Page 3 | Nursery e-mails me 5 pm...

Friendshipissue · 2023-06-27T05:40:44+00:00

To announce that they are closing the room DS is attending with immediate effect. No advance notice or indication. Just a brief note about staffing challenges, recruitment issues and how sorry they are. I'm really sorry childcare providers are struggling I really am because of the shitty circumstances they are left in. I don't know what to expect from this thread apart from getting it off my chest. I wish we had a bit more notice to at least to get into waiting lists, organize our meetings with DH, cancel our medical appointments etc.

veryfluffyfluff · 27/06/2023 09:03

Unexpecteddrivinginstructor · 27/06/2023 07:46

Could you enquire around to see if there is a university student or post A level student who would be willing to step in temporarily until you can sort out a permanent solution?

Are you serious?

HerbsandSpices · 27/06/2023 09:04

It's inconvenient but if they can't meet legal ratio requirements, they can't run.

veryfluffyfluff · 27/06/2023 09:05

Twattle · 27/06/2023 08:45

Its because of the shit pay and the passive aggressive parents.
I left a permanent childcare job and now only do agency.
Some examples of passive aggressiveness.

A parent kept bringing their child in expensive earings that would end up getting lost in the garden. She would berate us for losing them and would complain about everything else if an earing got lost. Would also say things like "but I put a plastic protector on the back?!". She knew the policy that we weren't responsible.

A parent would pick up there child, take them to the park and return 20 min later saying they had done a poo, and it mustve been done when they were in our care and this shouldn't be happening. Clearly lying as we checked every child before they left.

After receiving a bill for extra sessions a parent starting to questions us about it, we don't deal with the financial side so couldn't comment. The parent then insisted that they left a bag here and where is the bag. We had to search everywher and stay behind after our shift. The next day it turns out it was at home. No apology.

Parent complaining that their child got a sun tan when playing in the garden, when they took their child to lego land the day before.

What did they eat? What time did they sleep? Have they done a poo? Where's the grey hoodie, no not that one, the other one? So he came in today with 3 small toy cars where are they?

What did they eat and did they sleep is standard hand over information

ItsBritneyBitchhhh · 27/06/2023 09:07

Is it the room he’s in due to his age or is it the whole nursery? Are they not able to take some children from the room that’s closing and scatter them elsewhere?

For example, DD just turned two in May. Surely if the room was closing due to staffing issues then they could move her up a room or down a room? Or maybe I’m living in dreamland😂

How awful though. I really thought nurseries would find a way to make it work without giving more or less no notice of the closure!

cinnamonfrenchtoast · 27/06/2023 09:08

BiscuitsandPuffin · 27/06/2023 08:34

It's a shame the nurseries closing don't at least try to put their fees up to a break-even point first. I'm sure many parents would grumble about fee increases (especially when nursery is eye-wateringly expensive anyway) but I bet many would ultimately rather that than no nursery at all. I feel like the nurseries need to keep a closer eye on their finances and increase fees accordingly to keep in business.

Putting prices up won't make any difference if they don't have enough staff.

cinnamonfrenchtoast · 27/06/2023 09:09

ItsBritneyBitchhhh · 27/06/2023 09:07

Is it the room he’s in due to his age or is it the whole nursery? Are they not able to take some children from the room that’s closing and scatter them elsewhere?

For example, DD just turned two in May. Surely if the room was closing due to staffing issues then they could move her up a room or down a room? Or maybe I’m living in dreamland😂

How awful though. I really thought nurseries would find a way to make it work without giving more or less no notice of the closure!

They can't move rooms as certain age groups need certain ratios.

If there aren't enough staff there's nothing they can do - they're not allowed to open.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 27/06/2023 09:09

ItsBritneyBitchhhh · 27/06/2023 09:07

Is it the room he’s in due to his age or is it the whole nursery? Are they not able to take some children from the room that’s closing and scatter them elsewhere?

For example, DD just turned two in May. Surely if the room was closing due to staffing issues then they could move her up a room or down a room? Or maybe I’m living in dreamland😂

How awful though. I really thought nurseries would find a way to make it work without giving more or less no notice of the closure!

If they haven’t got the staff for the X amount of children in the room they’re unlikely to have a surplus of staff in other rooms to cover them all.

Especially as mixed age rooms would likely need more staff to keep everything safe and appropriate

underneaththeash · 27/06/2023 09:10

veryfluffyfluff · 27/06/2023 09:00

How if there are no staff

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They get agency staff and suck up the extra cost.

OP i would email and say that they are contractually obliged to give notice (the amount will depend on your contract). You can take the nursery to small claims court fir any costs associated with the breech, so unpaid time off work, cost of a nanny compared to a nursery, increased travel costs to get to another nursery etc.

there are lots of nurseries/pre-schools who make a decent amount of money, especially ially in the SE. We have had a new nursery open in the village recently. I used to be the treasurer of our local pre-school and we had a £25.000 surplus - which I insisted they spend some of.

Whinge · 27/06/2023 09:12

For example, DD just turned two in May. Surely if the room was closing due to staffing issues then they could move her up a room or down a room? Or maybe I’m living in dreamland

That wouldn't be possible due to the ratios. If they've made the decision to close an entire room then they clearly don't have enough staff in the other rooms to meet the ratios needed. If they had any additional staff they would have moved them rather than taking the drastic decision to close a room.

ItsBritneyBitchhhh · 27/06/2023 09:12

@cinnamonfrenchtoast @YetMoreNewBeginnings ah yes that does make sense regarding the amount of staff available. That’s so rubbish!

veryfluffyfluff · 27/06/2023 09:12

underneaththeash · 27/06/2023 09:10

They get agency staff and suck up the extra cost.

OP i would email and say that they are contractually obliged to give notice (the amount will depend on your contract). You can take the nursery to small claims court fir any costs associated with the breech, so unpaid time off work, cost of a nanny compared to a nursery, increased travel costs to get to another nursery etc.

there are lots of nurseries/pre-schools who make a decent amount of money, especially ially in the SE. We have had a new nursery open in the village recently. I used to be the treasurer of our local pre-school and we had a £25.000 surplus - which I insisted they spend some of.

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There are very few agency staff. Less than are needed.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 27/06/2023 09:12

underneaththeash · 27/06/2023 09:10

They get agency staff and suck up the extra cost.

OP i would email and say that they are contractually obliged to give notice (the amount will depend on your contract). You can take the nursery to small claims court fir any costs associated with the breech, so unpaid time off work, cost of a nanny compared to a nursery, increased travel costs to get to another nursery etc.

there are lots of nurseries/pre-schools who make a decent amount of money, especially ially in the SE. We have had a new nursery open in the village recently. I used to be the treasurer of our local pre-school and we had a £25.000 surplus - which I insisted they spend some of.

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As if they’ve closed without considering that… there’s a mass shortage of nursery staff. Including supply. If they can’t get staff they can’t get staff.

veryfluffyfluff · 27/06/2023 09:13

ItsBritneyBitchhhh · 27/06/2023 09:07

Is it the room he’s in due to his age or is it the whole nursery? Are they not able to take some children from the room that’s closing and scatter them elsewhere?

For example, DD just turned two in May. Surely if the room was closing due to staffing issues then they could move her up a room or down a room? Or maybe I’m living in dreamland😂

How awful though. I really thought nurseries would find a way to make it work without giving more or less no notice of the closure!

Scatter them elsewhere?! The other rooms will be full to the ratios too.

cyncope · 27/06/2023 09:13

Oh, what a shock for you! Unfortunately I think this is going to happen more and more often.

Nurseries near me are really struggling to recruit qualified staff - and you have to have at least 50% qualified staff I believe.

Why would you want to work 50 hours a week for £10.50 an hour managing a 20 place baby room for example, when M&S will pay you more to sit on a till?
The money just doesn't make sense for the level of skill, training and responsibility required.

I imagine the government response will be to up ratios of children to adults and reduce qualification needed - just get in a series of short term school-leavers on peanuts to watch 5 or 6 children each, recruit new ones every year.

veryfluffyfluff · 27/06/2023 09:13

Scatter them elsewhere?! The other rooms will be full to the ratios too.

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And moving a child "down" to babies isn't going to be good for their development

cinnamonfrenchtoast · 27/06/2023 09:14

@underneaththeash and if they can't find any agency staff? And can't afford to suck up the cost?

I'm glad the nursery you worked for turned such a profit but I doubt once that's closing with no notice just has a random 25k sitting about 🙈

underneaththeash · 27/06/2023 09:15

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 27/06/2023 09:12

As if they’ve closed without considering that… there’s a mass shortage of nursery staff. Including supply. If they can’t get staff they can’t get staff.

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They’re still in breach of contract.

why should the OP suffer because they’re unprepared. Iif the OP left with no notice they would absolutely be charging her.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 27/06/2023 09:15

Moving to other rooms can also be impossible due to space as well.

if you’ve already got, for example, 25 3-year-olds in a room with you can’t necessarily stick the 9 babies/toddlers from another room in with them as well even if staff numbers worked out somehow

StillWantingADog · 27/06/2023 09:17

We had a similar situation when the nursery went out of business

it worked itself out but I feel your pain

cyncope · 27/06/2023 09:17

underneaththeash · 27/06/2023 09:10

They get agency staff and suck up the extra cost.

OP i would email and say that they are contractually obliged to give notice (the amount will depend on your contract). You can take the nursery to small claims court fir any costs associated with the breech, so unpaid time off work, cost of a nanny compared to a nursery, increased travel costs to get to another nursery etc.

there are lots of nurseries/pre-schools who make a decent amount of money, especially ially in the SE. We have had a new nursery open in the village recently. I used to be the treasurer of our local pre-school and we had a £25.000 surplus - which I insisted they spend some of.

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A £25000 isn't very much - that's only going to cover staffing costs for 1 month for a small nursery.

Nurseries need to have greater reserves than that.

veryfluffyfluff · 27/06/2023 09:18

underneaththeash · 27/06/2023 09:15

They’re still in breach of contract.

why should the OP suffer because they’re unprepared. Iif the OP left with no notice they would absolutely be charging her.

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What is it you expect them to do? Open the room and let the kids have a free for all. I know nursery is mostly there so parents can work but the quality and safety of the provision has to be there and focused on the kids!

cinnamonfrenchtoast · 27/06/2023 09:21

They’re still in breach of contract.

So what do you think the solution is? Open illegally? Just let the kids run about with no supervision? Maybe they could get the older kids to supervise the babies?

I mean, you can ramble on about breach of contract all you like but if they can't open, they can't open. There's no magic pool of money or staff for nurseries to just dip into!

Ceebeegee · 27/06/2023 09:21

No constructive advice, but just my sympathy, OP.
We had something similar in 2015. We received an email at 5pm on the Friday of a Bank Holiday weekend saying they were closing and we were given one weeks notice.

We were absolutely gutted because we loved the place. We struggled for several weeks before we found somewhere by exhausting our friends and family members, but not everyone is fortunate to have that.

NoWordForFluffy · 27/06/2023 09:23

BugsyDrakeTableScape · 27/06/2023 07:32

This happened to us - but it was the whole nursery. All other local nurseries full, bare few Child minding spots. The nursery also ran a before and after school club - it's left a lot of people high and dry

You aren't in Liverpool at all? My friend had this happen recently.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 27/06/2023 09:25

underneaththeash · 27/06/2023 09:15

They’re still in breach of contract.

why should the OP suffer because they’re unprepared. Iif the OP left with no notice they would absolutely be charging her.

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Only if there’s no mention of sudden/unexpected closures on in the contract. Which most will have to cover payment terms on unexpected closures for weather and the likes.