To think they shouldn’t close 1,000 rail ticket offices?

[TiredArse]

Latest plan to ‘improve’ the railways. Up to 1,000 will close.

We’ll be left with those shitty, self service machines that are a pain to use on a good day. Got a disability or struggle to use a machine? Tough shit. Got a query? Tough shit.

Does anyone actually believe that the money saved will reduce fares or improve services?

You can fill in the consultation form here - not easy to see, you have to click on the words ‘consultation response form’. https://www.transportfocus.org.uk/train-station-ticket-office-consultation/

If only the machines worked...

They also don’t seem to have proper infrastructure in place. I was going through a fairly large station recently and only one gate could read online tickets (as in the others had a slot for a paper ticket and a plate to tap for a ticket on a card but no scanner for a ticket on a phone). The queues for the one gate were massive (start of the working day so professionals going to work - the sort of people more likely to have tickets on their phones).

Some of those tickets can only be purchased at a ticket office.

I haven’t used a ticket office in years and at my local station (a London suburb) it’s really rarely used. The 2 people that are there full time sit around chatting at the coffee hut or help man the shop/kiosk.

I also hate the generic ‘what about old people’ argument, old people aren’t all helpless and incapable of using a ticket machine! And if they are, there will still be people around to help out. All the ‘what if’ scenarios that get thrown about are probably only going to happen a few times a month and someone will be about to help I’m sure.

The main arguments to keep offices open I’ve heard are from people that use the trains/ the offices once or twice a year, not the commuters and the ones that this change would actually benefit and the ones that pay the most toward the service.

I have found that ticket machines may well give you cheaper ticket options than staff. After all, you have to give the machine the same information as the ticket office staff (destination, return / single, time of travel (peak or off peak), whether you have a rail card or not). If ticket office staff aren't asking for this info it's possible that you're paying more than you need to.

Yes a wheelchair user on the TV said this, it was something that was only at the office.

I’d rather keep the cost of rail travel down and just buy ticket via app / website/ machine (which to be honest I’ve been doing for the last 10 years anyway). I can’t remember the last time I bought a ticket at the station. My more elderly parents are the same. My wheelchair bound friend is very savvy about doing everything online as it suits them.

I’m in Europe on holiday at the moment and it’s very common here too (although admittedly public transport seems top notch compared to the uk). No ticket offices at smaller stations though and seems to function very well.

I suspect it’s happening anyway though and we’ll just get used to it like buying plane tickets online or using a parking machine to park a car.

using a parking machine to park a car.

Yes, because that's going so well at the moment 😆

People having to download a different app for each car park and mess about with validation emails, or getting scammed into scanning bogus QR codes. Great system.

I parked in a carpark the other day. The machine was broken. I have the app but accidentally put the wrong password in , it wouldn't let me try again so had to request a verification code. That never arrived, so had to request again via email, then put in, go to reset password etc....and had to pay 20p more to park than having to use the machine. The whole thing took 5 or 10 min ....and that's when I already had the app and am reasonably competent about using tech.

@Florenz the way our franchise works is the government get the revenue from the ticket sales. This is very much a government (RDG) led proposal.

They most certainly won't pass any cost saving on to passengers. They will still put the ticket prices up every year.

I don't disagree that train's are a mess in this country. It's a disgrace, we invented the train. We should have the best trains in the world., better than Japan with their "bullet train".

Or they're just doing what the government is telling them to do. The people who benefit the most from staffed stations are the most vulnerable, it costs more to assist them so if the government can discourage them from travelling then it's a saving.

Never mind equality etc., it's beancounting that matters.

Some, yes. It's a long way from most. For example someone who is visually impaired or who will be remaining in a wheelchair is entitled to a discount on Anytime tickets, even if they don't have a Disabled Railcard. The only way to purchase these discounted tickets is from a member of staff. Going forward therefore, many people with disabilities will not be able to obtain the discounts they are entitled to.

But then it's not like the government gives a stuff about people with disabilities, is it?

Occasional travellers are precisely the people the railway needs to attract in order to grow. Good experiences will lead to repeat business. Several operators are currently running marketing initiatives directed at occasional travellers so they must think them worth their while.

I'm an occasional traveller who was put off buying online by the surcharge on Trainline for what was a standard day return

While I definitely think the ticket offices should remain open, you don’t need to use trainline to buy online. If you check the website for your local train company, they probably sell tickets without the surcharge.

It's obvious that they are going to close. Everything is becoming nonpersonal these days - banks, closing etc. Nothing we say is going to stop that. They see it as : a very rare disabled person, or an equally rare elderly person who can't use the technology, is just not enough to justify the salary of a person to sit there selling tickets. I get that.

Disabled people are not rare

But not all disabled people will want or need to use a ticket office.

I'm reasonably competent using tech, and do 90% of banking online but I do occassionally need to pay cash or cheques in (yes I know you can on the app but there are limits with how much you can pay, and the cheque paying in facility with barely is very hit and miss - mostly miss!)
Yesterday I had 2 queries with my kids accounts at Metro. The first time we went in it was very busy so we went and did some shopping and went back.We spoke to someone, they opened new accounts and issued cards within about 15 min. To try and do that online or over the phone I'm sure would have taken a lot longer, and been faffy. Other people in there were paying money (coins)in, or querying direct debits. Obviously you can't pay cash in online, and I imagine you'd have to go through a whole load of menus or speak to a chat bot to sort out a direct debit. Even for people who are confortable with tech, and no disabilities there are still many scenarios where you might need to speak to a real person. (In both encounters I saw no one I would think of as elderly sobMN can't really do the usual ageist thing and dismiss it as an "old people who can't use tech" problem)

Do we need to demonstrate that every disabled person needs a ticket office before making reasonable accommodations for those who do?

@LorraineInSpain

But not all disabled people will want or need to use a ticket office.

Obviously not, but we are not talking about the people who don't need to use the ticket offices, we are talking about people who do - they are not rare.

Well according to the Sunday Times today 2000 redundancies are planned, so so much for no staff losing their jobs.

So we can expect even more strikes.

Does this mean that soon all railcards will have to be digital then? Atm I renew mine at the ticket office.

DD renews hers online, but has an actual card sent out (she breaks phones too often to rely on a digital one). I assume they’ll push more and more people into that