To feel angry at celebrating the NHS

[TaylorSwifting]

The NHS is falling apart and today people are all full of glee at the NHS yippee 75 years today, it’s making me so angry!!!!!!!!!
My family member has been diagnosed with cancer, 2 months down the line and has had no treatment and terrible delays for tests…..still yet to see an oncologist. 2 months!!!!!!!!! Family member only has pain management because us family have begged and fought to get it. It is an utter disgrace and I had no idea how bad things were until this awful diagnosis in our own family.
We are not alone / it hasn’t been a mistake or being lost in the system by accident! Record high cancer patient delays - this is what so many people are facing. I am in utter disbelief!
I won’t be celebrating today.

some people are ridiculous

It’s not the word I’d use. Inhumane, callous, hard hearted spring to mind more readily.

But the fact of the matter is at 90 your life does have less value than a younger person's. You have already lived it. You won't have the potential for much more no matter what the NHS do. The example of a PP who's daughter in her 20's has been put as a lower priority for colposcopy than a lady in her 90s is criminal in my opinion. So spending if spending so much time and money on treatment for the super elderly means that younger folk can't get seen then that needs to be sorted out.

I mean obviously id rather everyone had their needs met. But that's not happening is it?

They seem happy to ration based on ability. See the large scale issuance of DNRs to people with LDs and autism during the pandemic; and the poor outcomes for both groups within the NHS.
or indeed, the approach to Covid vaccinations. The elderly automatically prioritised, but people with LDs in residential care - at just as much risk - forgotten until Jo Whiley gave the issue some profile.

Well let's hope Baroness Hallett at the Covid Inquiry flushes these issues out.

As the parent of a teenager with LD I was paying attention then and I am now.

Personally I think a separate investigation into poor NHS outcomes for these groups is overdue.
I am glad to say my DS is healthy (touch wood); if he needed hospital treatment I would be very worried about disclosing that he has ASD. I do t say it would influence any conscious decisions but the bigoted assumptions about relative value of individuals are definitely there.

Bloody hell. Some people put a lesser value on kids with LD? That is fucking awful.

That isn’t what happened. Covid vaccinations were prioritised purely by age on the basis that age was the strongest indicator of mortality. Two months later people with leaning disabilities were included regardless of age.

And I don’t understand your outrage when you put a lesser value on people because they’re old. Bit hypocritical, isn’t it?

Actually no I don't think it is hypocritical. Elderly people have already lived their life. No matter what anyone does they won't have much left. Younger people could have decades ahead LD or not. I just read an article about Jo Wiley's sister. Wow.

They were only included after a campaign, in which Jo Whiley had a profile.
please, it’s well established there are problems with the NHS approach to people with LDs and ASDs. Look at the campaign by mencap if you don’t believe me. Don’t try and obscure this, it really isn’t fair on a very disadvantaged group.

Also, @Blossomtoes, whether you feel particular posters have a right to be disgusted doesn’t alter the fact it is disgusting. This is an important issue not an excuse for cheap point scoring.

I’m not trying to obscure it at all. You’re really excellent at putting words into people’s mouths, aren’t you?

These theories are fine. However, it's a case of your loved one, whatever the age or disability/health, you may take a different view on who's worthy and who isn't.🙄

You tried to say there wasn’t a problem with Covid vaccinations. There very much was. There had to be a bloody campaign about it!
maybe just admit you were wrong and apologise? This is a raw issue for lots of people.

I said

Covid vaccinations were prioritised purely by age on the basis that age was the strongest indicator of mortality. Two months later people with leaning disabilities were included regardless of age

That is factually correct. I won’t apologise for stating facts.

You should apologise when you omit a salient fact, which is that the vaccination effort for people with LDs only started after high profile efforts to bring the fact that they were at just as much risk.
you attempted to obscure this. That speaks very badly of you. Bear in mind there will be people reading this, possibly, who suffered at that time.

The thing is @Zebedee55 I don't think anyone wants to see care rationed based on age. But at the moment it's just not working is it? so something has to give. When there are people in their 30s dying of cancer because they aren't taken seriously/ keep getting appointments cancelled / the hospital has no space. And obviously no one wants their elderly loved one to be denied care. But I'm willing to bet most would prefer that to their child not getting care.

@AgathaSpencerGregson to be fair, while I don't agree with the views of the poster you are quoting, maybe they weren't aware of the way people with LD were unfairly not prioritised. It wasn't on my radar. I thought people in nursing homes were the highest priority - I realise now it was only elderly people in nursing homes and I'm fucking shocked. Also I'm really not sure how that passed me by tbh.

There was an investigation by PHE in November 2020 in to LD & Covid which went some way to redirecting policy.

Like many questionable decisions made in the pandemic it will be looked at in some detail by the Inquiry.

But frustratingly they don't get to the care sector (elderly or LD) until Module 6 so the public hearings will be in January 2025.

There has been some evidence from those working at LD Care Homes heard recently - linked to preparedness - and I think Mencap have already put in evidence.

They retired a lot sooner and many of the women were stay at home mums who didn’t work after having kids. That’s not to say they don’t deserve NHS care, but this ‘worked all their life’ thing isn’t quite true in many cases.

Partially agree! Budgeting is so bad, decisions take forever to make, wasteful expenditure is rife. BUT it’s a truly wonderful service when it works well and we should celebrate it

This is the crux of the matter. If we had abundant resources and staff, and chose not to treat elderly people (where there was a realistic prospect that they would have a quality of life), then yes that would be social engineering. I wouldn’t want that at all.

But equally PP is right, no matter how taboo it is to say it - a 90 year old has had their life, and a long one at that. They’ve had the chance to marry, have kids, grow old, enjoy retirement. And there are many people that will never do any of that because they’re receiving shoddy care due to the NHS being overburdened.

It’s easy to sit back and take a Disney view on things because that’s how things SHOULD be. But it isn’t reality is it?

Mil gave up work in her twenties to raise two DC and never returned. Like many thousands of women of her generation. She's now in her 80's.
And at 85, FIL has already had thirty years of retirement.

Of course it will. Read through some of the first hand accounts on this thread.

Decisions on vaccinations were made by public health England. Not the NHS.