To wonder what all the fuss is about ULEZ

[Winterday1991]

Hardly anyone is affected, only if you have a very old car. No, you should not be free to pollute the air by driving around in a polluting vehicle and so should have to pay a penalty to do so.

It annoys me as everyone agrees we need to tackle climate change, but no one wants the hit on their life/ change their lifestyles.

The good news is that all the councils on the outskirts of the new ULEZ zone have told the nasty little gimp to do one and they won't be putting up any cameras in their borough

Do you have a link to this ?!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12365999/Home-Counties-revolt-Sadiq-Khans-hated-Ulez-expansion-one-councils-bordering-London-refuse-display-signs.html

Thankyou !

Good on them

Ulez is basically a cash grab on Londoners who live in areas without adequate TfL public transportation. Nobody who lives in the new Ulez areas use their cars for fun - it’s because trains are expensive. It can cost £50 per day to travel in from Buckinghamshire.

It's also a cash grab on people who live much closer to central London but are outside the current zone.

The current zone is about 400 metres north of where I live - its about as close as you can get to central London without being in the current ULEZ. If you have a non-compliant vehicle right now you can do the supermarket or kids to sport or the local pool without incurring the charge.

Not nay more - quick review of cats parked on my street yesterday. Reckon 15-20 per cent will be caught. And it will be the people who can least afford it

It's not a cash grab for the thousands of londoners who don't own cars

Let me tell you about this one crazy trick to avoid the "cash grab"

Manabouttown, people might start to change their way of doing things to use their cars less, supermarket delivery for example

If these councils don't put signs up, people will enter the zone without knowing it and therefore not pay the £12.50 charge and incur a penalty on top.

Right.

If that happened to me, I'd appealing the charge. It might be that it's TfL's responsibility to make sure the zone is properly signposted and in that case they should pay for the signs. But it might turn out to be the responsibility of the individual councils.

Councillors can be surcharged for wilfully wasting public money. That means held personally liable for paying it back.

If I was a local councillor I wouldn't want to risk it even if I was told I had a strong legal case. I mean, look what happened the other week when they spent £1 million of local taxpayers' money taking TfL to court believing they had a strong legal case.

If these councils don't put signs up, people will enter the zone without knowing it and therefore not pay the £12.50 charge and incur a penalty on top.

I thought they were refusing to put up the cameras required to 'catch' drivers?

They are refusing to sign an agreement allowing the zone's signs within their borders.

The whole thing is awful

Based on the current proposals, Cllr Roberts warns the Mayor that the county council will not permit any ULEZ signage or enforcement cameras to be located within the boundary of the county.
https://www.thecomet.net/news/23672122.sadiq-khan-warned-ulez-signs-cameras-herts/

He can say what he likes. If it goes to court, a judge might decide against him and all other councillors who voted for the decision to refuse. A judge might agree with them, though so he might decide it's a risk worth taking.

Cllr Roberts is a bit old school, and narrow of thinking

@ScribblingPixie That report was on 22 July.

ULEZ was declared legal by a judge on 28 July so Cllr Roberts is probably having a rethink.

I'm sure he'll be back though.

Exactly this! I frankly can't believe the amount of people who can't see this.

Last time I looked 'freedom of movement' was a thing, not dependent on whether you can fork out £12.50 a day!

This has nothing to do with cleaning up the air and everything to do with Sadiq Khan needing to fill a financial black hole in TFL and keeping his paymasters of 'C40 Cities' happy.

Yeah we have been living under the fascist state of the congestion charge for 20 years in central London - it's just like Nazi Germany. 🙄

Are you sure your tin foil hat is on securely?

People have been paying the congestion charge in London for 20 years. Comparing it to Nazi Germany is ridiculous and offensive. People have a choice - I choose to never drive into central London.

I don't agree with the expansion of Ulez in its current form, but it's going to happen. I suspect like the congestion charge there is a lot of noise now but it will just be accepted. Just beware if it's coming to all of London, including leafy outer boroughs, it'll almost certainly be coming to your town too.

Jumpingthruhoops, 46% of london households do not own a car. Are they also feeling trapped by 'the controlling fascist state', or do they in fact live freer lives moving around the city on public transport and bikes?

@jenbj no I wouldn’t drive into central London either and I wouldn’t have a car if I lived in central London. When I lived in zone 4 I had a car but didn’t use it much. BUT, and there is a but, the problem is that some people don’t have a choice because there are no public transport options that get them to work, hospital appointments etc. This is a particular problem for people who live outside London but have to travel into the outer boroughs. For example, when my FIL was having chemo he requested hospital transport but was told that it wasn’t available. He lives just outside the M25. The hospital was within it. Central London is very different public transport wise to some of the outer boroughs and even more so to some of the areas just outside the M25.

I completely agree with this. I live in an outer borough and have a car which I drive locally. My public transport options are pretty good but in some parts of the borough they are not. I don't disagree in principle with the expansion of Ulez, but the way they have rolled it out to entire London boroughs is ill thought out and penalises those living in the outer parts of the boroughs and those just outside. And it's all about money, whatever Khan says, otherwise it would be a gradual phase out over months and years of non compliant cars and not an option to pay per day.

I travelled thorugh both the current ULEZ and congestion charge areas today - it was just like living under a repressive I tell you.