To be upset about ‘university blind’ recruitment

[Newname576]

DS has overcome so many challenges and has an unconditional offer from Cambridge after achieving 4 A star last year. He has worked so hard and we are so proud of him! But I was upset to learn that so many companies are recruiting “university blind”now - what the hell is the point of going to a top Uni if no one will know about it! My younger child says she will apply to Manchester Met and have a ball even though she too is predicted stellar grades as there is no point going to a top Uni

AIBU to be sad that companies are recruiting blind?

@Katesdeadbehindtheeyes you see me. You are the only person to get it on this thread. So grateful

@Newname576 I've had it all my life darling. My background is erm interesting and I've been judged as a teenage parent with mixed race kids with different dads. Ive worked hard to sort my life out yet people still see the Cockney teen mum living in a council flat. All I can say is be proud of him getting into that uni is amazing.

Well then let him go to Wolverhampton and do the easy degree? If you’re that arsed, there is always the option of…not going to Cambridge. You’re being ridiculous.

What you’re missing is your son is the exception to the rule. And as a person from that background you should be glad that power of Oxbridge over normal people is a little less. And I say that as an Oxbridge graduate with a 1st.

Lol. So all the grounds where your child is at a disadvantage is ok to be blind, but the one where he IS privileged isn’t? That’s the most self indulgent nonsense. To put it bluntly, it’s not all about your son.
he may not even get a 1st. Just a thought.

@Newname576 your son sounds academically great. But if he carries your attitude he won't get far in a work place. The kind of university I went to, you would view as "crap" yet here I am aged 41 still succeeding in a career related to my degree. You just need to wind in your nasty attitude it, seriously take a good look at what your saying.

Your ds sounds amazing and of course you're proud of him.

I agree that not all degrees are equal, but I also don't think the quality of degree is the only thing that recruiters should be looking at. As others have said, there are many skills employers look for.

My dh went to Cambridge, got a double first and then did his PhD there. He had an amazing time, but now works for a small charity so doesn't have a glitzy career. I'm sure the charity didn't care where his degree was from, they were interested in his other skills. But that doesn't mean he regrets going to Cambridge rather than a lower-regarded uni.

Be proud. No one is stopping you. And the achievement remains regardless of recruitment processes. It doesn’t change the fact that the blind system is meant to prevent bias so the best candidate gets the job. It’s highly unlikely that the only criteria looked at is degree class so his talents if he’s so amazing will shine through regardless.

…completely missing out that it will give a chance to the working class disabled kid who didn’t go to oxbridge but did get a 1st from the ‘normal’ uni which was the only one she could go to because of accessibility and needing carers at home. Or the kid who got a place at Oxbridge but couldn’t go because they had caring responsibilities at home so went to the ‘crap’ uni near home. Or the black girl who didn’t get into Oxbridge because she went to a comp in south wales where the idea was never even floated as a possibility in her shit school and she’s the first person whoever even went to uni and she smashed it, but it wasn’t a russell group.

all THOSE people get a chance too.

Op I find your thinking a bit snobby tbh. I say this as someone who went to Cambridge and was very academic.

Recruitment was not blind in my time and I assumed jobs/ promotions would fall into my lap and I had a bit of a sense of entitlement about the world of work tbh.

But then I had a rude awakening in my first years in work when I saw others from these supposedly far inferior unis progressing quicker and doing much better. Whilst they didn't have my academic credentials, when it came to soft skills, dealing with people, leadership, clients etc, they were miles ahead. I was great at the more technical stuff but that alone is not enough in many jobs.

I've finally caught up now after 15 years and some tough lessons. I now see that my degree from Cambridge isn't the be all and end all. I've met some of the most incredible professionals who went to what you'd think of as 'minor' unis yet they have a myriad of skills beyond acaemia.

I am an academic, and you are categorically wrong about universities. A 1st class degree is a 1st class degree.

I agree. This is how we recruit. I'd be more likely to prioritise non oxbridge candidates.

My company are in a big 5 uni town and this is usual here.

Don't worry, in, for example, top law firms the partners interviewing will be able to tell that your son went to oxbridge and their inherent bias will kick in making them look upon him more favourably. There are numerous little cues and norms that give it away eg Oxbridge kids talk about their time at college not uni.

Yeah your absolutely right i was just talking about the OP situation as its similar to my own. I'm not trying to take away from the examples you have raised they are all very valid.

That was a reply to @TheOriginalEmu great name btw.

Kindly yabu.

Personally I was fed up with working with graduates who thought they knew it all because they had a degree from X university. A lot of them had no common sense, couldn't see beyond the fact that they had that degree and didn't want to learn any more. And they were very snobby about it. Any degree is just the building block upon which you build a career. Learning for life is also important,having a mind that is enquiring,open to new ideas, able to take on challenges. It should show that the recipient of that degree is capable of all those things.
My oldest could have gone to Oxford but chose another University( a very good one) because he felt it suited him better. He knew University was just the start of it, not the be all and end all.

Right, @Newname576 , I see your concern, which wasn’t remotely apparent from your OP which I responded to!

@TheOriginalEmu’s post sums it up for me. Blind recruitment is designed to do several things. It’s trying to level the playing field for those entering the job market after decisions made at 18. Don’t forget that for every brilliant young person who makes it into Oxbridge there are also the ones who don’t, but could have done. Some of them will go to other big name universities and others not, depending on their circumstances. Three years at Oxbridge doesn’t erase their potential. It’s still there, waiting to be seen.

But also academic brilliance may not even be relevant for many jobs. If your son has career aspirations for a certain field, and it’s something that’s right for him, then his strengths in that will be what matter, not what degree class he got at all.

Blind recruitment is trying to drive diversity. Your son has already smashed one barrier. He has succeeded on his own strengths. He will do that again for the right job. Plenty of employers still have totally open recruitment where your son’s achievement will be immediately apparent. Those that don’t, who are running big schemes, have thorough and multi-stage processes. The first hurdle is an application form, to get through the door, but after that, candidates succeed on what they bring into exercises, tests, group work and interviews, to show that they can succeed in the field, whatever university they went to. No one can take human bias out of any process but unless your son is applying for jobs that are totally wrong for him, he will bring the same qualities that have seen him succeed so far to the next stage in his life.

but...."If you have completed a BA or BFA you will be eligible to take the Oxford MA in or after the 21st term since you matriculated (seven years after matriculation)."

So, if you go to Oxford you already have a higher degree on paper.

No one has said OP is privileged, people are describing the privilege of getting in the system.

Your posts smack of someone now in the door and wanting to shut it very tightly behind you.

@Newname576 So you agree that there is unfair recruitment based on factors that have no bearing on the candidates ability to do the best job but you think that the unfair bias towards oxbridge applicants before inviting to interview is ok. So some biased recruitment is ok and others isn't?

Blind recruitment does not get you the job. It gets you in the door. Until blind recruitment what happened was some of the best candidates were not even being seen.

There are as you well know, a gazillion reasons why some brilliant students would not be at oxbridge that has nothing to do with their ability. You want to keep them down to make sure your ds has an advantage. This is no different from middle class white families wanting to keep their advantage. It's all wrong.
If your ds is brilliant and the best candidate it will shine through at interview

There is a more than just the uni name - eg in Cambridge he will get great connections that will stand him in good stead - who you know can be important as what you know.

The amount of money you are spending i would not be happy if my dd wanted.to go for a piss up - she could get a job and pay for that herself!

LOL.

Next time I'll flounce off to a place where that I think is more in tune with my confirmation bias. I'm hoping that the HE forum won't tell you any different, but if it is full of pearl clutching helicopter mummies then maybe it will.

You've already decided you are right. What is the point of asking for opinions?

I've worked in Higher Education, I've worked in the private sector for a FTSE 100 company and I've worked in the public sector and I've been involved in recruiting in all of them. It is in the best interests of any organisation to consider candidates on their individual merits and not allow brand names to sway decisions - you get the best person for the job. As I said previously if your DS is good then he will be a strong candidate, but if you arrogantly assumes that the name of the university he has attended will be all he needs to get a job he will be in for a shock. He has worked hard for an opportunity to have choice in his career, Cambridge is just the beginning, not the top of the mountain.

In my experience, there is a much higher proportionate of exceptional graduates from Oxford or Cambridge than other universities, and some universities produce a steady flow of average or poor graduates.

If recruiters are going to remove universities from their application forms, they are going to have to work much harder during the recruitment process to find those exceptional candidates. It seems to me they are intentionally removing a useful shortcut, and they will likely end up with the same graduates anyway if they are successful at finding the exceptional characters.

Blind recruiting will help any Oxbridge candidate as they won't be getting the role because of privilege, they will be there with talent