That two parents working doesn’t work

[Itsmyshadow]

We have 3 DCs aged 8, 4 and 1. DH works full time. I have recently returned from mat leave doing 4 days per week. On my day off I have DC4 and DC1 at home and a large part of that is taken up with swimming lessons.

I feel like I’m failing at everything to be honest. House is a state, am not on top of my work, kids in nursery and after school club for long hours, and don’t even get me started on the amount of after school sporting activities DC1 does which don’t really fit with going to work.

DH is a great dad, does his fair share with the kids, does 50% of the school / nursery runs, and most of DC1’s after school sporting stuff (whilst I have the younger two). He could pull his weight a bit more with the housework but gets off his bottom when I huff and puff / nag, and does all of the DIY and garden. Like most women I carry the mental load, doing all the school, nursery, medical admin etc.

I feel like I need to do a real half arsed job of my work on my wfh days to keep on top of the washing / house / kid admin / kid homework (saw a thread on here the other day about that), but workload / conscience won’t let me do that, and that doesn’t solve for the fact that DC1 has football at 5:30 on a Tuesday or hockey at 6pm on a Wednesday and if I finish at 5pm and I’m in the office, those timings don’t work.

We have a cleaner and a robot vacuum, but I still can’t keep on top of all the crap all around the house (paintings from nursery, party bag loot, paper admin that needs addressing, magazines etc), and feel like the kids get given toys / grow out of clothes much faster than I can get sort through the old ones. Result is a massive mess of a playroom that I keep getting half through sorting before the kids mess it up again and there’s nowhere for everything to go.

Don’t talk to me about TOMM or similar. I’m not lacking motivation or direction. I spend hours per week washing and putting away clothes, batch cooking, sorting through piles of stuff, firefighting cleaning tasks (usually when something mouldy is discovered or someone has spilt something somewhere), but no sooner is something done it’s a complete mess again.

So those of you who work a lot of hours and have young kids. How are you managing? Do you spend hours every evening cooking and cleaning (how do you find the energy if so?), and how to you manage the demands of kids after school activities / social lives?

Agree with all this.
Jobshare is miles better than part time (I’ve done both, now back to full time) - not only are you not doing unpaid compressed hours, but you can properly switch off from work because you know there is someone else handling things, it’s not just piling up.
And competitive parental martyrdom for sporting activities is not achievable when both are working - DC need to pick favourite activity from a shortlist of what is practically achievable.

Hope things get better for you - if only to give yourself permission to not mind too much about the things that are not getting done, while the DC are still small

I cope by lowering my standards - the house is much messier than I'd like (we tidy up immediate floor toys every night, but the levels of clutter are well beyond what I'd like), but telling myself it's not forever, and somethings gotta give! I'd also be doing less extra curricular in your shoes. DONT feel everything has to be perfect- good enough is good enough!

I wish I knew the formula to make it work, but don’t. I spend evenings & wknds doing batch cooking to keep on top of meals. It’s a constant battle of getting kids to their school & after school activities. I’ve shown partner how to use washing machine so that’s a huge help - not quite mastered putting away etc! Kids have to muck in too now they’re old enough to: hanging washing, emptying dishwasher - a bit of a military operation but everyone plays their part. I try doing blasts of cleaning: what can I realistically achieve in say 20mins. I don’t iron if I can help it - careful hanging of clothes helps with that! All things to try & make things easier for me.

Could you cut back to 3 days a week work until your 4 year old is at school full time? I know my DD did 3 days a week until youngest GDS went to school full time then moved back to 4 days a week.

My house was a bit of a mess and I had no cleaner. They’re 14 and 17 now so the hard times are long past!

I have a 4 year old and 2 years old and work 34 hours a week over 4 days and I feel the strain too and that’s before after school clubs etc. I try not to sit down once they’re in bed until everything is sorted but put less pressure on myself to make the house look perfect. I’m trying to be better at keeping on top of the washing during the week but that’s easier when the weather is nice because I can put a load in before I go to bed on a timer so one of us can hang it out before we go to work. I long for 5 minutes to myself but also know that they won’t be little for long and I’ll miss this chaos one day.

I also use the slow cooker a lot so there’s less chaos at the end of the day!

I rarely cook a curry/chill/pasta sauce etc which is not at least double the amount or more. More often than not I cook 4 times the amount and it means there is tea for tonight plus 3 other meals. I have a massive soup pot/casserole dish (sort of preserving pan size). Takes slightly longer to cook that meal, just because of the amount of food in the pot - but it means 3 easy meals later down the line.

Even if I am cooking some sausages, I will often cook double and freeze the cooked ones - they can then be chucked in a quickly made up tomato/bean sausage casserole base.

Sorry, not read the whole thread. Could you manage if you worked PT or earned less? Do you earn enough to employ some help? Is your job worth keeping, ie will it progress well after your DC are all at school and you can work FT again?

I do all cooking, shopping and life admin as well as drop off.
DH does all pick ups and cleaning.
We share washing/clothes putting away etc
Limit DS to only three extracurricular activities a week.

Works well for us

Single parent here of 2. I manage with a weekly cleaner who tidies as well as cleans. I batch cook for 2/3 days a time. I'm lucky as I wfh but have a very busy role so no real quiet periods. I also accept that as long as I'm about 80% there, it's fine. So the house isn't perfect etc but it's OK. I genuinely can't see how you can't manage with two people sharing the load.

This is why we stopped at two. When I saw the sheer amount of work that two involved, I couldn't imagine adding in a third one. I'd be over capacity like you are.

I completely sympathise, we have 2 children and a dog and sometimes I feel ontop of it and other times not. It's the life "admin" that gets me.

For us, it made sense for me to go down to 3.5 days a week and to not go for a promotion for now which means me job is easier/less stressful; husband is full time but has busy and quiet patches. We both WFH part of the time. Could one of you reduce a few of your hours, or you both WFH more, or one of you give yourself the ok to take your foot of the gas career wise? Is there anymore jobs you can afford to outsource - you mentioned you have a cleaner but worth thinking if there is anything else?

Also, for your older two, do they help? Could you get them to start? Mine didn't really, and the place was always covered in stuff. I now expect them to help more (they are 4 and 6) and they do. They get £2 each at the end of the week if they have helped lots without moaning about it.

Is this living? It sounds awful. When do you have time to breathe let alone think? When do you just enjoy your children?

I have no desire to martyr myself for the sake of a dreary career and to look like I’m financially contributing while running myself into the ground. I made it very clear to my now husband on our third date that I wanted to be a housewife and mother. It didn’t frighten him off and here we are ten years later with a loving marriage, a truly loved and wanted child and I work hard in the house homeschooling and taking care of my family.

If you can afford it, stay home and enjoy your family and let them enjoy a frazzle free life with a happy mother. As the children grow older you can always return to work.

It’s really hard when they are young. We both had big jobs in the city and the only way I managed it was by outsourcing everything that wasn’t fun and having a live in nanny (then later au pair when they were both in school).

A live in nanny is a much cheaper childcare solution than multiple nursery places if you have the room. It was the nanny’s responsibility to rotate clothes, kids laundry, sort out toys and take to charity shop etc. cook and clean for the kids, food shop for the kids.

I had an ironing service, a gardener, and a house-keeper 2 full days per week.

I also made sure my commute was within half an hour and I was always home by 6.30 at the latest even if that meant working after they were in bed.

Nearly all my salary went on outsourcing and it was still difficult. Felt guilty most of the time.

But I don’t regret it. Once they were a little older, it gradually got better and I love that I managed to keep my career and have a family.

I hear you. Let's face it, ithese days, n most families where both adults work FT, it's no longer affordable to be able to outsource everything or get an au pair as often happened when I was young in the 80s. Most families that I knew had either a SAHM or a mum who worked PT. I didn't know any dads who had the "home" role but definitely in the 80s for working class or middle class families there was usually someone around for some of the week or some of the day. It was virtually unknown for both parents to be working FT and for children to be in wraparound care. In the families I knew where both parents worked FT then there was a nanny or an au pair involved or a grandparent who lived in the house who did the "home" role.

I agree, it's not a question of not having the motivation. I have the motivation, I don't like a messy house, and I like everything organised, but I just don't have the bloody ENERGY. I haven't got it in me at the end of my day and neither has DH. When my hours were slightly reduced during COVID, I had the time and more energy and my house was pristine. I'm just not buying it that I'm not organised enough. I don't want to be running round from 6am literally all day till 10pm when I flop into bed. I don't get breaks in work and I'm exhausted when I get home. I'm not a robot and I need some downtime and to have a life that doesn't involve paid work /cooking /shopping/cleaning/gardening/laundry/tidying./exercising my exhausted body and ferrying kids here and there.

The last few years have been extra hard in terms of work, and I do feel we pay our kids less attention. They probably don't mind much now as they're late teens but still, I feel we're less close and I know less about their lives, which makes me sad. I WANT to be there when they come in from school and have had a shit day and want to talk it through with someone. I don't WANT them to go straight on the PC and take refuge in online gaming and then ignore me when I DO come in and ask how they are. THe natural moment to talk things through has passed for them.

In short, no, we fucking CAN'T have it all anymore. We've been sold down the swanee.

That all sounds good if you have the household income to afford it. But ordinary families on ordinary salaries, sometimes below average salaries, need solutions too. That don't involve outsourcing.

I honestly think it’s only doable by heavily outsourcing. Meal delivery, cleaner multiple times a week (even better a housekeeper), gardener, nanny for wrap around/pick ups/holidays/child free time.

Which all obviously requires high earnings and needing to work even harder at your ‘day job’. And being able to run your home like a small business with various staff.

pros and cons to this just as much as there is to being a SAHP, and everything in between - you have to work out what is sustainable for you and your family. Good luck OP, you’re definitely not alone feeling this way.

Should add - or lots of family help. Which we do not have.

You are completely right, I wouldn’t have been able to do it at all if I didn’t have a salary that could pay for it.

I would have had to give up work.

But my point regarding a live in nanny still stands. It’s often cheaper than 2 or 3 kids in nursery and they can do other stuff to stay on top of life admin as well as get your kids to activities, play dates etc.

I agree with you OP it doesn’t work when you’ve got young kids. I have one and find it hard!!! My health is dire since having a baby and working. Aren’t we supposed to be ‘having it all’??? I feel like I’m having nothing properly and being used by everyone… good luck to you, I don’t know what the answer is because truth is capitalism doesn’t value mothers. X

I have binned full time work as of this week. 2 boys aged 9 and 11. I am married and both of us worked full time through it all until now.
However , over the past few months both boys need real needed help with schoolwork or emotionally and each have own challenges. And I felt like my relationship with DH was fading. Working until 6pm and again after they have gone to bed no longer works.
I loved the financial security of working FT and thought it was hard to juggle, I didn’t feel that they missed out on much , maybe some guilt at long nursery days and after school clubs and fewer play dates . 2 working parents allowed numerous weekend breaks and lovely days out on a whim. But right now they do need me and I am done with prioritisating my career, pension etc over my children’s needs. Will be poorer but hopefully no regrets and time to work FT in few years. My role is unforgiving as part-time. (basically expected to work FT in PT hours) so going for a complete change.
so excited.
I think what I am saying to OP, sometimes it works and sometimes not and I think you know what is right for you and when.

Yanbu

virtually same situation in our family. I was constantly on the go either working, housework or ferrying dc. Had cleaner etc like you. But a year after being back after dc3 I burntout and started loosing my hair from stress. My very understanding boss let me reduce my hours and now my youngest is going to school I’m thinking of upping them a bit but not to a full 4 days yet anyway.

personally that was the best option for me but if you can’t/don’t want to do that you need to look at what else you can outsource or let go of for a while.

Doesn't work for us,
If we work the same shifts, then childcare and transport to DDs school and dog walking cancels out one of our wages, and the house is a state. No one wins there.

If we do opposite shifts, I'm leaving before he gets home and he will often need to leave late for work when I arrive home at 6am- 6:15. I don't get to sleep until DS has a nap in the day. I run myself into the ground to make it work and it still feels like in absolutely failing as the nights are when I do bulk of cleaning, washing etc and no one picks up that slack.

Whilst the youngest is young, I will not be working full time. I'll find small projects to keep money coming in to pay for holidays etc but consistent full time work does not and will not work for both of us

Please give yourself a break. You've only just returned to work, you need some time to get used to the transition period before you find a routine. Also your life will be messy. There's no point in stating otherwise. Don't compare yourself with people. Your situation is not the same as another person's (even if they have the same number of kids as you). If it helps make a list of 3-5 things that are important to you as a family. If you hit those 3-5 over the course of a week then you're doing grand e.g. adventure, security, health, loved (if you've got decent food into them, they know they're safe and loved whilst in childcare, you spend a bit of quality time with each). That way when things get too much you can remind yourself that 'sure the house looks like a bomb site but it's not one of my priorities in life so that's that'. Be nicer to yourself!! It's hard! But try to remember why you decided to have 3 kids and keep hold of that!