To tell DD to be careful talking about her body issues

[year12clueless]

I really don't know how to handle this. DD 17 is an objectively extremely attractive girl. 5'4, size 4, curves, blonde hair, green eyes. Skin good, very sporty. I'm not just saying she's attractive because I'm her mum- she's also done some petite size modelling so fits conventional beauty standards.

She's had a difficult few years. A late ADHD diagnosis and trials with medicating left her at one stage very thin (6.5 stone) and anxious and there was a self harm incident so I treat her mental health very carefully. We got her to talk to a therapist whilst all this was happening and the therapist also flagged she had moderate body dysmorphia- what other people see when they look at her isn't what she sees.

She can list (exhaustively) a list of "flaws" that no one else can see- chubby cheeks, weirdly shaped teeth, short torso, stubby fingers etc etc. The thing is, she complains to her friends about this, and posts pics of her (in the group chat they have to discuss what they're wearing) dissecting how rubbish she looks- when objectively she's looking lovely.

This has begun to annoy her friends and I absolutely understand why. It's very hard to feel sympathetic when a size 4 is telling you she feels chunky. They don't really understand the body dysmorphia and it just seems like she's fishing for compliments. They don't see her hysterical after trying on 15 prom dresses that make her look "awful" in all of them- they just see someone complaining unnecessarily.

One of her friends recently asked her to stop criticising how she looks as it was upsetting her. DD was really upset as she thinks she can't now be herself with her friends, but I've told her that whilst what she has is real, its incredibly hard for people who aren't her mum to feel sympathetic towards her, and perhaps a collection of other teen girls aren't the best support for this. I suggested she tone it down, stop talking to her friends about what she's wearing/ looking like, talk to me about her worries if she needs to but to also try to accept that objectively she's very pretty and to try to understand what people see.

She's a bit upset with me as she says it sounds like I'm telling her to pull herself together and get over it. Which I think I am in a way but I've tried to be kind. Honestly I sympathise with her friends a bit- it's hard listening to someone fretting about non existent body flaws.

Anyone with any experience in this who can help? Should I have kept quiet and let her carry on sharing with her friends?

I agree. She needs to sort this out before if becomes an entrenched behaviour pattern.

She has to respect her friends' boundaries. One has already asked her to stop this, so to continue would reinforce the idea that not only is she self absorbed and fishing for complements (I know she has issues that cause this), she has no regard for them whatsoever.

Mental health issues are not an excuse to disrespect others feelings. She must learn to check herself on this subject or she will lose friends which will not help her self esteem any.

It seems it isn't helping her to be in such a chat group, would she consider taking a step back and muting the chat for a while?

In fairness to Dd they all use the chat to critique themselves

So because they, and others, think she's attractive - that means she's not allowed to critique herself? Only they are allowed to express feelings of insecurity in the group? In that case, they are crappy friends.

You're right. I might suggest the "should I wear this?" group chat bites the bullet.

I'd love to get her some more therapy but it was very expensive and there's bugger all chance via CAHMS so we'd have to go privately again. We sold DHs beloved motorbike last time to fund everything but we're no richer now. I'll think about what I can do.

I absolutely agree about stopping this getting entrenched. I was so focused on getting the right ADHD meds, fixing the self esteem issues arising from the late diagnosis that tbh I just gave us breathing room afterwards to see how things settled. And honestly apart from this she's amazing. She's doing well at school, might make university, good friends, playing sport. I sometimes think her brain doesn't want her happy...

I would suggest she develops an interest outside of clothes and make-up.
Encourage her in sport and/or something to stretch her mind.
Being good at something builds confidence.

It’s good that you’re trying to address this OP. Agree with other posters that therapy/CBT could be a huge help. I’d also be quite blunt with her that modelling is likely to exacerbate her MH issues and that you think she should find another way to earn money.

This sort of talk is likely to damage those friendships eventually. There is only so much support friends can give (especially for something like this where no amount of reassurance will actually help.)

In a similar way, I have health anxiety and often fixate on diseases which I think I have. There are some close friends I can offload to- but I keep a limit on it (apart from anything else, I imagine it gets very boring for others to listen to!) There are some friends who I won’t share with- because they have very real, very present health conditions and the last thing they need is me banging on about my imaginary cancer.

But this is because I know I have a mental illness. I understand what health anxiety is, even if I can’t always control it. Does your DD truly understand what body dysmorphia is? Does she understand that no amount of reassurance is ever going to fix it?

I experienced exactly this with DD and made the point that she would end up a beautiful friendless women if she continued.

I'm very sympathetic to your dd. I had a severe eating disorder when younger and I know how deceitful our brains can be where we see ourselves so differently from how others see us.

The problem is, body dysmorphia can't be ‘cured’ by external validation (if only it was that easy!!). So no matter how many times her friends tell her she looks great, it won't be enough to change how she sees herself. So she actually achieves very little when she complains about her appearance to her friends.

I think you're right to caution her against frequently unloading on her friends regards her appearance.

She shouldn't look at it as not being herself, she needs to look at it as being more self-aware, which is important in friendships.

Although not all her friends may have body dysmorphia to the same extent as her, you can guarantee they will all have their own body insecurities and she needs to be mindful of that. Talking about it too much can be more harmful than helpful as it reinforces the belief that appearance is intrinsically linked to our self-worth.

She needs to seek other ways of managing her negative self-image. Therapy, mindfulness, CBT - it's not her friends responsibility.

You sound a lovely, caring Mum, she's lucky to have you.

Is there a support group she could join?

Exactly. As an adult I have a friend who complain about being fat, and quite honestly I find it immature and attention seeking. And extremely rude as they're saying it to people that are actually fat. I think it's rare for an adult to do this, but it's something she does need to think about as it shows a lack of empathy or awareness for others

She needs to talk to a counsellor, not her friends.

Personally, wouldn’t want a child with such anxieties anywhere near the modelling industry. It chews people up and spits them out.

”she says it sounds like I'm telling her to pull herself together and get over it.”

While I’m aware that this isn’t always the answer, I do think that it’s something we used to instinctively do as mums. It’s just plain old common sense advice to consider others and not be wholly self-obsessed. To be fair, self-obsession is a fairly normal state for teenagers. I also think sometimes tough love has gone missing from the parents’ arsenal and I do believe it has its place.

I hope you can work this out without having to find another motorbike to sell! I echo others who’ve said maybe get her out and about and doing things that are more physical and practical and nothing to do with appearance.

I'd tell her of course she can be herself with her friends. Herself isn't solely made up of selfies with critical commentaries attached. Tell her to be herself with her friends in the form of sharing music and funny or cute video clips and plans for doing stuff together. Let her save the body issues for the professionals.

I think it’s likely that the boat dysmorphia has become your daughters ‘thing’. I can see how it can be incredibly frustrating and draining as her friends being consumed on a group chat talking about looks etc. With ADHD it’s so hard because typically you won’t be as filtered, but as long as you can sit her down and encourage her to stop obsessing about it.

I think you're doing a good job though and hopefully it’s just a phase she can grow out of.

Body*

@yellowsmileyface I understand it as "in the group chat they have created to discuss what they're wearing" rather than "they HAVE TO discuss what they're wearing" IYSWIM?

It’s such a difficult thing OP, but I think both you and her friends are being perfectly reasonable. And apart from maintaining her friendships, not criticising herself so much might help her feel less critical (self talk does create its own reality). Understanding that other people have needs as well as you is also just part of growing up, and it’s useful for her to have had this experience before she leaves school.

It’s very difficult to stop this behaviour so I think it’s worth talking to your GP about specialist support. I know it’s thin on the ground but contacting BEAT and the Nightingale Hospt in London. They might be able to point you in the direction of some resources. CBT can help reframe thoughts, but I really do think you would need someone who understands this area.

This sort of group critiquing is addictive and as a PP said, people with ADHD do seem to chase dopamine hits more than average. So it would be good to explore the idea of leaving the group eventually, and, for now, find other things - especially something that might encourage a better relationship with her body like yoga - to help keep her mood in a good place.

I don’t have experience of this specific problem, but I would think there are good resources of books and websites around - would she be interested in understanding what she’s experiencing better? Generally proper understanding is the best way to begin real change.

Just wanted to say op that I think you sound like a lovely mum and you are navigating this really well x

@year12clueless just checked and your DD is 17. Very much worth googling 'IAPT services' and your location. NHS talking therapies for adults are free with mandatory wait time limits for assessment and treatment.
She can Access CBT for free potentially if she's 17 as lots of IAPT services will see ages 16 and over if they have capacity to do the work and engage.
Where I live you can have 12-16 sessions but other places are restricted to 6, it's a bit of a lottery. You can go for more than one round as well, you could have 6 sessions, do some work yourself for a couple of months and then come back for 6 more if that makes sense.

Its so sad that camhs are overwhelmed and can't function but luckily you might be able to sidestep straight into adult services.

Ahh, yes, that makes more sense! Thanks for clarifying.

This is from the David Burns Feeling Good Handbook. It lists ten forms of ''twisted thinking' and how to remedy them. Have a look and see if using this with your daughter might help. ( The book is also excellent btw)
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=aXNkMjcxLm9yZ3xlbmdsaXNoLTEwfGd4OjE1Y2M0MmIzNWIzOWVjNTA

I agree with all of the advice here. Definitely broadening horizons to make her realise that life is not all about looks/ body. As well as sport/ hobbies etc could she do some volunteering in a hospital, or local charity shop. Or even get involved in local youth projects or initiatives for disadvantaged people. Not around eating disorders probably.

I also agree with the stopping the clothes chat for a while and also encouraging your DD to think about what the purpose of her comments is. Even if every one of her friends comes back and says she looks amazing- will that help? If she just needs to vent, maybe tell her to write the message but don’t send it.

You’ve had some great responses and insights so far, I just wanted to say that I think you were absolutely right to bring it up. she needs to reassess how she talks to / interacts with her friends - they’ll lose patience a lot quicker than her (lovely!) mum will

I don't think you're being unreasonable at all. My best friend had an eating disorder as a teen, and for years then and afterwards was constantly criticising herself but also constantly praising me in IMO harmful terms e.g. "wow you look so slim" "you've lost weight!" etc. That perception was just her own mind as my weight barely fluctuated (much heavier than her!). In the end I asked her to stop "complimenting" me on my weight/body shape as it just made me self-conscious, and she did stop, thank goodness. But she was older by then, mid twenties.

What I'm saying is that the praising of her friends could also be somewhat toxic, it's better really IMO if women don't pass remarks on each others bodies at all, or at least take care while doing so.

My worry is that your daughter (who sounds generally like a really nice person) has come to see her self-criticism as a key part of "being herself" i.e. what makes her, her. Does she want it to be a key part of her personality/life/how others see her, really? I'm sure she doesn't. That's why she needs to talk to a professional and try to shift that sense that her body anxiety IS her.