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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Internal job applicants grrr....

55 replies

NameChange245 · 11/07/2023 16:05

I'm in a job where, to make the leap to the next pay band is hard as 1. There a few posts nationally, and 2. Within my own organisation the 2 people in this role are not planning to leave any time in the next 10 years (and even if they were, there are others on my pay grade who'd go for the job and may get it ahead of me).

I have applied for jobs in this higher band elsewhere I the country 3 times in the last 3 years (that's how often they come up). The last two times the job went to an internal candidate. The most recent interview (last week) I got the distinct feeling an internal candidate had already been picked. I am waiting to hear if I have got the job but am 95% sure I haven't and an internal candidate has been safely secured the job since before my interview

AIBU to hate the fact that jobs who have already been ear marked for someone often have to been advertised externally? It's a waste of everyone's bloody time and money. I bought new clothes for the interview, wasted time preparing, travelled quite far (so had to take the whole day off for the interview). Not to mention the emotional toil (I loved the job spec, the panel, the role, everything! I realllly wanted this job!! and had the skills and experience)

I have been on the other foot as an interviewer, where I have a great employee wanting to step up, but have to go to the faff of advertising and interviewing just to select the candidate I had in mind all along. It's unfair on the external applicants and a big waste of time for them and me. It is pointless.

I work in the public sector and it worries me how much money is wasted needlessly advertising posts externally which are unlikely to go to an external.

Having been on both sides of the coin here, I just find that I hate the process so much! Why can't we have a process of promotion - so if someone is doing well we can step them up to the new pay band without the need to advertise and the person have to be interviewed against external applicants? It would save so much time and money, not to mention that it would mean when a job is advertised externally, external candidates do actually stand a chance.

Grrr... rant over!

OP posts:
Inthesamesinkingboat · 11/07/2023 16:10

I had this with BP, saw my dream job, booked a hotel room the night before the interview took time off work. Was told I was their preferred candidate but they were giving it to an internal candidate as they already had established networks. I was livid. It was a colossal waste of time and money. They already had a candidate in mind- so much so that they wouldn’t even consider a better hire….

Nordicrain · 11/07/2023 16:12

We have to advertise for all jobs - whether we've already found a candidate (internal or external) or not. It's company policy. We wouldn't though interview anyone else for it,that would be a waste of everyone's time.

KeepingMySpreadsheetUpToDate · 11/07/2023 16:17

omg. had exact same with BP. even went as far as getting me to pick a company car. was 100 years ago but never forgot the experience. apparantly they were using threat of me ie the external person to internal person re salary. @Inthesamesinkingboat

Wenfy · 11/07/2023 16:24

Bank of England did this to me. They already had the manager’s daughter in mind for a role (i know this as I met the daughter and the stupid girl admitted it during lunch). Having met the other candidates in the assessment stage I knew I was the best candidate. Then at the last stage of the interview process the manager (whose daughter it was) basically tried to question my experience for the role, then when that failed started cracking jokes about my wedding ring. It was so unprofessional it was a joke. I made a formal complaint but nothing was done with it.

SadKendall · 11/07/2023 16:25

Nordicrain · 11/07/2023 16:12

We have to advertise for all jobs - whether we've already found a candidate (internal or external) or not. It's company policy. We wouldn't though interview anyone else for it,that would be a waste of everyone's time.

Same. I completely agree it's shit op.

We have to advertise even if we're 99% sure we know who we would like to give the job to internally. And of course the internal candidate score as higher on interview on team fit/experience of systems/experience of process etc, because they've already been working along side us. I hate wasting externals time.

But we don't have a choice, it's company policy, even if it's wasting our time and the external candidates time.

We've asked to bypass the interviews on a few occasions as we already have our internal candidate we want to give it to, but we're not allowed to skip the process.

DahliasEverywhere · 11/07/2023 16:34

I went for an interview at a college, starting at 9.00 am. There were 5 of us there, which wasn’t expecting, and was told then that it was an all day interview. They didn’t start till 9-45 as candidate number 6 hadn’t turned up. So individual interviews, group tour, group interview(number 6 finally turned up and apologised to interviewer (using her first name, which no one else knew) for thinking interview was the next day. It was pretty obvious to the rest of us then who was getting the job. Went home about 4 and had a phone call before 5 to say number 6 had got the job.

Dumbphone · 11/07/2023 16:36

Massively agree - it’s actually cruel, and messed up. It’s pathetic that companies can’t find a way to manage this better.

GoblinAeroplane · 11/07/2023 16:39

Where I work, we have to advertise all jobs internally and externally, but will mark it as 'preferred candidate identified', so it's clear that there is an internal candidate already in mind. Hopefully goes some way to not wasting people's time. Still plenty of folk apply though, so not a deterrent, just a heads up.

Chewyspree · 11/07/2023 16:43

Uh-huh.

I’ve applied for 7 jobs in the past 4 months and each one has gone to an internal candidate. I am so tired. It’s expensive, time consuming and emotionally draining.

Frustratingly, each time I’ve had really lovely feedback. I’ve even had ‘you were our preferred candidate’ but each time it’s gone to the internal.

Talipesmum · 11/07/2023 16:46

We’ve had roles that we’ve advertised internally, found no one, spent months getting permission to put it out externally then someone pops up internally and is suddenly free to move. But if candidates are good we will keep them in mind for future roles and if they come up soon we don’t need to re interview. Or we get loads of external candidates but they’re not great, and we pick the best few to interview but in person they don’t work out. I’ve seen external candidates winning out over internal ones as well so it works both ways.

Invisibleeye · 11/07/2023 16:46

I’ve had a few “you’ve not got the job” phone calls where I’ve been told “you were the strongest candidate but…” Often it’s either an internal candidate, someone who trained there, someone’s best friend etc. It’s so demoralising especially when you’re out of work.

Pastlast · 11/07/2023 16:49

I agree this has been souls destroying for me over the past year. One involved a 2000 word essay application, presentation, interview, role play and final interview. They gave it to the internal candidate. Hours of my life and hopes went into that application. There’s been a couple more like this. I now try to speak to the recruiter beforehand to ask about the role and include a well phrased question along the lines of ‘are you looking for someone with more relevant and recent experience of this area?’

Original poster
NameChange245 · 11/07/2023 17:34

SadKendall · 11/07/2023 16:25

Same. I completely agree it's shit op.

We have to advertise even if we're 99% sure we know who we would like to give the job to internally. And of course the internal candidate score as higher on interview on team fit/experience of systems/experience of process etc, because they've already been working along side us. I hate wasting externals time.

But we don't have a choice, it's company policy, even if it's wasting our time and the external candidates time.

We've asked to bypass the interviews on a few occasions as we already have our internal candidate we want to give it to, but we're not allowed to skip the process.

Show quote history

Yes, it's exactly this where I am. It's so frustrating. I feel really bad for the external candidates as many will have put lots of effort into the day, taken time off, spent time preparing etc .. It's such a waste of time and money

OP posts:
Original poster
NameChange245 · 11/07/2023 17:35

GoblinAeroplane · 11/07/2023 16:39

Where I work, we have to advertise all jobs internally and externally, but will mark it as 'preferred candidate identified', so it's clear that there is an internal candidate already in mind. Hopefully goes some way to not wasting people's time. Still plenty of folk apply though, so not a deterrent, just a heads up.

That's good! Wish we could do that. Sadly would not be.

OP posts:
Original poster
NameChange245 · 11/07/2023 17:38

Pastlast · 11/07/2023 16:49

I agree this has been souls destroying for me over the past year. One involved a 2000 word essay application, presentation, interview, role play and final interview. They gave it to the internal candidate. Hours of my life and hopes went into that application. There’s been a couple more like this. I now try to speak to the recruiter beforehand to ask about the role and include a well phrased question along the lines of ‘are you looking for someone with more relevant and recent experience of this area?’

Yes. I think I need to find a way to ask if there is an internal candidate in mind before applying, and ideally if there is any point applying.

OP posts:
Outdamnspot23 · 11/07/2023 17:41

It's the same where I work. And I don't know whether this is better or worse but we actually often see the opposite outcome where the internal candidate (i.e. person who is very competent and probably already effectively doing the job they're applying for) loses out to the external candidate "as they just did better/got one point more than them on the day, even though we knew Internal would be better in the job".

It's the complete lack of common sense that gets me. I understand that it's supposedly for fairness but no-one really feels it is fair, whether the internal candidate gets an edge or the external candidate gets the job for being a better interviewee even when the job involves completely different skills (e.g. being methodical at paperwork).

Alwaysoneoddsock · 11/07/2023 17:42

My company does this and says it is to promote fairness. I think it’s prejudiced against those with less money as candidates have to pay travel and sometimes accommodation costs to attend an interview for a job they have no chance of getting.

ArcticBells · 11/07/2023 17:44

Has happened to me twice with an NHS advertised job .

ChessieFL · 11/07/2023 17:50

I got a job and found out later that before my interview everyone had been convinced it was going to go to a certain internal person, as they hadn’t expected someone with my skills to apply externally. So it can happen.

ZebraLyghts · 11/07/2023 17:51

On the flip side I had the opposite of this at a national charity I worked at for years, they never (very rarely) gave the jobs to internal applicants. Huge turnover.
Interviewing for jobs caused a bit of awkwardness when the job went to a new person, and you were back at your desk but were left with your manager knowing you were actively looking for a new job (there were a few situations like this, one manager of mine even demanded the interviewer not give me the job in question as she wanted to keep me, and he obeyed! He told me about it afterwards 😂)

Sleepytimebear · 11/07/2023 17:59

I work in the NHS and I've had candidates ring to ask me if there is an internal candidate applying, which there wasn't and I said so. I'm sure most interviewers would be honest if asked? On the flip side, I've received 20+ applications for a role where the candidates don't meet any of the essential criteria some of which are a specific qualification, a specific degree and specific experience. I have to read these applications, score them and then justify why they aren't being shortlisted for interview. Its a huge waste of my (and the other panel members' time).

LlynTegid · 11/07/2023 18:01

I wonder if some jobs are advertised and go through a process to avoid allegations of unfair practices. Or to make sure the chosen person does not see it as a given and has to make an effort.

saveforthat · 11/07/2023 18:12

I had a similar experience recently. I applied for a very similar job to my current job in a different branch of my organisation. I met all the advertised essential criteria. The other candidate already worked in the branch and was missing relevant experience. He got the job, they are now putting him through a training course to bridge the gap.

Capitulatingpanda · 11/07/2023 18:24

DahliasEverywhere · 11/07/2023 16:34

I went for an interview at a college, starting at 9.00 am. There were 5 of us there, which wasn’t expecting, and was told then that it was an all day interview. They didn’t start till 9-45 as candidate number 6 hadn’t turned up. So individual interviews, group tour, group interview(number 6 finally turned up and apologised to interviewer (using her first name, which no one else knew) for thinking interview was the next day. It was pretty obvious to the rest of us then who was getting the job. Went home about 4 and had a phone call before 5 to say number 6 had got the job.

I got a job over someone that 1 of the interviewers was determined should get job as she was friends with them and had trained them. She didn't have final say on hiring and I was better candidate and so she made my life hell until I quit. When there's a preferred candidate it's probably better not to get the job.

DahliasEverywhere · 11/07/2023 18:27

@Capitulatingpanda Hmmm, hadn’t thought of that scenario. You might be right. Still wish I hadn’t wasted all day of a day’s annual leave!

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