for the greater good.

GladAllOver thanks for that advice This was years ago and I was given that information at the time by the Police. Even they acknowledged it wasn't a 'typical' 30mph area, so it isn't always that obvious.

It was a genuine mistake. I haven't been done for speeding since, I learnt a lot from it.

@BlueBellsArePretty on the letter I got, it said

'this allegationWILL be supported by photographic evidence at any subsequent court hearing'

the only way to contest it, is to go to court.

they won't even tell you where the camera is, as it 'reduces' the number of drivers caught.

I got caught doing 68 in a 50 (completely accidentally, it was an unfamiliar road and I hadn't spotted the stretch of motorway had gone down to 50, thought it was a 70!). Luckily only got 3 points and a £100 fine, but I think it should have been higher from what I saw when I looked it up.

54 in a 30? Be thankful for whatever she receives because she is a dangerous driver. Hope the lesson is learned she needs to leave earlier - absolutely no excuse

I really doubt she will be banned

To the pp who posted a link, she isn't a new driver...

My brother was almost killed as a child by a driver who thought she was above the speed limit. I heard my brother's screams when he was admitted to hospital, it was also horrific and he had a long road to recovery.

Your daughter needs to be thankful there was nobody crossing the road when she hit the gas pedal, speed does kill.

Obviously nobody on here is going to know what the outcome will be for your daughter but for her safety and other road users, I truly hope she gets a ban and if she doesn't, I really hope this was a lesson well and truly learnt!

@raquelwelsh

I can only answer for myself. The A road is a very long road, it mostly changes 40/50/40/50, with a few 30's in obvious places (schools/shops etc)

there had been 40 signs... trundling up in an non built up area, several miles to a major junction to the motorway.

there was nothing untoward to indicate a move to 30. I assume I missed the sign (lots hidden in the over growth of trees)

im not arguing the allegation (hopefully an awareness course & fee instead of points & fine) because as I thought it was a 40 area, I probably was doing 38.

"hardly any cars" - thats exactly what someone crossing the road would think as your daughter arrives on scene not paying attention, blowing straight through a red traffic light at almost twice the speed limit.

Having seen two people killed in front of me on the roads I hope they also charge her for running a red light and make an example of her - attempting to excuse this by adding she was late for work is frankly obscene.

Its inexcusable.

Was there a system of street lights? If there are regularly spaced street lights, it's a 30mph limit and repeaters are specifically prohibited by law. Drivers are expected to know it's a 30 limit because there are street lights and no other speed limit signs (bar the terminal signs at the start of the 30 limit).