To think this is off? Interest in opinions of teachers

[Newbie198]

Think small department- head of department and one other subject teacher. Subject teacher has made good impression in the two years he has been there, works hard, hits deadlines, excellent relationship with students, excellent results, taken on a lot of the head of dept role (writing schemes of work, creating resources, marking exam papers for head of dept etc) outstanding reports from ECT mentor and verbal feedback from colleagues, students and parents.

Professional working relationship between the two, but teacher feels that head of dept not particularly appreciative of his efforts and often takes credit for their work.

Head of dept secures new job elsewhere.
Tells teacher this news a week after securing job as a drop in comment during a meeting. Teacher congratulates head of dept and excitedly asks if school will recruit for head of dept position (teacher would love to do this, and thinks they are more than capable)

Head of dept casually says that oh, it was advertised last week. Teacher expresses interest in applying. Head of dept vaguely mentions the closing date being very soon and changed subject. Teacher quickly applies that evening.

Regardless of your views, eg teacher not as good as they thought- does this seem off to you?

YABU- teacher obviously not worthy of applying
YANBU- weird not to even mention to the only other person in your dept?

@Gymrabbit
Thank you! Obviously I’ve said I’m biased but that’s exactly what I think and how the teacher feels.

It’s a tiny department, and the teacher does feel they are capable and will not be an ECT next term. They’ve worked their socks off and frankly were insulted at the bad manners!

If they are overlooked (in that they are not interviewed, I appreciate there may be more experienced applicants who may secure the post) they will indeed be looking elsewhere.

If he's taking umbrage before he's even moved onto M3, he might need to stop and think about things before he burns all his boats there. If the style of Music or Drama (most likely 'niche' or 'small' subjects) is not one that is in keeping with the Head's preferences or vision, he won't get a promotion at the expense of somebody who can go on about Italian tours and the wonder and beauty of their last school Bach Society and Chamber Choir.

And they'll still need to recruit for SLT. As Music/Drama have limited progression, being almost totally Maternity Leave/Retirement in terms of vacancies, there's actually quite a good chance of them receiving multiple applications from experienced music specialists who are after SLT roles. Two birds with one stone and all that.

If he is Music or Drama, his best chance to get practically parachuted into a HoD role without SLT is to apply to an RI in an unpopular area with few other schools where the HoD has been on sick leave for at least a term, as they'll be at the stage of cover supervisors and won't be so picky about someone who hasn't even taught a full GCSE course with results to show for it at the point of application.

Unprofessional for HoD not to tell junior staff as soon as they have secured alternative employment. Also HoD sounds like a bit of a git - hasn't written SoW and takes credit for junior doing it is proper piece of work behaviour. SoW should be in place. Also doing HoD's marking for them? Three instances of unprofessional behaviour is the charm.

Depends on the subject area, and in whether they get the job, but I would think your friend might want to think about applying for a step up somewhere else.

Also most people in my subject area (core) seemed to get promoted incredibly quickly. Very normal for most of the dept to hold extra responsibilities within two years.

You're their very proud mum aren't you? I'm sure they're wonderful, but less than two years out of uni, nowhere near experienced enough. Sorry!

I said I was biased, and to leave opinions aside (eg teacher might not be as good as he thinks)

I know he might be inexperienced, over confident, brilliant, crap and everything inbetween.

My question always was.. isn’t it still weird not to tell him?

I wouldn't tell my colleagues I had been offered a job. I would tell my friends. Most of my colleagues - even the ones in my dept - do not make the friends list

I would be like you @MrsHamlet

The HOD told the teacher they were going for the job, all the details about the job. Teacher knew they’d made it through first stage, and that they’d made the second day of interviews, then down to final two. Teacher text wishing HOD good luck and HOD said it was an amazing school.

I still think it’s all a bit off!

But I really have appreciated everyone’s take on it, it does help keep things in perspective.

I think you’re over invested in this. Each school/HOD/person is different. Maybe the HOD didn’t think he’d be interested? Maybe the HOD has a lot on his mind and informing the ECT wasn’t their priority? Maybe they thought the ECT would hear about it via other means and didn’t want to interfere? Maybe the HOD hates the job/school and wouldn’t wish it on their colleague? None of us know. In another school something else might have happened - or not.

As far as an ECT being suitable, again different circs/different schools. No one else applies - you’re in. Dozens of great candidates - you’re out.

Personally I think HOD demands a lot more than SOW and marking. Working as a middle manager, responsible for results, PM-ing other staff (often in other departments - I had 4 people to PM, not all in my dept), managing the budget (resources and equipment), supporting staff with behaviour, subject detentions, first line to parents … the list goes on. That’s why I’d ideally want someone with a few years experience - I was 5 years in before I got my first responsibility post.

Schools work in mysterious ways. And each one is different.

It’s a tiny department, and the teacher does feel they are capable and will not be an ECT next term. They’ve worked their socks off and frankly were insulted at the bad manners!
If they think working their socks off and writing some schemes of work means they should be seriously considered for middle leadership just out of their ECT then they aren't ready for middle leadership.

It's not weird not to tell him. If they told him and said nothing else then from your post he's likely to take it as confirmation that they think he is ready. If they told him and said they didn't think he was ready, he's probably going to complain that he never had a fair shot at it and missed out because it's personal.

KTheGrey
Also core here and have seen similar, though I'm not convinced it's always a good thing. Sometimes I think TLRs are given out in core subjects as a retention incentive because schools can't get enough specialists. Smaller TLR3s or similar can be a nice stepping stone for those with potential, but I don't think fast progression to HoD is a good thing.

It's ridiculous for an ECT to think they're suitable or ready for such a role.
In my experience, it's always male teachers who think they're up for significant promotions after 5 minutes, without putting in the time or experience.
I don't care if I'm flamed.

In my experience, it's always male teachers who think they're up for significant promotions after 5 minutes, without putting in the time or experience.
I don't care if I'm flamed.
Mine too so we can be flamed together.😂

Slap me in oil because I’m also up for a flaming.

Welcome! 😁

Plenty of room in the fire 😄

This! Ive just secured my first SLT Role and I'm on UPS3 (so have had a lot of responsibility as a senior teacher, leading several subjects and taking on all the assemblies etc plus stepping up temporarily and mentoring student teachers).

I'm 12 years in to teaching and am confident in taking on this much bigger role and promotion because I have the experience behind me.

Ridiculous of this teacher to think as an ECT you can just step into a leadership role!!

Interested to know who you are in this situation and how you know so much about what the supposed failings of this departing HOD?

In my school you would have got an email advertising the job and would have got an interview as a courtesy . However, if they had 40 applications from experienced teachers they then might say actually it’s a bit early, maybe next time. It wouldn’t be cloak and dagger though. We wouldn’t appoint an ect to his unless we had no one else.

Interested to know who you are in this situation and how you know so much about what the supposed failings of this departing HOD?
It's clearly her precious son who's a Billy Big Bollocks who thinks he's awesome and doing the job of someone with tons more experience, and has been whining to mummy about how much he does and how he should be promoted.

It's clearly her precious son who's a Billy Big Bollocks who thinks he's awesome and doing the job of someone with tons more experience, and has been whining to mummy about how much he does and how he should be promoted.
That or it's the same poster from a few months ago who was writing about how they're doing the HoD's job for them because they were doing a range of non-HoD tasks that are regularly delegated within a department.

Not sure if any interested teachers out there will still see this thread- teacher got an interview 😊

Maybe this is simply to give them just an opportunity to interview out of courtesy or maybe a serious contender, impossible to know. Interview is next week so we will have to wait and see..

That's good news!
I'm still going with the theory that they are suitable for the job, the current HOD knows this but also has a "friend" that wants the job hence didn't mention it to your friend!

It'll be interesting to see if the current HOD knows any of the other candidates!

Teacher got the job!!

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4809069-she-got-the-job-teacher-related

@towriteyoumustlive you were right in that they were suitable!

I don’t know anything about the other candidates though 😊