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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Taking children to potentially unsafe country

99 replies

Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 15:05

My husband and I aren’t in a great place. Together 15 years, married 8, 2 dc 1 and 5. We don’t argue and he has a lot of good qualities, but various issues over the years have sent us both in a bit of a spiral where we don’t feel particularly loved by the other, and it becomes a vicious cycle. We had a big chat last night and both said we want to make it work, but effort needs to be made big time on both of our parts. I’m definitely in the ‘what about the kids’ way in thinking about what if we split up. One issue we’ve always had is he’s African and he doesn’t think I take enough interest in his culture. There are various reasons for this that I could go into but will make this super long. But I do agree to an extent that I could show more interest. He goes home every couple of years. His home country isn’t a war zone or anything but it’s deprived and only a few weeks ago one of his friends and he were talking about if you become ill whilst visiting then there’s a high chance you won’t come out of hospital. My husband has lost 3 brothers who still lived there. His parents have never met our kids. We always said we’d go out there when they are a bit older but now his parents are getting old and his dad in particular is in ill health. He said last night he really wants us to all go out there next year. I expressed my concerns about healthcare which he kid of just dismissed, but I said if it’s important to him that we’ll go. I’m now worrying about it and what if my kids get ill whilst there. AIBU to say I don’t want us to go given I do admit I need to try harder with his family. I know if it was the other way round my parents would be devastated to have never met my kids. I just can’t shake the safety side of things. Please go easy on me, I was a bit shocked by some of what he said last night as although I knew we do t have a lot of time for each other at the moment I didn’t realise we were quite so far into the spiral of potentially not staying together forever. Thanks for reading.

OP posts:
titchy · 21/07/2023 15:30

His brothers though presumably couldn't pay for western standard hospitals though? Which your insurances would cover.

Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 15:36

titchy · 21/07/2023 15:30

His brothers though presumably couldn't pay for western standard hospitals though? Which your insurances would cover.

His brother that died very unexpectedly had a very good executive level job out there so pretty sure he had good insurance. I will discuss with my husband in more detail the types of hospitals and options they have out there. He’s always said the decent hospitals you have to be flown out to. I’m clueless really so just going by what he’s told me in the past.

OP posts:
Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 15:38

Wenfy · 21/07/2023 15:30

Visas are expensive as are flights and everything takes a long time to arrange. So of course they will want to stay for months. Also, I presume as you’ve never bothered to go their visits are the only time they get to spend time with their son and grandkids.

Why did you marry a Zimbabwean if you can’t handle the cultural differences? He has sacrificed his family for you, surely you could return the favour once every few years by hosting his family.

I will ask him about the possibility of his parents coming here. I don’t think his dad will be well enough. Yes I wish my 21 year old self thought of these things when I fell madly in love with him, but here we are. Plus I first met his parents when they came for our wedding so it was a bit late by then! We hadn’t really experienced many cultural differences up to then.

OP posts:
geoger · 21/07/2023 15:41

You should def go - your kids will love it. My parents used to visit Zimbabwe even when they were in their 60s. Decent travel insurance and you’re sorted.
I’m curious about the cultural differences you mentioned- is this why you don’t want to go?

JMSA · 21/07/2023 15:43

There's more to this than the trip. Do you love him? You are very focused on the two of you as parents, but not as a couple.

EsmeSusanOgg · 21/07/2023 15:45

titchy · 21/07/2023 15:29

The red flag issues are related to the political situation though. OP is concerned about healthcare should they fall ill.

Which she shouldn't worry about as long as she has decent travel insurance.

Agree. And they are current, rather than next year. Just thought the whole info might give her background and actually offer some reasurance - especially as her in-laws are in Harare.

Tellmeifimwrong · 21/07/2023 15:45

Oh my goodness, definitely go! Relatively speaking Zimbabwe is a safe country.

My dc have been to their dad's country (very close to Zim culturally and physically) and said it was the best holiday ever.

Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 15:48

JMSA · 21/07/2023 15:43

There's more to this than the trip. Do you love him? You are very focused on the two of you as parents, but not as a couple.

Yes I love him but for reasons that have built up over the years I’m not madly in love with him like I used to be. That’s what we’re trying to get to the bottom of. And he’s the same with me. Us as parents is pretty much what we are at the moment. We work full time, I do condensed hours so 10 hour days over 4 days, we don’t have babysitters etc. we don’t have much time other than being parents.

OP posts:
whatsappdoc · 21/07/2023 15:48

Your dc need to go and experience their heritage. Once the IL's die are they ever going to go out there again?

Gymmum82 · 21/07/2023 15:51

Get insurance. They have private hospitals which most locals cannot afford. That’s why people die public healthcare is crap. Like much of Africa including SA.
I would go. Plenty of people visit Zimbabwe

Peony654 · 21/07/2023 15:52

I thought you were going to say a country like Mali or Niger the way you described it. Zimbabwe is fine, I go there for work often. Just get very comprehensive travel insurance. They're just as much his kids as yours, and it's right they should spend time with their grandparents and learn about their father's heritage. Surely you knew this would be on the cards when you chose to have kids.

Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 15:52

geoger · 21/07/2023 15:41

You should def go - your kids will love it. My parents used to visit Zimbabwe even when they were in their 60s. Decent travel insurance and you’re sorted.
I’m curious about the cultural differences you mentioned- is this why you don’t want to go?

No I’m happy to go if the healthcare isn’t an issue, albeit I’m an anxious traveller even on short haul holidays but I would put that aside for him and my kids. The cultural differences are more around him thinking I’m unwelcoming to his family. I have tried over the years, I really feel like I have. They are very loud and ‘the more the merrier’ and I get a bit overwhelmed. They speak their native language most of the time they’re here so I kind of switch off a bit and carry on with whatever I need to do, obviously after asking how they are, how’s work, family etc. I just don’t have much else to talk to them about when I can’t understand what they’re saying. To them that translates as me being rude.

OP posts:
Maddy70 · 21/07/2023 16:01

I understand that he wants his parents to see his children. Could you pay for his parents to visit you instead?

Maddy70 · 21/07/2023 16:02

Wenfy · 21/07/2023 15:26

Omg you’re stressing this much about Zimbabwe? You do realise that’s a popular destination for people with young families right? You can’t compare local healthcare with the care tourists get - over there the best facilities are expensive. All you do is get the best travel insurance you can get, ensure medical evacuations are covered, and you’re fine. My Uncle had two heart attacks there, both times he was taken to a random local hospital where they stabilised him. The first time he was flown to South Africa, but the second time he had his bypass in Harare. He’s still alive and kicking (unfortunately).

This is very true. Healthcare for tourists isn't the same as the local healthcare

pizzaHeart · 21/07/2023 16:02

I think your concerns are normal , and I personally wouldn’t exclude not traveling and sticking to FaceTime/ Skype. It’s not unheard of. Your DH should have thought about this problem when he left Zimbabwe, if he wanted to raise his family near his parents and his kids to be involved in cultural things he should have acted accordingly. He rips what he sow.
However saying this it feels like you haven’t thought about this issue as well and didn’t research the possibility of travel before saying No to that. Your post is more about you not wanting to go rather then looking at the possibilities to go if you see what I mean. Your DH probably picked up this attitude and started feeling resentful.
I don’t know about the situation in Zimbabwe but there are lots of good advices on the thread about travel insurance, sticking to cities rather than going rural, checking vaccination etc so it seems it’s doable with careful planning. I wouldn’t let them go without you by the way, just in case. And I wouldn’t go for long , a 1-2 weeks is probably enough.

amylou8 · 21/07/2023 16:02

I think I'd rather take my chances in Zimbabwe in a private hospital with insurance than on the NHS at the moment.

You can't compare the healthcare the locals get to what will be available to a paying tourist.

Tellmeifimwrong · 21/07/2023 16:08

Please do consider going and throwing yourself into the experience. You will see a totally different side to your husband.

toastofthetown · 21/07/2023 16:11

Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 15:52

No I’m happy to go if the healthcare isn’t an issue, albeit I’m an anxious traveller even on short haul holidays but I would put that aside for him and my kids. The cultural differences are more around him thinking I’m unwelcoming to his family. I have tried over the years, I really feel like I have. They are very loud and ‘the more the merrier’ and I get a bit overwhelmed. They speak their native language most of the time they’re here so I kind of switch off a bit and carry on with whatever I need to do, obviously after asking how they are, how’s work, family etc. I just don’t have much else to talk to them about when I can’t understand what they’re saying. To them that translates as me being rude.

But do you not think it’s more important for your children, that you put your discomfort to one side for them to be able to directly experience half of their family and cultural heritage? When they’re older they may well ask why you never took them to see their family and explore Zimbabwe. Especially as their grandfather is so unwell, for them to have met him and have some lovely photographs together could mean so much to them in the future.

(And if you do go, Wild Is Life is close to Harare airport and is the most incredible wildlife sanctuary)

insideoutsider · 21/07/2023 16:11

Get your jabs (HepB &C, yellow fever, typhoid, tetanus, malaria tablets etc). Most people that get very sick aren't vaccinated against a lot of these diseases. It will cost a lot of money but you need to do it.
And stay in a hotel. You'll be fine.

Curioushorse · 21/07/2023 16:14

Zimbabwe!? OP you should go.

Right. Africa is not another planet. I've had an operation in one African country, and a baby in another. If you can pay, most things are possible- and there are no waiting lists if you've got money. You just walk straight in. Plus, it's cheap. Appendicitis operation cost me about £350. Husband got stitches (football accident) for about £5. Honestly, doctors and nurses are trained to a similar standard to here. I'm sorry your husband has lost his brothers- but it may have been the same if they were here.

It is a beautiful country. You're making a massive mistake never having been, snd your children would have a brilliant time.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 21/07/2023 16:14

As with all less than perfect marriages where one parent is from a different country - what's the situation if he were to decide to not come back with them?

Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 16:18

NeverDropYourMooncup · 21/07/2023 16:14

As with all less than perfect marriages where one parent is from a different country - what's the situation if he were to decide to not come back with them?

We are all going together, he’s not taking them on his own.

OP posts:
Pred1cament · 21/07/2023 16:20

toastofthetown · 21/07/2023 16:11

But do you not think it’s more important for your children, that you put your discomfort to one side for them to be able to directly experience half of their family and cultural heritage? When they’re older they may well ask why you never took them to see their family and explore Zimbabwe. Especially as their grandfather is so unwell, for them to have met him and have some lovely photographs together could mean so much to them in the future.

(And if you do go, Wild Is Life is close to Harare airport and is the most incredible wildlife sanctuary)

Yes, I’m not saying the cultural differences are why I don’t want to go. Someone just asked for more info as to what the differences we experience are. He just has a general view that I don’t make effort with his culture which is why I don’t want to not go. I’m just worried about safety.

OP posts:
Ponoka7 · 21/07/2023 16:28

Posters don't seem to be getting that going to a tourist part of a country in Africa and staying on a decent complex isn't the same as a poverty stricken part, in a private house. I have three friends from Zimbabwe and none of them want to go back to visit. If you are white check how things would be for you. Again it's different than booking excursions with guides. Can you trust him enough that he will take you out and about? How is the attitude towards mixed heritage children and would you be perceived as having wealth, therefore there'd be a risk kidnap? My father was from SA and I've travelled around were people live, so not tourist bits and I've had to delay travelling because of the mood of the place.

StellaJohanna · 21/07/2023 16:30

Ponoka7 · 21/07/2023 16:28

Posters don't seem to be getting that going to a tourist part of a country in Africa and staying on a decent complex isn't the same as a poverty stricken part, in a private house. I have three friends from Zimbabwe and none of them want to go back to visit. If you are white check how things would be for you. Again it's different than booking excursions with guides. Can you trust him enough that he will take you out and about? How is the attitude towards mixed heritage children and would you be perceived as having wealth, therefore there'd be a risk kidnap? My father was from SA and I've travelled around were people live, so not tourist bits and I've had to delay travelling because of the mood of the place.

This. There is a lot of abject poverty. Harare has a lot of open sewers and the smell make you feel like vomiting if you've never encountered if before. You cant blend in because you look different - be prepared for everyone you meet to assume you are stinking rich.