Working From Home

[LucyOCS]

I work in a relatively senior role in the Financial Services sector in London. I’ve not worked in the office much for the last 4 years due to maternity leaves and Covid, and for me (and I think my company) it has worked brilliantly. My company has gotten a lot more hours out of me as I’ve been working in the time I would have been commuting, and of course I’m less tired and have been able to put a wash load on each day.

I’m now back from maternity leave and am commuting to the office a couple of days per week. To me it feels like a complete waste of time as most of the people I work with are abroad (large multinational company) so I’m commuting a round trip of 3 hours to sit on Teams calls. Plus I’m still breastfeeding and it’s very stressful worrying if the trains are going to let me make it home for bedtime.

It’s also putting pressure on my DH who has to do both school and nursery drop off and pick up on the days I’m in. In return I do both when I’m at home which means I no longer ever get the chance to put in a long day.

Pressure is now being put on everyone to be in the office 3 days per week, but I think it’s going to be unmanageable.

AIBU to ask what flexibility you have with your office job, and whether you are afforded more flexibility than your colleagues because you have kids? (None of my peers in my team have kids but none of them want to be in the office either, so my boss and his boss I think are reluctant to formally let me wfh more than the others).

The vibe has changed in London regarding working from home, particularly in financial services. I know hedge funds who flat out don’t allow it at all anymore, management consultancies that sell a pitch to their clients saying they can work 4 days at client site (not partners, natch) and banks that are trying to insist on 3+ days a week. Some always allowed that flex especially the lower tier European or Asian banks but some others now want 4-5 days in the office.

I manage large teams and I have to say that while individuals want flexibility and say they work harder from home, the team productivity and engagement is higher now we are in the office more. Something that would take a scheduled meeting to sort out - often a week later - is dealt with in 10 mins by the coffee machine. Then there’s the question of firm culture which is harder to create when no-one is face-to-face.

In many cases in FS, those roles that truly can be fully done from home as easily as from the office are likely to be automated within the next 5-10 years.

OP - I would put arrangements in place to be at work for the required time. It costs money and takes juggling but I think long-term will be required.

We're supposed to aim for 2 days a week in the office but I don't really need to in my role - I sometimes only go in once a month but this month I'll go in once a week as I have various reasons to be in. We are very much treated like grown-ups.

DH is meant to be in 60% of the time. Now, you'd think that means 3 days a week but he was "pulled up" the other week for only being in 30% of the time. We don't know how they calculate it, as he is usually in two days a week (ie 40%) so can only think they are not taking into account sick leave, holiday or the very regular rail strike days. His colleague who is in a similar position to you with childcare issues (and has a role that doesn't really need lots of face to face time) and so will probably now look for another job and they will lose a good employee they've had for years.

I don't think you deserve more flexibility because you have kids - people can have all sorts of reasons for needing flexibility - but it should be a given where possible. It does work for lots of people unless eg you are training someone and so need to spend face to face time with them (eg in a law firm, the trainees need face to face time - in that case I think 60% makes sense, otherwise 40% is more than enough).

Also as no-one has brought it up, many FS firms have brought in productivity measurement software that measures where people are and how productive they appear.

Not sure how software can measure productivity unless it is a very straight-forward semi-automated role.

That is another thing - people talk about productivity, but they don't really define what they mean for their sector and indeed the particular company and role concerned.

It’s a good question @lieselotte . It’s not my field but I understand it is the subject of many a thesis nowadays!

The crude ones measure time at desk (remote and in the office), interactions and so on. I think they’re thematic so miss that a manager is more likely to be on calls while say a lawyer is more likely to be reading a document.

My company is requesting now 2/3 days per week in the office.
It was fully WFH until March of this year.

I hate the trend for asking people to go back in. It’s just about presenteeism and not about efficiency at work. I’d ask for a meeting and explain why this works better for your role and what benefits it has for the company. It’s also really wasteful for the environment asking everyone to go in for no reason. Do they care about that at all? You could try and show you’ve been more successful on wfh and wave any policies you can at your boss. If they won’t budge I’d tell them you will be considering moving to a company with a more modern approach. It’s such a lot of BS imo. Good luck! X

I am in similar environment to you. I have to do 2 days in the office. Once everyone is forced in and especially if there's a common day in it does work well. It doesn't work well when everyone can choose what day and no one is in on the same days. We have various flexible working requests including one person who only has to do one day in the office due to carrying responsibilities. They are not allowed to do childcare while undertaking this but they are on call for an elderly relative so they've let them wfh all days bar one when it's the common day in the office. Its works well.

Yes, in similar environment, we find teams output is actually much much higher at home (and can tell when it isn't and yes people are pulled up on it) it's the project work and training that is better served in office

No school age children in my case, though it seems the theoretical two days a week will include any site visits where they are required. The individual manager and their view seems quite important.

I intentionally try to avoid calls on the days I go to the office, though cannot completely avoid this.

Seems to me a reasonable flexible working request to ask for only two days.

My company has been great in that we all get to decide where we work. There are no mandated days in the office. My manager goes in twice a week, I go in once every two months for wider team meetings. People can go in everyday if they want to. It works well, we are productive and happy and I have just hired someone who lives a very long way from the office who is great for my team but would not have been able to commute even weekly. It works for our company but is perhaps not for everyone.

Big software firm in London. We're asked to all be in together one day a week. How we I've missed this for a month due to surgery, holidays and childcare needs and it's not made an ounce of difference and no one has minded.

My DCs are older, in primary, and I enjoy the one day a week - as well as getting face time in the office, we usually go for lunch and I also meet some friend or another most weeks after work so it's a social excursion for me.

If you're international, can you work longer days with your colleagues in the Americas after bedtime? Or APAC early morning before the drop off? Would your managers be open to an informal arrangement?

I’ve been there 15 years so it says 5 days per week in the office. Believe it or not it also mandates that I take lunch at a certain time and that I’m only allowed to smoke in the boardroom 🤣.

I rarely go to the office now. The last time was for a Christmas team catch up in December.

I have young children and love the flexibility wfh gives me for them but I don’t think having children should give me more flexibility than my colleagues have.

I was quite sympathetic to you until you started implying that parents should get more flexibility than non parents. Yah boo to that shit.

Yes this is what I’m hearing too, and what I’m fearing. DH thinks I should look for another more flexible job but it’s feels to me at the moment that the tide is turning and firms are increasingly requiring more and more days in the office. I think my firm might just be more ahead of the curve than some others, so I could leave and then in 6 months time be with another firm in no better position…

That’s interesting what you say with the software. I’d actually welcome that as I’m definitely not slacking at home.

I didn’t mean that was my view. What I meant was is that legally as a parent I can request flexible working, but that in the case of WFH, those requests from parents aren’t being considered as management have got to be seen to be fair to all.

Financial Services outside of London. Each team has been asked to agree what works best for us. We’re in two days a week but nobody blinks if we aren’t.

Yes, pre this baby I often worked late into the evening from home, often on calls with the US. That’s not possible at present as I have to put baby to bed and he feeds for a good 1.5 hours (I’m feeding him now), but it will definitely start up again once he is weaned. I don’t formally ask for any time off in the day when I do this, and usually I need to work all the hours in the day to get my job done, but equally if a day is quieter I won’t feel guilty if I take some time out to do an extra load of washing or some school admin. Obviously impossible to do that from the office!

I've gone to office one day in 3 years, 3 hours roundtrip. That one day was hell, so much wasted energy. Small division of global services company. It has been great for the children - we do school pickups ourselves. Though if I could teleport, I'd spend more time in office as being in same 4 walls of house takes its toll on the mind.

I’ve been there 15 years so it says 5 days per week in the office. Believe it or not it also mandates that I take lunch at a certain time and that I’m only allowed to smoke in the boardroom 🤣.

Ah yes those were the days, how office life has changed

AIBU to ask what flexibility you have with your office job, and whether you are afforded more flexibility than your colleagues because you have kids?

YABU to think or even ask whether those with children should be afforded more flexibility than those that can't/choose not to!!! WTF! You do realise that people without children in your team might have other compelling reasons to also request more flexibility!?!

You can certainly put a business' case in to ask for more flexibility, but the fact you chose to have children is absolutely irrelevant to your company! You need to highlight how you WFH will support them more, not help you and your family! You keep saying that you and your OH are very senior- so surely you know this already?

In my company, we need to work 3 days in the office, 2 days at home. If we have a day holiday scheduled during the day we are in the office, we need to work in the office the day we are supposed to work from home to compensate. Bit mad especially when this rule only seem to apply to non management, management seems to be able to do 5 days home if they want to.

I and DH continue to have full WFH due to wonderful bosses.
I was in office twice and him once last year.

We’re supposed to be in 60/40 over each fortnight, but I’m still fully WFH for health reasons.

its 2023 and boomer nonsense of “everyone back to the office” can get firmly in the bin. I discovered this site yesterday on LinkedIn, specialising in flexible professional jobs for women, might be worth a look for you? Investing In Women jobs website