AIBU to despair about DofE cheating

[WhatTheHeckIsIt]

Someone I know very well is the teacher who leads the Duke of Edinburgh at a school. Their teen is going to Buckingham Palace to receive their gold award. There is no way on this planet the teen has completed any of the activities - it's a stitch up.

It's made me feel really sad.

a) I expected more of this person
b) I expected more of their child
c) how could you let your child accept an award amongst people who have worked really hard to achieve it
d) it devalues everyone else's award
e) it's just shit

Rant over - but there's nothing I can do is there?

Get yourself a hobby Op seriously. How about rock climbing with no hands! There's one for ya! You can use your sticky beak to go as high as the sky!

OP IS A BAD GRASS

Give your head a wobble. The post is about whether it’s right or not & how I think it’s sad. It’s called a discussion. Making an observation on a public forum designed for people’s observations is not ‘grassing’.

Well, you are a charmer. Have some 💐 to brighten your day.

Considering dobbing in a child for some minor embellishments is pretty horrendous tbh

Why has this triggered you so much op?! It’s quite funny really. Of all the truly awful things going on in the world this is the thing you are focussed on?!

@TheaBrandt oh, give over. Doing DofE is bloody hard work - kids work really hard to get those hours in volunteering, quite often in situations that are really uncomfortable for young teens. To see another kid blatantly lie about having done it is an absolute kick in the teeth. It has happened for years but that doesn’t make it any less galling.

You may have missed as this thread has got quite long, that there is no evidence on this thread of anyone having completed DofE without having fulfilled the requirements.

Personally I only concerned myself with my own child completing the necessary tasks. I’m not interested in the DofE of the children of others.

@jgw1 how would you like people to prove that it wasn’t properly completed? When I was at school it was an open secret that some teachers would sign it off for you and for many years Torquay Boys Grammar openly cheated at Ten Tors which is why so many tried to do it through them. It absolutely happens and you’re naive if you think otherwise.

How did they cheat? Sneaky 4x4s? Helicopter?
(idle curiosity - one of mine has just done it)

DofE need to have a phone line or email address where whistleblowers can report cheating.

Well perhaps by stating which of the requirements wasn't achieved and why.
There was some discussion in the middle of the thread about a group that allegedly didn't complete the expedition requirements, but the person arguing that seemed unaware of the 20 conditions for expeditions and found it hard to say which one had not been met.

When I was at school it was an open secret that some teachers would sign it off for you and for many years Torquay Boys Grammar openly cheated at Ten Tors which is why so many tried to do it through them.

Our school failed two groups on a bronze expedition (private school with more than its fair share of high maintenance parents).

Speaking from the other side (I'm an approved activity provider for D of E courses), the rule changes have changed the award significantly. I don't run expeditions but I think you can go home overnight currently.

Some changes are positive. You don't have to do an hour a week on the other sections, for example, you could do a block of four hours in a month. A number of my students do this, particularly the gold ones also juggling A levels. And you can do back to back practice and qualifying expeditions.

Its interesting, but at my kids (private) school, they were reprimanded by the DofE people for bussing the kids to the start of the walk....I can't see them getting away with signing it off if people don't do it properly...

I'm wondering if "times have changed" as a lot of people are quoting what happened at their school, probably 20 years ago. it would be quite hard to cheat nowadays...

Its interesting, but at my kids (private) school, they were reprimanded by the DofE people for bussing the kids to the start of the walk....I can't see them getting away with signing it off if people don't do it properly...

That's odd as it's explicitly allowed under the current rules for expeditions.

They were told the kids were "expected to make their own way" to the start and home again. , I have found what you are talking about is that a very new thing? This was a 2021 summer expedition. Neither of my two did any in 2022, but 2023 they were sent on the train.

I think it's been a temporary flexibility more or less since the pandemic started but can't swear to it.

My DD did bronze last year, we spend weekends and holidays super busy as a family and my friends know this. DD did volunteering an hour a week after school Friday, went ice skating (and still does) after school Wednesday and learnt Finnish on her phone! The practice and assessed expeditions were the only things she had to do at the weekend. I know there is more to the gold but anyone who knows this would wonder where DD got the time, so it is perfectly plausible this person did do their gold in my opinion!
Though her friend did forge my signature at one point 😀I would have signed anyway but I didn’t get round to it and she wanted to send off her evidence!

What utter tosh.

No where in anything DofE says is there any indication about how participants should get to the start of their expedition.

yes I found it on the d of E website in a PDF but it doesn't have a date on it.

https://www.dofe.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/DofE-Expeditions-from-2023.pdf

It's listed here as a "permanent change from 2023".

"Getting themselves to the expedition" was definitely there as a requirement pre-2020, and possibly pre-2021....

It was a bronze summer/autumn 2020 expedition that was using a coach to get there and back home (twice) and not camping as the camping element was suspended in 2020...

I'll chat to the leader as it looks like it's fine now!

DofE expeditions are assessed against 20 conditions. For at least the last 25 years how one has got to the start or home from the finish has not been part of those 20 conditions.

I remember a poster coming on here a few years ago extolling the virtues of the DoE - he talked about how challenging it was for the kids to get through the programme he ran and this was bronze he was referring to. My two kids were doing bronze and it was a breeze for them, he couldn't understand why they didn't find it challenging - it was like the two experiences were not related. Certainly had it been challenging they might have found it worthwhile but the day they finally got their certificate -almost a year after they did the expedition - they didn't feel any sense of pride or achievement, it was all a bit of a joke.

I think for some it is the commitment that is the challenge. So 12 months of a weekly volunteering or fitness is easy for some as they pretty well do it anyway but hard for others. Same with the expedition if they are used to camping and are active it isn't going to be that challenging but for others it will be.

For my GS just coming to the end of it I would say the biggest challenge for him has been keeping all his records of what he's done, he does a few hours of sport a week and help with the younger children so to him that is just normal and easy to forget to record it and get it signed off. He's done his practice expeditions and thoroughly enjoyed them (even though one was in appalling weather) and he'd do it for fun if he wasn't doing Gold. He's looking forward to his expedition as a bit of a treat at the end of A levels, he knows a couple of very non sporty people who have found the practice expeditions very difficult and aren't looking forward to the real thing. It varies.

Maybe the kids who find it easy aren't really the ones who are going to benefit most from it.