100k+ salary, is it worth it?

[Goingtogetslated]

For the record…Not trying to be insensitive…

partner and I both earn approx 150k each. Working long and unpredictable hours with high levels of stress and responsibility.

Yet here we are living in a 3 bed terrace in the east end of london, a basic car, neither of us into high end expenses/dining out/clothes. We used to holiday a lot pre children, I guess would classify as our major expenditure in the past.

But is it actually worth it? A decent 4/5 bed house (with kerb appeal I admit) in the commuter belt seems to be coming in at 1.5 million minimum. Add the commuting costs/ extended nursery hours, paid help required theres barely anything left - relatively speaking.

Would we not be better off sacking it all in, moving to the countryside and earning enough to pay the bills?

We appear to be stuck in this middle ground where we earn too much to have any allowances from the state, contribute a lot to the government yet not enough for any real benefits in lifestyle

Coming in here to make the maths clear - 150k is not 5k a month after tax it's 7.5k a month after tax - so combined 15k a month. So doing your sums again - 6k mortgage - childcare 2k - commuting 500 - that leaves you with £6.5k a month not £1.5k. I'm like you higher earner - gross I earn more than both of you together and believe it or not I still don't feel rich but that's for different reasons and my own insecurities. I do however feel grateful for what I have - and yes I work hard and have stress and pressures - but I certainly wouldn't think to ask that I get something back from this Government - if anything I will have to pay more going forward. You have to see it that yes while you have your 3 bed terrace in East London - at least you HAVE it - many people don't - many people may never have their own home due to prices being what they are...... there is a point in life where you have to marry your childhood dreams and expectations to reality and in order to be happy you have to manage both. For you - you don't have the house of your dreams and kerb appeal - for others they don't have your house - life is relative....... we don't get tax allowances because frankly we don't need them - all you would do is buyer a bigger house with kerb appeal to impress others with your wealth and status - isn't it better than instead your tax money goes to fund the NHS - Universal Credit - Council Housing and so on - that's what's wrong with the world today - most of us who are lucky enough to be financially stable are not satisfied with what we have - we always want more..... instead we should be sharing around what we do have via our taxes - unless your life is woefully bad in your house - then it's better that your tax money be used for the benefit of others.

150k is not the squeezed middle!!

You can live a very nice life on 150k in a London suburb, what planet are people on?

They wouldn’t understand it. I always thought MN was generally a well educated place. AIBU has certainly been an education that it’s not.

Ok Scotland is the highest taxed county in the union if you prefer

unfortunately I have to pay higher rate taxes to support all the unemployed nationalists.

Ffs. When will people accept that earning 150k is not the “middle” - it’s less than the top 5%. And it’s certainly not “squeezed”.

I think most people on here forget that the more you earn the more tax you pay. At least your salary is split between two and not one sole earner as they would pay proportionately more tax!

I can sympathise with you, when you earn such an amount the career is very demanding meaning you need extra hours childcare and things for conscience to fit in your lifestyle. London is incredibly expensive, and 300k with kids doesn’t stretch that far anymore… £1500 a month doesn’t go near covering our food bills and we are only a family of 3. My husband is a high earner, but I never buy myself clothes and we never eat out! It doesn’t feel like there is anything left for luxuries. You are not unreasonable at all.

Well your user name is certainly correct. That said between the 2 of you your take home is probably £15k a month. You don't need to be dropping millions on a nice place in commuter belt unless you are looking for an estate. A lot depends on what you are looking for and whats an appropriate commuter distance together with how much remote working you both do. But been there seen it done it and would certainly recommend exiting London.

@snowydays10

You cant find any money for luxuries but you're spending 1.5k a month on shopping?

You're not in the middle ground. At a push two people earning 150k combined could be classed in the middle ground. You earn more than the overwhelming majority of the country. Don't be so ridiculous. I have friends living in London earning 200k combined and they're doing very nicely and feel like they are too. You must waste a fuck ton of money if you feel like you're "in the middle ground" on that money.

How old are you? How old are the children?

Maybe part of the problem is " houses I can visualise myself in are 1.3 -1 .5 million"?

There are commuter houses that cost less than that.

You live in a three bed terrace but want a 4-5 bedroom home? Why not move to Metroland where you can still commute on the tube but your kids will get the benefits of clean air and some of the best schools in the country for free? You can probably get a decent house for half your budget. We live in a three bed terrace with an income of less than 40K...

I cannot believe some of the awful comments on here!
OP was not asking for sympathy or complaining about being poor, simply asking for advice that, if on her great salary, she still cannot afford certain things, should she consider moving.
I think a lot of these comments on here are fuelled by jealousy which is a shame that we can’t just be kind and supportive of one another.
I have a degree and a masters but chose to work part time to spend more time with my kids and just ‘scrape by’ on a lower income. That’s MY choice.
It was also my choice to have three children rather than focus on my career and have more disposable income. We all have choices.

I actually think it’s incredibly unfair that the people on higher tax brackets, paying the most into the system also don’t get any support for childcare (even though they work long hours in London!) and yet I have friends who don’t work at all that get free childcare.

OP of your current life is making you miserable then I say leave London! Life is too short.

@DoodleDoo37
Great post, it's a shame more people don't think like you, it would be a much nicer country to live in. This thread is the most 'me me me' thread I've read on Mumsnet in a while.

Why not opt for an interest-only mortgage?

Yes, of course you do end up paying more overall but the value of the house will increase, you will have more disposable income now (when your kids are younger and you want more time/flex) and you might even be able to invest in a rental property which will be your vehicle for paying the mortgage off, unless you downsize in which case it should sort itself out.

I'm not talking reckless spending or not planning for the future, but I don't understand people who don't max out now - I want to have the best lifestyle and time with kids whilst they're young and I'm in reasonable health.

I'm a single-income household with 15% of your income, OP (and some of that is rental income from a lodger, otherwise I wouldn't be able to make ends meet). I live in a part of London (zone 4-5) referenced by a PP upthread.

I am actually in that squeezed middle you mentioned - slightly too much in savings to qualify for UC but the cost of living is rising and I am counting every penny. I'm still aware that I'm pretty fortunate compared to lots of others. It's quite hard to swallow hearing a household on £300k a year comparing themselves to me.

That said, you could get a nice home for less than £1.5 million in this area. Maybe around the million pound mark or a little over (can't believe I'm casually mentioning homes a little over a million, mine isn't in that category). The schools are good, it's 25 minutes by train into a mainline London station. In a similar time I can drive out into countryside.

Have you really looked in detail into options a little further out in London? You won't be paying childcare costs at that level forever. Maybe you don't think it's worth trading in your current property at the moment, but if you explore some areas with a view to moving, I think you could find the kind of place you're looking for.

It’s £150k household income and not one person. Equivalised income, taking into consideration children, could very well be middle.

For instance, £50k single person vs £50k couple with kids is very, very different.

Today I have been really stressed and worried because it is 9 degrees where I live and I simply cannot afford to put the hearing back on even though I can see my breath freezing in the front room. if I had £30k coming in a year I would consider myself well off, you have ten times that amount.

Yes employers are well known for ensuring their highest paid employees are also the laziest and least productive.

I think I understand OP. DH and I lived in London for over 10 years, working long hours and with a combined income of 250k and we always felt that it didn't matter how much money you had, it just never seemed to translate into quality of life. We worked really hard, to earn the salaries we did but it was never enough - housing expensive, no work life balance, horrible commute on the tube, pressure, stress, crime (wherever you in London), dirty streets, rubbish healthcare, paying so much tax. Before we bought our flat in London we paid 2k a month in rent to live in a small 2 bed flat in North London, supposedly a really nice area but lots of crime, drug addicts - one of them even defecated on our doorstep - it was absolutely vile. We contemplated moving elsewhere in the UK but a lack of job opportunities outside of London made that impossible. Luckily an opportunity came up for DH to move to Switzerland and we are still here years later. Earning the same money but paying alot less tax with a bigger disposable income and a better quality of life. Everything works - healthcare/infrastructure/public transport - brilliant place to live and raise kids, totally safe where we are, no crime, no litter and a brilliant work/life balance.
If it's not working out where you are then consider moving abroad, even if it's temporary although every expat we've met here comes for a couple of years, and stays forever.

You've had a lot of flack OP, but I do know what you mean. House prices are so ridiculous in London that you can be earning very very well, but still live in a very average house, paying through the nose for it so it takes up most of your disposable income. So in a word, no, I don't think it is "worth it". If you can earn decently elsewhere in the country, and do a job that's fulfilling, and you don't have all your friends and family in London, I think moving away from London is sensible idea. It's at least an idea that's worth exploring anyway.

OP you were obviously going to get slated for this.

The issue is the cost of housing - you would anticipate someone on £300k would live in a palace, but it’s a quite ordinary terraced house in much of London.

Why do people keep saying such ridiculous things on thos post like you'd expect someone on 300k to live in a Palace or that no one understands how tax works or how higher earning job roles are structured

It's nonsense.

🤣

So move to the commuter belt and get a better house but not the dream house. Do that when childcare is cheaper.

Depending how old your kids are consider getting an au pair. Consider your current childcare expenses and consider swapping to a nanny housekeeper.

Best post here!!!

Yes. Totally get where you are coming from. Income post tax doesn’t go very far in London at all.. this is why a lot of people relocate back overseas eventually .. US, Aus, asia… where you get a better quality of life for working the same amount or less.. at the end of the day it’s not the actually income number but how much you get with that income in terms of house, kids education, hobbies, safety etc..