How to explain your "mental load" without sounding like a whiney b*tch

[Justsawamagpiechasingarat]

Just that really.
Marriage is absolutely on the rocks but still a lot of love underneath it all and we are committed to trying to work it out.
Went to first couples therapy recently and I found it really hard to describe the practical things that I wish DW would help with. When I started listing actual tasks it sounded ridiculous - they were all things that only take a couple of minutes and aren't really a big deal. DW's problems with me / life were HUGE and I am there saying I feel undervalued because she never makes a packed lunch for our child. I do however think that my gripes are as valid as hers - just not well communicated.
I really hate the term "mental load" and don't like the things that people share about women taking one thing out of a dishwasher only to end up cleaning the entire house etc etc (no offence if you are prone to sharing them, you will know the things that I am trying to describe).
I need to find a way of describing this problem and how it makes me feel....but I am really struggling.
By the way - I am not intending to drip feed anything but have a feeling that I may open up to bitching about stuff more and more as this thread goes on. I am trying to express my feelings and react to my wife's feelings in an open and healthy way IRL so might need to let off some anonymous steam here! Apologies in advance.

Changed username for this one but long time member / poster. Genuinely saw a magpie chasing a rat yesterday near my house. Disturbing and disgusting but natural I suppose. Curious how things ended up.

‘shouting at DS for hours, then dragging him along the road to school even though he was distraught’

Fucking hell. Poor kid. Why are you putting you and your kid through this nightmare? She doesn’t sound worth keeping around at all. The sole point of a relationship is it’s meant to enhance your life, it’s meant to be fun. It’s also not meant to traumatise a child.

when DW is stressed (usually with work) she has very little patience with DS. Shouting at him is not a frequent thing, but it is always in the back of my mind that if I don't make things easier for her she might do that.

It’s interesting that you began this thread by saying that your concerns with DW came across as ridiculous or trivial compared to the huge list of big gripes she has with you - but in fact, it’s not minor at all, is it? You are stuck with the relentless and draining task of not only having to do all the things, but having to do them otherwise your DS (and you) will suffer the emotional harm of the fallout of asking her to do her fair share and cope like an adult.

I imagine DW has learned to be selfish because she has a narcissistic parent (elderly relative). It’s not an excuse but it is a reason. It’s also why she needs/craves your caregiving and making her the centre of her world, and is so destabilised by that not being the case now you have DS to consider too.

It’s not an uncommon dynamic - my DH struggled with it, he was also shit for a long time at the mental load-default parent-domestic lazyfucker-quick to temper you describe. We have had many “discussions”. He’s vastly improved now the DC are older, and I still love him although he’s still emotionally needy and slightly domestically challenged, so there is hope for you and DW if she is truly willing to reflect.

Thank you all of you for taking the time to read my ramblings and respond. I really value and appreciate every piece of advice and encouragement.
Those of you pointing out that DW's selfishness is a learned behaviour from elderly relative (not a parent) are quite right. Probably one of the worse decisions we ever made was moving close to and becoming financially reliant on the elderly relative. In the meantime the rental market has moved on massively and what we pay elderly relative in rent wouldn't pay for a single bedroom in a shared house. We love the elderly relative very much and it's painful to admit that a lot of things will be significantly easier when they are no longer around.
DW does want to change how she deals with the stress that she feels about her job. She doesn't want to carry on the way that she is going and I have made it clear that she can't because we will leave. I have pulled her up on her short fuse with DS several times and things have improved. She is TERRIBLE in the mornings though, so I am always going to worry about the school run and try to make it go smoothly.
Essentially, there are some mighty big problems in the relationship and we both know that we need to take responsibility for our own parts in that which is why we have started the couples therapy as a new approach.
The problem that I am having is the DW doesn't understand the mental load thing at all and every time I try to describe it she seems to rationalise it by saying that she is too stressed/ busy, I should just tell her what needs doing, or the classic "I am not a practical person like you are"

One of the worst things about the mental load is that I spend so much bloody time THINKING about it as well. It’s like a constant muttering soundtrack in my head - every single room I walk into there’s sock on the floor or a mug someone has left or a sink that needs a wipe or a bed that hadn’t been made or curtains that haven’t been opened or some fucking thing that someone expects someone else to do and that someone ends up being me. And I’m chuntering away furiously in my head about it but I can’t ever seem to phrase it in a way that makes it out of my head in a rational way that doesn’t sound like it is whinging.

And THAT infuriated me almost as much as doing this crap.

It's not necessarily a problem that when your DW helps you out with the part of your job you can't do that day (taking DS to school), you do the rest of the things you normally do.

The problem is if you are taking too much mental load in other areas.

If you do all the school stuff but she pays all the bills and deals with anything to do with the car, then fine. If you do all the school stuff, pay the bills, sort the car and she just does a couple of discrete tasks that involve no thinking or planning then it's not fine.

Doing the washing up or dropping a child off at school aren't part of the mental load. They are just chores.
I have children that I give chores to - washing up, picking a sibling up from school. It's great and helpful but it doesn't involve any thinking or planning.
Cooking dinner = chore. Going to the shops with a list = chore. Meal planning, keeping track of what food is in the house, writing the shopping list, doing the online order = mental load.

Your DW sounds like a cliched post war DH.
Is she envious that you carried your son? It sounds like she may be jealous of your bond maybe?

She sounds like an egocentric arsehole. The typical "DH" on here who everyone would say to kick out.

Are you legally married?

I think you need a plan to be less reliant on her and her relative. Make a future for yourself and your son.

In your OP you said she had a list of big crimes you've done - can you share those? I'm wondering if they really are that major or an attempt to redirect the focus of the counselling away from herself.

@CrumpetsandJammmm

Thats called the silent to do list!

The idea is that everything in our home talks to us:
Tidy me away
Clean me
Water me
Mend me

All making us feel that we're overwhelmed and can't cope.

Or even worse from our clothes:
You can't fit into me -> which leads us to think that we're rubbish cos we don't lose weight etc.
You never wear me -> you wasted money

Etc etc

This is what led me to seriously declutter and cut down the amount of stuff we have in the house. Drawers and cupboards are only 50-75% full so its easier to put away than just leave out.

Every item of clothing in my wardrobe is an option today. Not when I lose weight. Not when I become somebody else.

I'm wondering if you can "outsource" some of your workload.

Does the school have a breakfast club? This would remove the need for breakfast, plates in dishwasher and the mental load to have rice crispies in the cupboard and a less stressful morning all round.

You mentioned DS doesn't NEED a packed lunch as the school offers school dinners. This would remove any rush to get this ready in the morning, the mental load about suitable content (and the guilt about healthy eating), and checking and washing the lunchbox at the end of the day.

Does the elderly relative sit down to dinner with you? If not, can you bulk cook the meals they like so you, DS and DW can go back to eating the meals you prefer?

Does DW do bath, bedtime etc with DC, take him to hobbies, have one-on-one time together? Do you get time to do hobbies/ go to the gym?

The problem that I am having is the DW doesn't understand the mental load thing at all and every time I try to describe it she seems to rationalise it by saying that she is too stressed/ busy, I should just tell her what needs doing, or the classic "I am not a practical person like you are"

I think the way to deal with this is that you have to accept that your DW doesn’t have to “understand” the mental load, but she does urgently need to accept that it is real and oppressive to you, and that “rationalising” it is extremely unhelpful and dismissive.

Competitive tiredness or busyness or stress is both toxic and ludicrous. Yes, everyone feels busy and stressed in different ways. Yes, this is worth acknowledging. What’s toxic is when it’s My Stuff/Stress > Your Stuff/Stress.

She does not get a free pass on ‘not being practical’ - this is a skill she can learn or improve on.

And if a sticking point is that she earns more working full time therefore is entitled to be more stressed/do less domestically/not learn or improve then you need to go back to working more and equal the financial input. Take away that argument. Improve your own position.

(I realise this doesn’t address emotions about your DC and working FT/PT but you should try to be a bit black and white in your thinking at least conceptually in order to figure out the actual issues.)

As others have said this is bigger than just the mental load but, to answer that particular question, read Fair Play by Eve Rodsky. Game changer.

Wow. While I think it’s positive that you love your wife enough to be in counselling and are both attempting to work on your marriage in a productive way I think a huge part of the problem is that she’s taking the piss and you are so worn down by it that your boundaries are practically nonexistent. She works 7.5 hours more than you a week, so 1 extra day. I’ll hazard a guess that on the 2 weekdays you’re not working you’re doing childcare instead, so in fact you work more hours per week for your family than she does. And yet YOU are the one doing the brunt of the house, child and relative care. You need to redistribute the work so it’s fair and only then can you begin to tackle the physical intimacy. How can you possibly be in the mood for intimacy with a person who is buying her own self care and leisure time with your labour and exhaustion. Her being stressed by her job is something you should have empathy for but when you listed it in your op it seemed as if this was one of the things that’s wrong with your relationship whereas actually that’s nothing to do with you UNLESS your family relies on DW doing a stressful highly paid job for financial security and therefore you could argue her work stress is tied up in your family choices. And as for her not being centre of your world…that actually makes me judge her as a mother. That sounds harsh, but I just can’t comprehend of a parent wanting anything other from their partner than for them to be the best possible parent to your shared children. My partner is a wonderful dad to our kids. He 100% thinks of them before he thinks of me - but that’s the way it should be!

naturally a womans mental load is far greater than a mans.

UPDATE: She didn't change, things got worse, she started having an emotional (at least, not sure if it's actually become physical) affair and I left her, taking DS. Got the keys to our beautiful new home on Friday and we're loving life!

I'm glad you left her. She's someone else's problem now and you can start focussing on thriving instead of just surviving.

If it's financially viable, I would look into therapy. You can often get it discounted if you're happy to be seen by a last year student who just needs to get practice hours in to qualify. I had therapy to heal from past toxic situations and to help me various behaviours and mentalities and it really helped

What a fantastic update. So happy for you.

I love your update! Well done !

This is a happy outcome !

Oh good op. I hope you’re happy!

Hi OP glad to hear you're happy. Just wanted to say everything you wrote about your situation sounded exactly the same as mine.
I'm getting divorced (although he's still bloody here for another few weeks).
I just didn't want to mother a middle aged "partner" any more so feel a lot better already though
I hope you are much happier now

Best of luck with your new home and your new life OP! I was reading this thread with increasing dismay having only come across it now, and I know there will have been a lot of turmoil in getting here, but it sounds as though leaving will have been absolutely the right thing to do!

Glad you have left her OP - she sounded dreadful. Wishing you the best of luck

Wow - I can't believe people have actually seen my update! Thank you all for responded with your well wishes.

It has been a rough few months and whilst the marriage counselling helped with communication and the wife did get better at taking on some of the "mental load" it was clear that there was a lot more going on. I tried to work on the intimacy (buoyed along by her trying much harder with my gripes) and took more interest in her hobbies etc. BUT it became painfully clear that she didn't want to have sex with me and she didn't want to share her hobbies with me because she had found someone else who has happily put her at the center of their world! She still denies that there is anything physical going on with the person in question, but it doesn't really matter to me either way. She wants to spend time with them and not me, not just sometimes but all the time.

After I came to realize that everything else unraveled. Elderly relative started being nasty to me too, which helped. I realized that I have been putting other people ahead of myself and my child naturally without even realizing it and I have been doing it for far too long.

Went to look at a few houses just to feel like I was being proactive, broadening the search slightly but not expecting to get anywhere with it.....went to see the perfect house and by some amazing stroke of luck they have chosen me as the tenant!! DS is SO SO happy and excited too 😀

That is amazing news. Well done for being so strong! How much will she want to see DS?
So pleased for you

Hope this Analysis may be of use:

The concept of the "mental load" has emerged as a nuanced challenge, often requiring delicate navigation. Addressing this issue without sounding whiny demands a thoughtful and strategic approach, fostering understanding and shared responsibility.

When broaching the topic, it is crucial to shift the focus from the enumeration of tasks to the expression of emotions. Employing "I" statements articulates personal feelings, steering clear of accusatory tones. For instance, communicating, "I feel overwhelmed when..." transcends a mere list of grievances and invites empathy.

The strategic use of positive language is another cornerstone of effective communication. Proposing solutions collaboratively is a key component of this dialogue. Instead of attributing blame, the emphasis is on joint contributions to creating a more equitable distribution of responsibilities. This approach empowers both partners to actively engage in problem-solving.

Reminding each other that the intention is not to criticize but to collaboratively work towards a stronger relationship reinforces the bonds of trust and partnership.

@Justsawamagpiechasingarat