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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

that expectations should not differ for MIL and FILs?

48 replies

Cupper · 27/04/2023 14:41

So many times I read on here or talk to people who get upset because their MIL did not help with a newborn or childcare. Yet the majority of FILs can do 0% but will never get berated or criticised. MILs will get criticised for not bringing food, helping with the cleaning. The FIL can sit there and get offered a cup of tea and not be expected to do anything.

Yes I am sure there are some FILs out there who do everything.

OP posts:
Bluevelvetsofa · 27/04/2023 14:46

On MN, MiLs are pretty much persona non grata. FILs are not really in the picture, unless they’re creepy.

Somebodiesmother · 27/04/2023 14:48

Are you new to the patriarchy?

WheelsUp · 27/04/2023 14:49

Of course not but the bar for being a good father or grandfather is much lower than the female equivalents.

Original poster
Cupper · 27/04/2023 14:55

Somebodiesmother · 27/04/2023 14:48

Are you new to the patriarchy?

No but I wonder why some women continue to perpetuate something that is negative for themselves.

OP posts:
lovemelongtime · 27/04/2023 14:57

Couldn't agree more. I have been lucky with both. MIL always used to help cleaning, cooking or anything really and FIL used to always bring tools round and fix stuff for us. Both sadly no longer with us.

Princessbananahamock · 27/04/2023 15:21

It’s a nature nuture thing. We have menopause so I expect that was (evolution) so we as females could look after our offspring’s children when they had a baby to care for. You see it in other mammals. It’s probably still in our genes left over from stone age etc. however as females we have evolved we now hunter gatherers ie work I think it’s the leftover bit of our predecessors that grandma should care for the grandkids. Just my thoughts.

lunaloveroo · 27/04/2023 16:19

The older generation men in my life are all very hands on grandparents. It's the grandads who do most of the school pick ups, taking kids to park, running after them etc.

FrozenGhost · 27/04/2023 16:22

I personally don't have different expectations, but I can see why others do. We are mammals at the end of the day.

Original poster
Cupper · 27/04/2023 16:24

FrozenGhost · 27/04/2023 16:22

I personally don't have different expectations, but I can see why others do. We are mammals at the end of the day.

@FrozenGhost So being mammals makes sexism ok?

OP posts:
GeorgeGerald · 27/04/2023 16:49

YANBU but I think some of it is circumstantial to the norms of the generation e.g. my PIL were both 61 when our first DC was born - FIL was still working PT and MIL had 'retired' (gave up work when she had her first DC, had a part-time job when DC were older teenagers but gave it up after three years as she 'didn't like it and had to clean the house') so MIL had a lot more time on her hands and I don't think that was unusual at all. I'm late forties now so that won't be as true for people having babies now though.

My PIL gripe when when my first DC was born is actually more directed at FIL (despite neither of them offering a meal or any kind of useful practical help - both my parents were dead by this point too). They 'helped' for the first time when DD was about 2 months old by taking her out on a walk. Great! I got on with a bit of cleaning for 30-40 mins. They arrived back with a puncture in one of the pram/pushchair wheels (never happened before or after this) and FIL asks if I have puncture repair kit (I do and get it out). He just says 'oh good', they both eat the lunch I made them and then leave me with the puncture to sort. I've always leaned towards being unimpressed with FIL over this - I could argue it is because he was the one who asked after the kit but actually, it was pretty sexist of me...

DisquietintheRanks · 27/04/2023 16:54

@Cupper I think the arguement would be that being mammals makes us behaviourally dimorphic but I'm not sure that's entirely true.

Having said which I'd not have handed my babies to either my dad or FiL to look after single handedly whereas I never had any qualms with my mum or MiL. That was down to acquired skills not their sex though.

Lydiahateswashing · 28/04/2023 04:59

My experience is FILs don’t get a look in. MIL has sharp elbows

GoodChat · 28/04/2023 05:26

So being mammals makes sexism ok?

In the animal kingdom.

OrderOfTheKookaburra · 28/04/2023 05:28

Given my FIL did sweet FA with his own DC why would I want him to suddenly care for my DC? My MIL had loads of DC and was willing to help when my 2 were born. She was more than happy to do housework and cooking leaving me free to concentrate on my DC, whereas all my FIL knew how to do was mix a mean G&T and bbq things.

OrderOfTheKookaburra · 28/04/2023 05:31

Although I did ask him to hold DS1 when he's been with us for a week already as they had both travelled from abroad to be there (FIL came 4 weeks after MIL though) and he said it was the first time he had had a chance to do that so was delighted to. DS slept peacefully in his arms for about an hour!

My then DH and MIL were shocked when I raised with them that FIL had never even had a chance to hold his DGS - idiots....

ChellyT · 28/04/2023 05:48

My inlaws were wonderful with wanting to help with childcare when prices went through the roof and I'm talking 25 years ago.

FIL was retired and MIL worked p/t. FIL had my son by himself every Monday when I went back to work and planned the day with his grandson, gardening, yard clearing, park, sandwiches in the park, shopping and prepping dinner for when MIL got home. My son has the fondest memories of his Diggy (FIL's nickname). FIL never changed any of his own children's nappies and didn't flinch knowing he'd have to start at the ripe age of 70.

Mothership4two · 28/04/2023 05:54

It's also generational and yes sexist. DM and MIL would have been the primary carers when babysitting ours and DF and FIL have certainly never changed a nappy. We haven't got to that stage yet but DH was pretty hands on so I hope he would be the same with GC

TheaBrandt · 28/04/2023 06:07

There are exceptions that prove the rule. My uncle was a pretty traditional older generation “get the train to London at 8.03” type his wife very loving / maternal did everything child related for their now adult kids.

. When dd1 a baby Dh and I got serious flu and I went to stay with them so they could look after her as I just couldn’t. They looked after their young gc I had assumed my aunt would take the lead but no. She went out to work and my 70 something very formal uncle did literally everything all day for 2 pre schoolers - day after day. Couldn’t believe it!

Mothership4two · 28/04/2023 06:13

My MIL made it very clear to me that childminding would not be available. She was happy for them to do the very occasional babysitting. I think my lovely FIL would have been thrilled to have had GC regularly as long as he didn't have to do anything "yucky"!

WandaWonder · 28/04/2023 08:37

No matter which inlaw maybe if women married or had kids with an man that did their fair share the inlaws would not need to help as much?

But surely parents must have some idea of how much or little inlaws would do before having kids?

Naunet · 28/04/2023 09:24

Princessbananahamock · 27/04/2023 15:21

It’s a nature nuture thing. We have menopause so I expect that was (evolution) so we as females could look after our offspring’s children when they had a baby to care for. You see it in other mammals. It’s probably still in our genes left over from stone age etc. however as females we have evolved we now hunter gatherers ie work I think it’s the leftover bit of our predecessors that grandma should care for the grandkids. Just my thoughts.

So why don’t men die once their sperm starts to lose quality? What’s he point of them?!
Its silly to think women weren’t hunter gathers too though, name one other species where the females can’t hunt and feed their young - men just like the narrative that it was exclusively their role because it strokes their egos.

HP456 · 28/04/2023 09:44

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HP456 · 28/04/2023 09:46

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GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 28/04/2023 09:57

Princessbananahamock · 27/04/2023 15:21

It’s a nature nuture thing. We have menopause so I expect that was (evolution) so we as females could look after our offspring’s children when they had a baby to care for. You see it in other mammals. It’s probably still in our genes left over from stone age etc. however as females we have evolved we now hunter gatherers ie work I think it’s the leftover bit of our predecessors that grandma should care for the grandkids. Just my thoughts.

This is actually true - humans did evolve to have a menopause so that grandmothers would be a thing, because our young are so much more helpless than those of other mammals, and more intelligent. Apparently it’s only humans and elephants who have this, elephants also living in female herds with a matriarch.

However in a civilised society, yes FILs are as capable of help as MILs - plus of course the father of the child should be playing the major role in supporting the new mum/ doing his bitX and the mother’s father can also help out if around.

So really new mums should have more support than they once did. It seems to be the opposite though, with everyone thinking it’s someone else’s job to do, in many families.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 28/04/2023 09:58

My late ex FIL was pretty helpful to be honest - not in the very new born stage (my first DC was extremely sick, and MIL was invaluable at that point) but once she was up and walking.