Always on annual leave

[Abitboring]

I have a relatively new hire (but not direct report) who has been in the job since January. She took annual leave in February, April, May and June. Always about a week and always a 'holiday', so not family stuff etc. It made her training slow and difficult as there was only one full month she worked in her first five months of employment. There's been a bit of 'sorry, just got back from annual leave' as an excuse for one thing or another. It also made me wonder whether she's going to do this every year now and will effectively work part time a few months in a row.

I wouldn't mind as much if she was fully competent in her role, but she isn't. I find her a slow worker and I need to remind her about a lot of things, which I feel I shouldn't have to do if she just kept a list or something to remind herself what needs done when and how.

AIBU to be annoyed?

It's a conversation you need to have with your manager - not least because if you are off, she's covering and she fucks up, who gets the blame? "Boring didn't train me properly"!

I'd advise documenting everything too whether that be just for your own use or in case you need to back yourself up down the line.

It takes time to learn new skills and mistakes are to be expected for the first few months to a year in any new role. If she’s slow… would you rather she was slow because she was taking the time to do it properly, or making loads of mistakes because she’s rushed?

if having someone still in training impacts on everyone else’s workload that badly then it sounds as if there isn’t a very robust system in place anyway

you can’t be angry at people for annual leave that has been approved and they are entitled to.

YABVU

I think you should just ask her to put her AL in your calendar so you know when she's off. If she doesn't, have a word with her. If she still doesn't then tell her manager she hasn't done so and it's making life difficult. Separately I think your major problem is your manager, as PPs have said. You shouldn't be taking on his workload. I would have a word with him about how your workload can be reduced whilst you're training this woman, until she can (hopefully!) help lighten your load.

I am in the private sector in a cut-throat business with very tight margins. There is an HR department and staff are also in a union. These things are not just part of public sector jobs. Doing the job of another person while they are away on holiday wouldn’t happen unless it was a formal secondment. If we are short-staffed, we use freelancers.

I'd say you need to talk to your manager's manager as well as HR. And book all your holidays now to ensure you've got those ahead of newbie.

I love the ideas that others have stated about how doing someone's job when they're on AL would be handled by a secondment!! So going through hiring and training for a week here and a week there? I've never seen a company do that!! Either someone in the team covers the work or it simply doesn't get done and is all piled up for when the individual comes back to the office.

Think I'd also have a sit down with newbie and clear the air about what hols she still has to come (booked or not), when she thinks she'll be taking them and that you think she's not doing herself any favours by being off so much so that come the end of the year performance review you'll need to provide feedback about how she should have her probation extended due to her not knowing how to do her job or be a team player.

Our policy is when you book leave you send a meeting/calendar request to everyone with "isntthis annual leave" so it's in everyone's diary. Simple solution to an annoying problem.

To those saying she must be out of leave soon, we get given 35 days plus BH, she may not be if she's not got children!

if you have to provide her cover when she is off, yes you should be consulted. Because if you have too much work on and can't do hers what would happen then?

I think you've had some good advice on here, OP, and i hope that you can take some of that into work next week and communicate it to management.

If you are getting stressed and exhausted because all this is making your job stressful, that is something you may also want to discuss with your boss? if you are trying to train this new person and they aren't taking it on board, i think you need to get "permission" from your manager to make the training more formal, and that the newbie must listen to you and take instruction from you.

You just need to talk to your manager and explain the existing set up isn't working.

And every company other than tiny ones has someone responsible for hr

Except that it’s creating problems for her colleagues

You’re not getting much sympathy OP but I’m with you. She sounds like an inconsiderate and uncommitted pisstaker. When I was still young and keen to advance my career I used to try to work for the first three months or so of a new job without taking a holiday, to establish myself, build momentum and try to make a good impression. I wouldn’t have been expecting a new recruit to be taking holiday every month like this either! Also, I would have expected her to communicate about it. I’m not surprised you’re cheesed off and unlike other posters I think you’ve a right to be. She probably hasn’t much entitlement to leave left but her line manager should keep a note of all her absences as she won’t want to go 6 months with no holiday, will she? She has all the hallmarks of a workplace CF.

If she is entitled to the leave there's nothing to be said. Added to which, she must have just about used up her entitlement now so she won't be absent too much for the rest of the year--one assumes.
On the other hand, it does seem unreasonable that someone just starting a job is entitled to their full quota of annual leave right from the get-go. I haven't started a job since the Jurassic era but, when I last did, I seem to remember that you accrued annual leave days as you worked. I think you earned a day of leave per two weeks of work, so you wouldn't have been able to have a full week off until you had completed 10 weeks. You weren't entitled to your full whack to be taken when you liked until you had completed a full year. Is it different now?

I've just started a new job which has a policy for no annual leave during the probation period - I negotiated my birthday leave during contracting, but it seems like a good shout. She's entitled to her annual leave, but if I were you I'd ask for her probation to be extended on the basis that you hadn't had long enough to assess her skills - that means if she's not up to scratch, you have an opportunity to get rid. Hope she steps up, but much better to have the option if you need it!

I had a similar experience to this once when I was trying to train someone who for a variety of reasons was never in a full month - I’m guessing you maybe work in Finance?

9 months into the role the person still could not carry it out satisfactory and every month I had to either step in to correct things or do it myself because they were off.

It was very frustrating and in the end I had to speak to my manager who was appalled and started monitoring the employee themselves, when they did it was a bit of an eye opener to them how detailed the job was and to be honest how much the employee couldn’t really be arsed.

I get exactly where you are coming from 😂

YABU. For a start, she likely asked if the leave situation would be OK before she started in the role. If she was told it was fine, then its likely fine. For all you know, she could be using her annual leave to caring responsibilities (children or parents or anyone else) until she can sort something more permanent - the reason for the leave is none of your business. You seem to think that she's purposely being difficult being off on leave; for all you know, she might be equally frustrated with being off but have no choice.

You've also decided that if you asked her to put it her leave in your diary, she wouldn't do it - but you haven't asked her, so you're just making assumptions. She's in a new business getting used to a new way of working and a new role where she potentially hasn't grasped the impact her being off has on you. Just say something like "usually when we go off on leave, we let the colleagues we work closely with know in advance - it'd be useful if you could put the dates in your calendar and forward over to me" and if she ignores it then talk to her manager. Its unfair to complain to her manager when you're just assuming she won't do something.

How do you deal with this with the rest of the team? Does everyone just sit there yelling out the dates they're on leave hoping that those who want to know write it down? It'd be rare for me to approach someone who isn't my line manager and say "I'm going to be off on leave in 4 weeks time, 8 weeks time and 12 weeks time" but I update the holiday tracker and would expect if someone wants to know, they can see for themselves.

Also you've said that it's a highly complex role and also that you're frustrated that she's not picking things up quick enough - of course she's not picking things up quickly, she's new and it's complex. If you're struggling to deal with a new starter being inexperienced, I suggest you chat to your manager about someone else training her up - your lack of patience is not going to help her settle in.
Sounds like you've been in your job a while and have forgotten what it's like to be the newbie.

We’ll get your leave request in quicker. She’s entitled to leave, she requests the dates she wants and it’s granted or not - you can do the same if you like, be quicker.

Are you in accounting?
All the tasks for everyone should be on a monthly worksheet, you shouldn't have to remind anything. Add people's names to the tasks, if they book a day off on one of those tasks, then they need to find cover.

For training, she shouldn't be taking any more leave as so much gone already?

She's not "playing the system" at all. And annual leave should be used for holidays. It's why each employee is given it. She presumably gets the same amount as you do (potentially slightly less if your company does the increased AL based on years in service thing)? If her boss doesn't have a problem with her taking the time off then why should she stop? Everyone should take their full annual leave each and every year. Businesses would replace you within weeks if you quit/were fired/died/were forced to resign to take care of a family member, nobody owes them a full 52 week year of working yourself to the bone and not taking what you're entitled to. Continue her training when she's in OP (which at some point will presumably be all the time as she'll run out of AL for the year) and maybe book yourself a week/long weekend next time you're in. Everyone should be taking their AL, most of us don't get much of it in the first place!

This exactly

Her being a slow worker and her taking holiday to which she is entitled are two completely separate things. Only one of them is bad in terms of work.

Agree.

I misread your username as "lefty yet, witch?" 😆

Tbh I think the company processes for new recruits need updating so everyone's expectations are realistic. It's quite easy to write a policy that states inly x weeks of annual leave may be booked whilst I'm training..

Also a checklist of skills needed and performance reviews seems appropriate.

I have trained, many, many people in different jobs I've worked and u do get some you don't gel with, I suspect your newbie is either unhappy with the work, hours or training and is taking holidays to try to get through this period. I can imagine it's fun for either of you at the moment. It seems obvious you don't share the same work ethics but please find something you can bond over to make life a bit more bearable.

*can't imagine

As OP isn't actually her manager the last paragraph would be incredibly inappropriate, nosey, and come across as threatening/bullying. If I were "newbie" I'd complain about it to my actual manager and HR who would come down like a ton of bricks on you.

It's not for a colleague to have any input at all into when you take your leave and to tell you off for "not being a team player" when you haven't actually done anything wrong, and OP will come across as a complete power-hungry and delusional dick if she suggests she has the power to extend the new person's probationary period when she doesn't!

So when you say she’s your new hire, she’s not is she? She’s just a colleague doing the same job as you and you’ve been asked to train her?
If you’re not her line manager / manager / team leader her annual leave has absolutely nothing to do with you, but if you’re so invested in her time off one click onto her holiday tracker shouldn’t really put you out.
Imo you’re jealous that she has a life outside of work and bitter because you have to do more when she’s off, as she will need to do when you’re off. So yes, yabu! Leave her to enjoy her holidays!

So this new person has managed to book AL every month before everyone else, leaving no time for other people to take AL and gets it approved each time 😂😂 I’m sorry but you all need to up your game…. X new girl bossing the holiday process 😂