To be shocked the amount of people on antidepressants?

[Hotfuninthesummertime]

I know I'm unreasonable as I've been on them for years. However i work in a very close team and am aware of 10 out of 15 of us being on anti depressants for various reasons or life stressor. I was shocked so many people are being treated but it's so common! Is it more recognised now ? Or overtreated ?

These are withdrawal side effects. I suffered with feeling the same for months after I stopped taking them. Just wanted to point that out because often people think they are relapsing and need these drugs because the side effects if you miss a dose or stop taking them suddenly are so terrible.

@LadyH846 Thanks for your reply.
What was the reason you wanted to come off ADs? How did you push through those withdrawal effects if they lasted for a long time- a few months?

I am surprised, yes.

Mainly because my doctor thinks I've been depressed for ages and has not once offered me an antidepressant.

I'm currently doing talking therapies though, which I feel is a better solution. I'm depressed because of life events, and a pill isn't going to change that.

I was on mirtazapine, a drug that can be quite sedating and I was finding I was not getting enough done at work because the drug made me feel so lazy and unproductive. I used to be a very active person who enjoyed exercising prior to taking the drug but after taking it, I didn't want to go for walks anymore.

I also read that antidepressants can predispose some women towards autoimmunity because the extra serotonin they supply gives the immune system a good boost. Women's immune systems tend to be quite active anyway (which is why they tend to get more autoimmune diseases) so this extra boost is not helpful if you are someone who could develop autoimmunity. I developed autoimmunity 8 months into taking the drug. I don't know if it was connected but I decided I wanted to come off them.

I was very determined and I think you have to be if you are someone who gets horrid withdrawal like I did (not everyone does - I have a friend who came off them over 3 months and had no symptoms).

I got acupuncture throughout the withdrawal process which helped and I also followed the instructions in a book called "A mind of your own". I also did a water fast. When that finished, the withdrawal had thankfully stopped. Most of the methods I used to get through it were very unorthodox but I was desperate and would try anything. I wouldn't have been able to do it without them. I won't lie, withdrawal was hell. I've heard people who experienced opioid addiction say that coming off AD's was worse than coming off opioids. I don't know if that is true, but it felt true while I was going through it.

My experience may have been worse because I came off them over just 6 weeks. I was a member of a drug withdrawal group and it seemed to me that people who tapered over many months suffered just as much as the people who did it quickly.

Ah that highly reportable and well regarded source

madinamerica.com

😂 at @LadyH846

All “madinamerica” did was pluck out of context anything that supported that argument by completely bypassed the fact that the BMJ was utterly and very very vocal about support for vaccine uptake

Sorry very very supportive of need and benefit of ADs correctly prescribed in the UK

I tried anti-depressants after a very low point in my life where I struggled to even get out of bed or wash.

I lasted a day because the side effects terrified me - I’ve taken ecstasy before and didn’t feel as spaced out or paranoid as I did on sertraline. So I binned them after a day, and just tried what my Nan would call ‘pulling myself together’ but what was essentially taking it day by day, setting small goals etc.

Those ADs terrified me though and the thought of taking 2 weeks+ to stop feeling like that scared me even more

Madinamerica

Mad in America’s mission is to serve as a catalyst for rethinking psychiatric care in the United States (and abroad). We believe that the current drug-based paradigm of care has failed our society, and that scientific research, as well as the lived experience of those who have been diagnosed with a psychiatric disorder, calls for profound change.

so not the most objective starting point!

My assumption is that they are overprescribed. I also suspect that people are overprescribed painkillers, antibiotics and no doubt medication of other types.

There also seems to be an assumption that most people will be on regular medication as they get older. I am in my early 60s and am often asked (eg at the dentist) if I am on any regular medication. People seem surprised when I say no. I'd have hoped that was normal rather than the exception.

My only experience of antidepressants is that I took amitriptyline a few years ago for severe pain when I overdid it at the gym and tore my rotator cuff muscle. I had been living on over-the-counter painkillers for 6 weeks which did very little, so I needed something stronger.

The amitriptyline was great because I could actually get comfortable enough at night to sleep. I didn't notice any difference to my mood (other than could be explained by not being in constant pain and being able to sleep) but I was on a very low dose and fortunately I only needed it for a couple of weeks, so I didn't have any withdrawal symptoms.

They do make it abundantly clear that the initial side effects can be very unpleasant but to stick with it.

you gave it a day.

when you say the side effects “terrified you”, were you experiencing them or worrying they could arise?

Modern life are out of touch with the needs of our bodies and minds. Raising dc in nuclear families goes against our evolution and that’s the easy option. The pressure we live under is phenomenal but we’re like frogs in boiling water.

We have a 19th century school system that isn’t fit for purpose, churning out damaged children. A housing crisis that puts young adults into a state of constant financial insecurity.

Anti depressants are prescribed as a band aid when an adhd/asd/ocd assessment might be needed, or instead of hormonal balancing post partum. Or to mask unsustainable stress.

But once you use a phrase like “over subscribe” the reaction is to stop prescribing to people who are struggling to function, without offering anything else.

There’s no easy solution to any of it, but anti depressants are just effective enough to duct tape the social machine and keep it grinding .

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK361016/

• Without antidepressants: About 20 to 40 out of 100 people who took a placebo noticed an improvement in their symptoms within six to eight weeks.
• With antidepressants: About 40 to 60 out of 100 people who took an antidepressant noticed an improvement in their symptoms within six to eight weeks.

In other words, antidepressants improved symptoms in about an extra 20 out of 100 people.

This is from 2016 pre covid - and concerns were already out there.
https://www.newscientist.com/article/2093239-if-antidepressants-dont-work-well-why-are-they-so-popular/

Previous research suggests that for adults too, the Prozac class of antidepressants – selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) – is no better than a placebo, at least in people with mild or moderate depression.
Confusingly, other research finds that these drugs do work, for example, a recent study that found that SSRIs work better than placebo for major depression in adults.
But there’s reason to think that we may not be able to trust most studies unless the researchers have no links to pharmaceutical firms, and have access to all trial data.
Last year when GlaxoSmithKline had to reveal full data about one of its own studies in teenagers, the rate of side effects such as suicidal thoughts was much higher than it initially appeared.

Honestly I think it's complex with more research being needed - and we'll probably find some genetic reason why they work for some people and not others.

There is abundant research which supports the idea that many antidepressants are no better than a placebo in most cases. Dr Ben Goldacre's book "Bad Pharma" goes into that in a lot of detail. Also "Anatomy of an Epidemic" by Robert Whitaker

There is also not much evidence that supports the idea that depression is due to low serotonin, and that a drug is required to fix this.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jul/20/scientists-question-widespread-use-of-antidepressants-after-survey-on-serotonin

I myself was on antidepressants for 2 years, due a loss in my life that made me sad. I became unproductive at work, unmotivated and my health went downhill. When I came off them, my health started to improve and I felt "myself" again. I felt a real sense of loss that I'd been doped up for 2 years and couldn't experience life in the way I always had. It was like my senses had been dulled and emotions repressed. In retrospect, I was not depressed but sad, and would have been better off just giving myself time to grieve.

I did get the vaccine, I have been on antidepressants and I work in biotech (and previously for big pharma). I would always advise a loved one who is struggling to try talking therapies and to make changes to eliminate stressors rather than trying medication.

Even if they were super effective drugs, without any side-effects, it would be bizarre to prescribe them without attempting to fix whatever brought on the depressive episode. To use a broken leg analogy - you wouldn't take pain killers and apply burn cream while keeping your hand on the hob!

Precisely this.

@Passionfruitroulade i had my diagnosis confirmed beginning of December last year and started weaning off the AD immediately. I did this will the help of my doctor

I've heard the problem described as "shit life syndrome" which I think is probably quite accurate. More people than ever just have a bad quality of life due to the trials of the modern world - no faith, community or family along with financial hardship and a total lack of optimism about the future. In order to cope with our shit lives, far worse than our parents or grandparents, we need to be on the soma.

They have saved me from killing myself and even dont think im worth it, im thankful

Well actually, as I said before, I've had two very different experiences with SSRIs.

When it was diagnosed for migraines - no explanation of side effects.

When diagnosed for stress and anxiety - comprehensive explanation. Managed withdrawal. (BIL received similar diagnosis and symptoms, no treatment whatsoever, just a sick note)

And I don't know why you're dismissing the idea that the other poster who was suffering from a bad MH episode was overwhelmed by the side effects listed. I don't know why you think that every patient experience is the same?

@AngryBirdsNoMore

They would be a last resort for me as I don’t think they get to the root cause of one’s malady so to speak. For me personally, there are better ways to manage my mental health than resorting to medication. So yes, strictly a severe knock you off your feet type tragedy here only. I don’t judge those for taking them but it’s not a path I wish to go down.

I have family members who have allsorts of diagnoses ranging from depression, to personality disorder and schizophrenia so I’ve always known to nurture my MH from a very young age. I’ve picked my job, relationships and lifestyle to accommodate good wellbeing.

Not sure about that. I was born not that long after WW2 and many of the family friends had lost (usually) husbands and there were many men that were demobbed in a desperate mental state.

They came home to no counselling, often no home, usually no job - but the expectation that they just got on with it.

Which they did.

I think, perhaps, that they had it worse.😗

TBH I've known a lot of people on them too. Myself included since 18, 32 now.
Because I have a responsible role, and part of that is inducting the people I oversee at work, which includes a medical question about conditions and medication for risk assessment, and I'm the first aider, it seems to be that people come to me and tell me about their ills and if they're feeling down. It's quite nice to provide that sort of support to people, but even these burly blokes you wouldn't expect are feeling pretty depressed and anxious.

@Zebedee55

At what cost though? For all we know there was a lot of inter generational trauma passed down from those times. It’s not really a competition, life as we know it is hectic and unmanageable for a lot of people. Our society is hugely unequal. I haven’t taken meds and likely never will but I can’t sit here and judge those who do.

Life is bloody tough. I do totally object to the hardcore medical model though. I think there’s huge amounts of denial in society, and people don’t want to look within. It sometimes is easier just to take meds rather than face up to your systemic life issues that are bubbling under the surface.

Yes, there was. I was just pointing out that today is no tougher than for previous generations.

I wouldn't judge what people do if stressed - but it's nothing new.

From my own point of view (and it's just mine), I have just chosen to deal with the problem, and not mask it under drugs.

Other people have their own methods. 🙂