What’s going on with working hours these days?

[CateringPanic]

I work in the public sector. My working hours are broadly 9-5 although I can flex this if I want to eg. 8-4, with 30 minutes for lunch. Either way it’s 37.5 hours a week which I thought was standard for full time work. I’m reasonably senior so obviously I might sometimes choose to work late to get stuff done but these are my contracted hours.

BILs girlfriend is young, early 20s and in her second job out of uni (was only in first for 6m). Her old job was 9-6 and her current one is 8-5. She thinks this is normal - I think her employers are taking the piss.

She is salaried, not hourly paid, and these are low skilled, low stress administration jobs so no real need to work long hours at all.

AIBU to think this is more than full time work and she shouldn’t have to be working an extra 5 hours a week for crap money or am I just out of touch with how things are out there?

I can do 7.30-4.30, 8-5 or 9-6 hour lunch.

My guess is that her employer would claim she is working a 40-hour week, not a 45-hour week, because her 9-hour day includes an hour's unpaid lunch break. That's what my first employer used to claim (until we pointed out that as we weren't being paid for the lunch break, we should be allowed to forego it to eat at our desks and finish at 5pm instead, and they compromised by making our hours 9am to 5.30pm).

That wouldn’t be legal, though. You have to take at least a 20-minute break after six hours’ work.

There is a difference between workers having a right to take a break if they want, and workers being forced to take a break when they would rather finish early.

I think it’s fair enough as long as they are clear what the working hours are when they advertise the role. Then it’s up to people whether those hours work for them and if they want to apply.

if the hours aren’t clearly advertised then yes it’s crap.

No, you cannot legally opt out of the statutory break. You can choose to work through it if you like, but that doesn’t mean you can shorten your day by putting the break at the end, not the compulsory 20 minutes anyway.

If your hours are flexible because the role requires an unspecified number, then yes you can absolutely choose to leave early. You're using the public sector / shift work attitude, where hours and breaks are mandated. Lots of roles don't have specified hours in that way, the individual has more control over them. They might choose to work through hours or leave early.

If one of my team had a report to do and chooses to get up at 3am then finish for the day at midday or 1pm, I genuinely don't care, it's their work to organise however they see fit.I'm not going to be checking in, nor running around at 9am to see if they took a break, and the legislation doesn't require me to. Same if they are working with the US and find it easier to work 1-9pm, that's totally up to them and they can have a break or not, at whatever time, also up to them. If they have too much work then they say so, if they have time then they say so, they're employed as responsible adults

DS officially works 10-7 - but they have a rule that they have to stay until all orders are complete - if he is lucky he gets to go at 6 or 6.30, but some days he is still there at 9 pm

They are allowed to request to leave early if they have a specific event on one evening - but outside of that it makes it difficult for him to plan anything .

His GF works shifts and now has a set pattern but previously her hours have been worked as an average per month and she hasn't actually been given her shifts until the end of the previous week - so some weeks she would be on 5 or 6 long days or evenings and other weeks she would only have 3 short days work .

Both of their working patterns would make it difficult to arrange child care if needed in future.

Both minimum wage and no overtime or shift allowance

I worked for 5 years at a recruitment agency and the hours were 08:30 - 18:15 five days per week.

I'm late 40s and nowhere I've worked was more than 37.5 hours for full time. I've done 35, 37 and 37.5. my current workplace is 35 (charity), as was the one before last (private sector). I've also worked in the public sector, this was 37.5. all three have been flexible with hours, allowing me to start and finish early.

@TeachesOfPeaches thats disgusting!

I'm 7-4 with an hour unpaid lunch

Full shift in my place of work is 8 to 6 or 7:30 to 5:30 but you do get a day of a week.
40 hours is pretty standard I think.

9-5 here with an hours lunch

I work for a Local Authority and 37 hours is full time hours.
DH is private sector and has a 35 hour full time contract.
Ime office based tends to have shorter hours than manual work- no idea!
And London Full time contracts are shorter hours than out of london contracts.
I do think they hss been an erosion of working conditions. For example my teens have all been expected do work unpaid trial shifts of several hours for almost every job theyve applied for . They also dont have regular days or hours and never know one week to next what days and hours they will be working.

I work 42.5 hours a week (8-5) All managers and above do these hours.
All the admin level do 40 hours (8:30-5)

This is standard for the industry (construction) but they are long days!

I work in the public sector I worked thirteen hours yesterday, should've been 8, I ate some crackers at my desk for lunch.
I worked 9 hours today, and actually ate at lunchtime so better. I'm salaried for 37 a week. At least your girlfriend's employer is being honest about her hours

My contracted hours are 9-6 with an hour for lunch. I'd probably be fired if I only worked those hours. Can't remember the last time I took an hour for lunch.

I've mostly spent my career in the public sector and we were always paid on a 37.5h week which worked out as 8 hours a day - either 9-5 or 8-4 but the half hour lunch break was unpaid.

I also found that as I climbed the ladder the workload was such that I often worked longer hours at times, sometimes up to 12-14 hours a day. We never got paid for that overtime and was to,d we could take TOIL, but often the TOIL never happened. At one point in 2020 I had 3 weeks TOIL that I couldn't use because heath service in the middle of a pandemic reasons.

So it's not always as clear cut as shorter hours jn the public sector.

How can they fire you for working your contracted hours? Surely that's illegal?

Believe me, they’d find a way. Not meeting expectations etc. The reality is I can only meet expectations by working about 50 hours a week. I don’t mind, I’m very well paid. But that’s the price I pay for a decent salary.

I had an employer like that 8:30 - 5:30. 1 hour unpaid lunch... I used to go out as I wanted a break. Colleagues usually stayed in and had lunch at their desks. No other space available.

It was mentioned at my appraisal that it's been noted that I am out for my lunch (& like to leave on time) This is fine but I should think about my colleagues that are staying behind and don't go out / leave on time. WTF!
Needless to say that I didn't stay long in the job.

Employers can only take the piss if you let them.

Disclaimer: this was a basic office job for a bit more than min wage and I had DC to pick up from childcare.

I'm mid 30s and work in the private sector in tech and the hours are technically 9 - 5:30 but we're expected to work much more than this to get things done - there's not really clock watching as such. I think my hours are reasonable compared to some of my friends though. My friends who work for private law firms work insane hours i.e. up to 100 hour weeks (yep they barely sleep) - the lawyers are obviously paid a lot but frequently burn out. My doctor and teacher friends also work very long hours. I don't know many of my friends where it's a set 37.5/40 hour week but we're generally on decent salaries and I'm not sure if that's part of it.

But those decent salaries become not so decent if you're doing loads more than the contracted hours. My boss works crazy long hours, his hourly rate is probably less than mine, even though he's on £20k more than me. This expectation to do more than the contracted hours is totally wrong.