Different personality or borderline rude?

[RainbowRuby]

Posting here because if I say this to someone in real life- it would be backbiting - so more of a vent.

We entertain our extended family routinely, once every couple of months and try to make a big effort as frankly we enjoy it and so do the kids. A cousins newly married wife (its now been 1.5 years) makes no effort to engage/talk. At first she comes across as a combination of being shy, struggling in a new marriage/relocation and very introverted personality. But they came over again yesterday (part of a larger group) and there was no effort to converse with me (or anyone else) and the only 'active' thing she did was scroll on her phone. No other 'attitude' as per say. Have tried to ask her about her/her life/interests multiple times. AIBU to think she is very rude and dull. We have cooked for 2 days, they stayed over (their choice/request - if she doesn't want to come - don't, nobody held a gun to her head. If her husband is making her, then sort it out with him). Or should I just accept that we are just different and don't click/will not click. I guess what is eating at me is her behaviour (or her personality) is getting under my skin whereas I like to believe I am a 'live and let live' and non-judgemental person. (but clearly she is testing this theory about myself :) )

I've always wanted to the the first to answer on a thread! And I am a judgmental person.

I think she's incredibly rude. She would be rude in most contexts, but considering you are her hosts it's ignorant behaviour. I would be very cool with someone like that and they'd have to do all the running from that point on.

You're probably spot-on when you say she's dull. Yes, she may just have nothing interesting to say and unable to manage to take an interest in anyone else or ask about others. In the end, you have to feel sorry for these people - but feeling sorry doesn't mean letting them off the hook. Ignore her too unless she warms a bit towards you.

lol - well done on being the first poster - you made me smile ! Thanks for verifying what's nagging at me. I mentioned it to my husband and he agreed lightly and brushed it off. Don't want to discuss it again and end up focusing on the only oddity in what was an otherwise a very nice weekend with bunch of loving (and not so rude) family. Even managed to host the whole weekend without my husband annoying me - now THAT is an achievement :)

Ok, if it were me, this would be my behaviour because I am autistic and take to my phone as a means of self soothing in stressful (in this case, social, unfamiliar people, unfamiliar place, out of routine, different food) situations.

Obviously I don't know the woman but it's a possibility.

It often occurs to me that people say they support others with poor mental health, are a safe space, safe person to talk to etc... Until they come across the actual symptoms of poor mental health.
Which tend to be unappealing, frightening, and incur judgment rather than understanding.
MH issues are, more often than not, not looking sadly out of a window needing someone to talk to. They are a hideous wildness in the mind, a storm nobody else can see. When it shows on the outside regular people distance themselves.

Ask your cousin is his wife OK as she seemed a little overwhelmed. She was in her phone all the time and barely said a word. Ask him if you have done anything to upset her

she may not realise she's doing it it will also highlight her rude behavior in a supportive way

I think she is rude. My adult DD is autistic and finds these situations difficult.
However she has learnt some stock questions to ask, eg ‘how’s the job going’ and has learnt to smile and look interested in what people are saying even if she finds it boring.

You mention she's newly married, how did she behave at their wedding? Did she interact or keep quiet?

I don’t think it rude, but I don’t take offence easily and don’t judge folks like that. As she came across as shy and deeply introverted I’d assume this was the issue and try to let her be, make her at ease, and certainly be kind.

I find it very unkind to judge her, because it’s highly possible she has anxiety or struggles to take part due to her introversion and is at least making then effort to be there.

What you describe does come across as rude. But I always try to consider that there are reasons for things being how they are. It may be she is really introvert and socially awkward and can't interact as you might expect. Perhaps you should just accept that is what she is like and just let her sit quietly in her little bubble while you get on with what you want to do. After all, she isn't really hurting anyone, even if she does seem less than grateful.

Absolutely agree. We all know many folks struggle as you do, but still we see folks piling in saying she’s rude, or make passive aggressive queries to her husband to highlight her “rude behaviour “

My first guess would be that she's an introvert/shy/AS and is feeling overwhelmed. Scrolling is her coping/self-soothing mechanism.
Be gentle.
It doesn't sound like rudeness.

Of course it's rude, whether or not a person has MH issues they should at least thank their host and give them flowers/wines/chocs.

We’ve got one of those, with a side dish of passive aggressive comments, raised eyebrows and eye rolling. It’s incredibly rude. She can behave perfectly politely when she feels like it, she just can’t be arsed most of the time.

It’s rude. Have you spoken to your cousin about it and asked if she’s alright though?

To be honest even if it is mental health or neurodiversity based it’s rude, and silly of him/ them not to say something to other people to help smooth the way.

So many ways to handle it… say ‘I’m a bit nervous to meet all the family at once’ or ‘I’m not feeling well is there somewhere quiet I can go please’ or anything really other than sit there silently scrolling in front of everyone. Most people will make allowances but not if they have nothing else to go on.

@ClemFandango1 @Maddy70 Your comments have made me self-reflect actually, wondering why I was struggling to be more understanding of this possibility. Thinking again, I think the chances you are right are very high. She is struggling. Question to myself is, why haven't I been more understanding and I figured out why - and it's a 'me' problem. The 'cousin' is actually my husband's - and when I first got married, one of his sisters was very rude to me (odd comments on my appearance, how well I'm 'performing' as a SIL and also crashing into my parents car like an idiot and crying to get off the hook). She also came to my house and stayed for 3 days - was a nightmare guest. But, everyone seems to love her. 💁Ok mumsnetters, so the problem is- I think I probably resent the fact that some people (her or her SIL) can get away with rudeness and people just laugh it off while in my books, its not laughable. It may be the poor girl is getting my resentment for someone else's rudeness. You saved me a few therapy sessions figuring that one out :)

I like this and wish we'd done it, but it's been years now so too late. We have exactly the same situation in our family with a cousin's wife. At first I would try to chat, find her a seat with our group of siblings/cousins etc. at family gatherings (v big family) and just generally welcome her and include her but she's just bloody rude. I'd ask after her parents for example and she'd just look at me like I'm some strange curiosity, sigh and look back at her phone. I just say hello/goodbye now and try not to give her any head space.

I would be so grateful for having a host that tries to engage with me! I am on the shy side.
I think it is bad of her to not interact with you or anyone else in the family, but definitively her issue if she does not talk to anyone else.
Try to start some convo every now and again, as you are doing and see if she comes out of her shell eventually.

So you resent the fact that some people can be rude and not only get away with it, but be liked as well @RainbowRuby ?
You might be right that this is influencing your perspective.
Many people misinterpret shyness/anxiety as aloofness/rudeness.
It can be terribly upsetting for a shy person as they will often want to try to hide their social anxiety because they feel ashamed.
BTW, you do know that for the vast majority, the reason they appear to like obnoxious types is because they are scared to be on the receiving end if they do not pretend to like them?

I'm not the woman in question - but it's entirely possible that someone could see me that way.

I strongly suspect I'm autistic, although haven't had a formal diagnosis.

In this scenario what would happen for me is:

We would get the invitation, and I would absolutely say yes. I am an introvert, but a social one, and I enjoy being around people (for a while. I have a limit).

The day would come, and I would be feeling good about it.

I would get there and suddenly be faced with a lot of people that I don't know well, all at once. And they would be having a big group conversation - and I can't cope with that. I can't think quickly enough to join in, as there's so many voices and it's overwhelming. So I would sit feeling awkward and out off place, and sometimes use my phone as a distraction from feeling uncomfortable - in part because I don't want anyone else to feel awkward because I'm not joining in. Sometimes I'll just sit and listen, and smile/laugh where appropriate.

Don't get me wrong, it doesn't always go like that. If it did, I would never go. If the big group is broken up into smaller groups, then I love to get to know people, and happily chat away, in twos or threes. Family groups though, are usually the hardest to be in, because everyone knows each other so well that the chat involves so many people and often people will be having more than one conversation at once.

I have been described as a snobby cow and a stuck up bitch. I'm really not.

I'm not looking for sympathy or to make this about me. And I don't know if the woman in question's experiences are anyone like mine. But maybe this might help others understand a little of how big group occasions can be for some people.

@iceoverhills hmmmmmm.. I think my resentment may be more of how some people (Lady in question's SIL in this case) has been publicly rude to me and people just laughed it off with the expectation that I shouldn't be offended because 'she probably didn't mean it' or 'she's just like that'. But as rightly pointed out by you and everyone else, that is (and should be) a totally different issue. My conclusion is: I need to get over myself lol and give this girl the space she wants/needs -without judgement.

Like some PPs, I am autistic. I'm rubbish in groups and generally end up sitting silently while the conversation goes on around me. I can't keep up with group conversations and I get overstimulated trying to listen/smile/be ready for questions. I also don't understand when would be a natural time to interject and I usually end up interrupting or killing the conversation with something irrelevant so I just don't.

I wouldn't scroll on my phone (for fear of being judged as rude! 👀) but I take fidget toys everywhere so I can regulate/self-sooth. My family is used to me floating around social events like a fart on a windy day; I'm pretty sure they had a secret rota to stand with me in the corner at my brother's wedding 😅

It gets even worse when I don't know the people well as I get overwhelmed and can easily shut down or go non-verbal. From the outside, I simply look bored or unengaged but on the inside, my mind is racing.

I'm in no way suggesting that your family member is autistic, I'm just relating my experience. I am considered "high-masking" so people don't immediately realise I'm autistic but have told me they thought I was stuck-up/aloof/snobby/a bitch when they first met me.

@iceoverhills

I do appreciate that shyness can sometimes be misinterpreted - I'm a shy introvert who dreads parties, noisy pubs etc etc but I've had to just get on with it. In my teens random strangers would call me snooty or stand-offish when I was just struck dumb in some situations. I had to learn in my early career days to 'fake it till you make it' (sorry - so many cliches in this post). Sometimes my attempts at being confident and outgoing paid off, sometimes not.

However, I think the majority of people can differentiate between 'paralysed by extreme shyness' and 'just too cool for school'.

I think that if the person in question was/is really so socially anxious that it's pathological, she should either explain the problem to her relatives or make up a convenient excuse not to go to things. To sit scrolling on your phone and snub your host and fellow guests (who are family, after all) is inexcusable. She's a grown up, not a child or teenager.

One trick I had when confronted with a roomful of strangers at a party or event was to ask the host what job I could do and hand round drinks or snacks etc - to get out of long conversations. She could do that!

I don't think there is any plausible excuse for behaving as this woman does though.

Op I think it's very cool you can recalibrate your opinion!

Also, it doesn't have to be either or - maybe she's rude and anxiety is why, maybe she's rude and introverted as separate traits, who the hell knows.

You enjoy hosting and clearly it's important to you, so keep finding the joy in that.
I'd guess she doesn't really like these occasions for one of many potential reasons, but comes to be with her husband. Which is quite nice really.

The other day I was pretty rude to a woman at school parking because I had been caught off guard and was therefore extremely anxious and that state of mind informed my reply. I was still rude, but there were reasons. (Unfortunately ASD means im also a bit face blind so I'll never recognise her again to apologise)

@CoffeeCantata do you really not recognise that being pathologically socially anxious is exactly the reason someone mightn't be able to concoct and deliver such excuses?

You're essentially saying 'someone effectively disabled in social situations by their lack of social ability should be able to explain this in a way that is acceptable to me during such a situation'

So she's earned to mask to appease others. Why can't others just mind their business to accommodate her?