To think they shouldn’t close 1,000 rail ticket offices?

[TiredArse]

Latest plan to ‘improve’ the railways. Up to 1,000 will close.

We’ll be left with those shitty, self service machines that are a pain to use on a good day. Got a disability or struggle to use a machine? Tough shit. Got a query? Tough shit.

Does anyone actually believe that the money saved will reduce fares or improve services?

You can fill in the consultation form here - not easy to see, you have to click on the words ‘consultation response form’. https://www.transportfocus.org.uk/train-station-ticket-office-consultation/

Who doesn’t?

Oh dear. It's not a case of people not wanting to learn. It's about elderly people who carnt learn how to use apps etc because of eye slight, dementia, etc. Do you know anyone with early alzermas? Because I do and it's not as simple aslearning new things 🙄. Younger people can have strokes, again it's not a simple case of learning new things. Have a word with yourself.

As a disabled user who needs a ramp it's going to make it many times harder, not only trying to get hold of a staff member to deploy the ramp to get on (and if they aren't there ready you won't be allowed to board and bumped to the next train) there's also that fear of nobody being at the other end to let you off...

I book my assistance on the app but then you still need to find a member of staff at the station, even with offices it can be a nightmare in some (reading I'm looking at you) so without it will be many times worse!

Some people are definitely more technically minded than others. It's a fact of life , but it can and does go wrong for people regardless and we all need some human interaction sometimes.
I Was listening to a young caller on lbc this morning worried about more AI and voice recognition and how won't always be used for the greater good either. I've heard this from other people too.

My mum's 85. She's very mobile and amazing for her age, but she really struggles with buying train tickets online or from a machine. She has questions to ask - will she be able to return via X route? Is her dog allowed on the train? Would it be cheaper to come back before 4pm? Will her ticket still be valid if she misses the train she has seat reservations for? For her, trying to find the answers to her concerns from a computer is utterly confusing and soul-destroying. Also, she gets flustered if she's trying to work the ticket machine and a line of people build up behind her.

Most of her friends are the same (those of whom who are actually mobile enough to get the train).

For those suggesting that people buy their ticket on the train, it is much more expensive that way!

Such a shame - older people should be able to enjoy what independence they still have, while they still can. My mum and her friends will become virtual prisoners if this goes ahead.

Absolutely not. Skilled staff with knowledge of the network will be lost. People will have to travel to buy railcards etc and nobody will be in a known location to assist disabled people or provide advice/information.

It's a decision made by the free market. Unless we legislate for it and ban train companies from doing this I don't see it changing.

Very sneaky how the consultation website makes it hard to give feedback.

I suspect the decision has been made and everything else is window dressing

@Happyfluffball It really isn't a "free market decision". The train operating companies are simply implementing what the dft (government) want. The way the railways are set up post COVID the operating companies simply provide a service as mandated by dft in every respect. Essentially the dft take the ticket revenue and the toc get a "management fee" (this also explains why TOCs have little to zero incentive to run the best service possible or make improvements).

If the dft wanted to retain ticket offices, have more services or more new trains they could do this and the TOCs etx would comply (for an appropriate negociated cost).

The service the public gets on the railways is entirely a political decision. (And a don't think a change in government will change much either)

Not to suggest that this will be implemented at all well but I've been to other railway networks where un-manned stations are quite normal and I'd swap the frequency and quality in a flash.

But, as with many other things rail, we'll fuck it up

Based on the percentage of the white hair vote, it would be wise for the government to promise to reverse this decision in return for winning the next general election then.

Just last night I had a frantic phone call from my son because his second train had been cancelled (it takes him 4 trains to reach home) so he'd miss the connection for the last 2 trains! No one at the station to advise, he didn't know if his ticket would be accepted on another carrier so he went back to his digs. He was back at the station at 5 am this morning hoping to speak to someone about getting him home!

I agree. Took me ages to find the section, I nearly gave up. There are so many individual needs that are missed by sweeping generalisations. Those individuals need to be heard too. Modern alternatives alone are not the answer. You only have to try to speak to an individual in a company to realise this even trying to speak to a gp receptionist is getting harder more time consuming. It’s all very well saying children’s listening and speaking skills need to be a priority when you can’t get to speak more than yes no on an answering system that takes you round in circles never mind what it will be like when today’s children enter adulthood.

I love a ticket office, they are always helpful and get you the best deal ( i.e group save etc) i travel with 4 kids and machines dont always do best price like kids for a £1.
So personally Id prefer to have the choice of either going to ticket office or using a machine.

He was lucky he was able to go back

I’m technically minded

however I stare at the machine and go “I don’t fucking know”.
I want to get from here to there.
I don’t have a rail card.
i don’t know if it’s peak time or not.
I just know I have cash in my purse to get me to my destination.
You’ve (understandable) impatient frequent travellers behind who do know where they are going and know their train is imminent.

the pressure gets to me and “I don’t fucking know”

A lot of comments on here are totally immersed in its easy for me. However, some people, usually elderly or this with learning disabilities are not able to use apps or online booking sites.

my husband is absolutely useless with booking apps , I have to ensure the correct page is showing so his tickets are ready to be scanned.

I bet a lot of you say too many people don't want to work but companies making thousands unemployed are not helping.

I can't actually remember the last time I used a ticket office as I usually just buy on my phone in advance. Sometimes I do have to print the ticket on a machine, sometimes it is delivered to my phone.

Ticket offices are a useful point of reference though on the rare occasion I encounter a problem.

I expect plenty of ticket offices will close as so few tickets are purchased from them these days. However, I think that very large stations such as all of the London termini, Birmingham New Street, Manchester Piccadilly, Liverpool Lime Street (and others I am not familiar with) will need to keep some sort of an office due to the sheer volume of customers passing through them.

I do see this argument from all sides. I almost never use ticket offices and prefer my phone, but my mother would have difficulty. She doesn't have a mobile phone, never mind a smart phone, would be baffled by the ticket machines and due to arthritis in her hands finds contactless and chip and pin bank cards increasingly hard to use.

She is also a regular wheelchair or mobility scooter user so would need assistance to get to the platform (so can't use stations without working lifts) and on/off the trains. She doesn't travel much anymore.

It's a retrograde step, and I don't buy the excuse that the staff will still be there they'll just be on the platforms instead. If this is not a mass redundancy exercise and the staff will still be kept on, then why not give them an office to sit in? It's not like the station buildings are going to disappear.

There was a big wave of de-staffing that happened under British Rail in the 1960s and 1970s (the "managed decline" era following Beeching) and it resulted in lots of vandalism, crime and general disrepair. This just seems like more of the same.

If it's purely a question of revenue then turn the ticket offices into Costa coffee and get the staff to sell coffees as well as tickets. I would prefer that to closure.

100% agree. I now have to do so much more stuff myself that used to be done for me as part of a service and if you make a mistake well don’t look for the company to help - it’s your own fault - you did it wrong. I HATE doing the bank transfer stuff myself. If I made mistake entering the sort code or account number incorrectly by just one digit - forget trying to get your money back. A bank clerk used to do that for me and any mistake was down to the bank. Same with booking a flight - get someone’s surname wrong (spelling mistake or mistype) you can be left having to pay to do a “change of name”.

I was taken by surprise by having to weigh my own suitcases and attach the tags at Gatwick once (easy jet flight with Tui and hadn't been on a plane for a while at that time just after lockdown )
A few people had problems and only one lady trying to sort it all out for people who looked lost/ had problems or needed to check cabin bags were ok to take on the plane and so on.
Everything is becoming self service / no service

Bluntly put but yes agreed. There are so many people who fly into a panic with technology but the vast majority of the time it is as simple as just reading the instructions, especially on a ticket machine. My grandma was so resistant to using a smartphone for ages and once she learnt to use it she loves it- sometimes it is just a bit of gentle encouragement. Change is scary but we do need to make a distinction between those who are genuinely unable to use technology (certain elderly people, disabled people etc) and those who are resistant to learning.

@begaydocrime42

You agree with someone so ignorant about the ability of other people?

Again with a sample size of 1

We had this earlier this year at Gatwick, we took some sports gear that wasn't listed as a separate category and the member of staff we summoned also wasn't clear (so it wasn't just our own incompetence with tech!) ...so he had to ask someone else. Meanwhile several others might have had issues....

Just because it worked for one person dosent mean it's right for everyone. Your attitude is so blinkered.