Nursery e-mails me 5 pm...

[Friendshipissue]

To announce that they are closing the room DS is attending with immediate effect. No advance notice or indication. Just a brief note about staffing challenges, recruitment issues and how sorry they are.
I'm really sorry childcare providers are struggling I really am because of the shitty circumstances they are left in.
I don't know what to expect from this thread apart from getting it off my chest. I wish we had a bit more notice to at least to get into waiting lists, organize our meetings with DH, cancel our medical appointments etc.

Bloody hell, what a nightmare! And WHY can't these nurseries pay their minimum wage staff adequately / at all? Its not like they're charging minimum prices, is it? Someone's trousering lots of money, and I bet it isn't the staff who actually work with the children.

Well, I used to be the treasurer of a not-for-profit nursery and I can tell you we made a loss most years out of the last 5 or 6 even while barely paying our staff above minimum wage.
It's expensive to run a nursery and the government doesn't fund the "free hours" properly so other parents have to subsidise it. The entire sector is a mess.

This is a nightmare. I really feel for you op. It also sounds like bad management to literally give NO notice at all to give parents, although I suppose there are situations where that could happen. It's super shit and, like others said, a symptom of an under funded industry that pay their employees way too little.

We were in a similar situation during covid when the nursery overnight changed their policy on second settings (we used a childminder too) and refused to have DS in the next day or ever again if we didn't dump the childminder and go there full time. Clearly not as desperate as yours as we had some childcare and I guess, had a "choice" (although it wasn't a real one becuase for lots of reasons we couldn't do what they said we had to do), but I know that feeling of standing a weekday evening thinking "FUCK, what will I do for childcare tomorrow and in future". It's really not fun.

hope you find something OP.

Must be a nightmare for you OP, I'm sorry x

Just wanted to say, for people asking why they couldn't give more notice - I work in a preschool and we simply can't recruit new staff. We are still open, because we meet the minimum requirements for adult to child ratio. If one of us was to leave suddenly, for example if one of us had an emergency, or walked out, we would have to close with immediate effect. There's no getting around it, you can't stay open if you don't meet the minimum staff ratios. It is not safe (or legal!) It's a rubbish situation all round.

I feel for you. I've had 2 childminders do this to me - closed with immediate effect. One was shut by Ofsted, the other just decided she couldn't be arsed with the early mornings any longer. The stress of trying to find someone else was terrible.

Maybe if the government gave nurseries more than £4 per hour for the 15 and 30 hours offering they could pay the staff better and charge less for the 1 and 2 year olds. We don't pay for food and activities so I'm pretty sure DS has cost them money for 2 years out of 4.

Just to add to this, @MrsMcisaCt's nursery isn't the only one. Many are struggling with recruitment / retention, and plenty of parents could find themselves in the OPs situation if just one 2 staff members left.

Could you enquire around to see if there is a university student or post A level student who would be willing to step in temporarily until you can sort out a permanent solution?

That sounds like an absolute nightmare. I had no idea this could happen. I hope you get something sorted ASAP.

WHY can't these nurseries pay their minimum wage staff adequately / at all? It’s not like they're charging minimum prices, is it?

The blame for this lies squarely on the conservatives.

This is going to happen again and again-funding is simply inadequate and nurseries can’t afford to pay staffing, rent and energy bills. Two nurseries have already closed their doors on the same road as my primary in the last month. There is nobody to signpost them to as the others are full, with long waiting lists.

The headlines are full of free childcare places and funded hours.

Those headlines should be full of how those hours are not funded by the government and childcare providers are struggling. Add to that the fiasco that is ofsted and it’s no wonder it is in crisis.

Posted too soon
The overheads, heating, lighting, utilities, equipment, maintenance, rent, loans, all of these costs have increased. I don’t know how more are not closing.

Childcare providers have been voicing concerns since the introduction of the two year funding offer. No one in government is listening.

I suspect they did it this way so parents couldn't kick off. More concerned about not having to deal with angry people than giving parents any real chance of sorting alternative childcare for the following day. So shitty.

It's a shame the nurseries closing don't at least try to put their fees up to a break-even point first. I'm sure many parents would grumble about fee increases (especially when nursery is eye-wateringly expensive anyway) but I bet many would ultimately rather that than no nursery at all. I feel like the nurseries need to keep a closer eye on their finances and increase fees accordingly to keep in business.

This happened to me the summer before DS2 started primary as the private school it was attached to went bust. I knew the school was closing but naively thought the nursery would be able to stay open independently.
We managed to muddle through those 6 weeks but it was tough.

They have minimum staffing ratios that they must adhere to. If something unforeseen has made that impossible, then there is little they can do as they have to comply.

What a pain for you - hope you can sort out an alternative.

Its because of the shit pay and the passive aggressive parents.
I left a permanent childcare job and now only do agency.
Some examples of passive aggressiveness.

1. A parent kept bringing their child in expensive earings that would end up getting lost in the garden. She would berate us for losing them and would complain about everything else if an earing got lost. Would also say things like "but I put a plastic protector on the back?!". She knew the policy that we weren't responsible.

1. A parent would pick up there child, take them to the park and return 20 min later saying they had done a poo, and it mustve been done when they were in our care and this shouldn't be happening. Clearly lying as we checked every child before they left.

1. After receiving a bill for extra sessions a parent starting to questions us about it, we don't deal with the financial side so couldn't comment. The parent then insisted that they left a bag here and where is the bag. We had to search everywher and stay behind after our shift. The next day it turns out it was at home. No apology.

1. Parent complaining that their child got a sun tan when playing in the garden, when they took their child to lego land the day before.

1. What did they eat? What time did they sleep? Have they done a poo? Where's the grey hoodie, no not that one, the other one? So he came in today with 3 small toy cars where are they?

@BiscuitsandPuffin the problem there is the paying parents would have to pay more to subsidise the funded places. How high would the fees have to increase, some nurseries already charge more for the funded places.

LA’s and children’s services almost force some parents to take up these free places. Most nurseries have little choice.

As a crude example. If you have 20 two year olds in a room and 10 of those are funded @ £4 an hour how much will the other 10 need to pay to keep that room open?

What money?

It costs a fortune to run a nursery - staffing costs, insurance, building costs (rent, mortgage, business rates), electricity, heating, internet, food, drinks, anything the children require, toys, equipment, cleaning staff and supplies - the list is endless.

Add on the fact that the government want everyone to provide funded hours but only pay the nurseries about £4 per hour per child and what do you expect?

Or maybe someone walked out on them with no notice, or went off such and they're not actually physically able to open?

@BiscuitsandPuffin

how is that going to help with recruiting staff? If they don't have a safe & legal ratio, WTF do you expect them to do??

@cinnamonfrenchtoast I agree that this is probably what happend. Also closing one room isn't going to stop the nursery from dealing with angry parents, they're still going to get emails, phone calls and parents turning up to drop off, only to find the room closed. Also many families will have children in different rooms.

A parent was shocked when I said I hoped the new 'free hours' doesn't come in next April.

This is the reality and it will only happen more and more now. The childcare sector is in crisis!

There was a demonstration in London at the weekend from the early years sector regarding the funding crisis, I didn't see a single news outlet comment on it.

The whole thing is shit and because it doesn't affect anyone for more than a few years, no one really cares.

How if there are no staff

The only nursery that is doing well round here, and hasn’t had any “sorry we’re a staff member short so can’t open today” days is one that basically doesn’t do funded hours.

They are expensive and unaffordable for some people, but they seem to be the only one that’s coping as demand is so high for spaces people are paying them.

(I believe pre-covid they offered a very very very limited number of the free places but only for the 15 hours - if they still offer any at all)