Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Panicking / talc /asbestos found in beauty products. How do we know what's toxic? My blusher has talc. Avon /este lauder and clinique being talent to court

72 replies

Ithoughtsummerwascoming · 18/04/2023 08:46

Insomnia and of all the articles I could read I saw this one.

Hundreds possibly thousands of women are taking Avon and above to court over developing cancer directly from asbestos in talc. Face powders.
How do we know if our ones are toxic?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
raffegiraffe · 18/04/2023 12:40

I thought the court case was that the talc could have contained asbestos, not that it actually harmed anyone. I don't think that has been proven, just speculated for ovarian cancer. I wouldn't worry at all about face powder

KnittedCardi · 18/04/2023 12:43

J&J agreed terms, because in the US it's easier than a protracted lawsuit. As far as I know, no studies actually found a firm link between the talc use and ovarian cancer. On the other hand they also couldn't confirm there wasn't, hence the court settlement. This will be a similar legal case.

whatsyourpoison13 · 18/04/2023 13:01

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ as it was the work of a previously banned poster.

SquashPenguin · 18/04/2023 13:06

I work in the asbestos industry here in the UK. These issues are largely related to the USA. Asbestos in beauty products is astonishingly rare here. You should be far more concerned about the other ingredients than asbestos. You are surrounded by asbestos materials all the time but never give it a second thought, until a deliberately inflammatory article like this one comes along about something monumentally tiny.

ComtesseDeSpair · 18/04/2023 13:12

I work in insurance and we view talc as the next asbestosis and mesothelioma crisis and have been reserving heavily on our Disease portfolios for about a decade now in anticipation of the lawsuits settling. That’s not to say that the exposures will realise as heavily as we’ve reserved; insurance is by its very nature prudent. But I’m surprised there’s not more public awareness, this isn’t a new exposure.

PollyPeptide · 18/04/2023 13:16

Nimbostratus100 · 18/04/2023 11:56

that is not random, is it

Why is it less random than wearing makeup with spf?

Willyoujustbequiet · 18/04/2023 13:17

Nimbostratus100 · 18/04/2023 11:46

do what you like, but dont complain about the consequences! It is never ever going to be a better health outcome smearing yourself with random chemicals compare to NOT smearing yourself with random chemicals, is it?

Rubbish

Companies and manufacturers have a duty of care to sell products that aren't dangerous. There is any amount of legislation on this and why we have regulatory bodies to enforce.

PollyPeptide · 18/04/2023 13:18

You should be far more concerned about the other ingredients than asbestos.

Interesting. Do you know what they are?

Butitsnotfunnyisititsserious · 18/04/2023 13:21

Companies and manufacturers have a duty of care to sell products that aren't dangerous. There is any amount of legislation on this and why we have regulatory bodies to enforce.

Exactly.

Somethingsnappy · 18/04/2023 13:22

Nimbostratus100 · 18/04/2023 11:46

do what you like, but dont complain about the consequences! It is never ever going to be a better health outcome smearing yourself with random chemicals compare to NOT smearing yourself with random chemicals, is it?

Do you sit down on upholstered chairs and sofas? Do you walk across carpets? Do you ever eat processed food, or food that is not organic? Ever eat out of anything that has been contained in plastic? Do you use swimming pools? Do you run a car? Have you ever decorated your home? Shall I go on?

Somethingsnappy · 18/04/2023 13:35

To answer your question, op, I don't know that it will be made known which products exactly are unsafe. I only read a couple of articles quite quickly, but my impression was that sometimes asbestos finds its way into products that contain talc, and that it may be quite random, due to collection of the raw material and manufacturing processes. So in any products tested, a few may contain it, but most may not. Not that there are specific products that they'll be able to pinpoint or identify. I may have got that completely wrong though, so will be happy to be corrected!

Naunet · 18/04/2023 13:50

headmaiden · 18/04/2023 09:55

@Nimbostratus100 completely agree.

How can anyone be shocked that putting unnecessary chemicals on your face might be a bad idea? Companies only want to make money from your vanity/ stupidity.

Yeah it’s all stupid women’s fault for being groomed into thinking they need to wear make up, so it’s their own fault if there’s asbestos in them and they end up with cancer…🙄
Don’t be an idiot. The huge pharma company selling products with asbestos in is the one at fault here, not women who buy them. Do you want to blame mothers for using J&J talc on their baby too?

Willyoujustbequiet · 18/04/2023 14:04

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ as it was the work of a previously banned poster.

I presume because like smoking the damage may already have been done.

Mesothelioma mentioned in the legal action can take years to develop.

NowZeusHasLainWithLeda · 18/04/2023 14:15

Nimbostratus100 · 18/04/2023 09:49

Simple solution, dont use beauty products at all, they are all based on smearing chemicals across your skin, none of them are ever going to do you any good, are they. And there is no reason to use them, it is just a form of oppression that women impose on themselves and other women. If everyone stopped using them, it would no longer be seen as the "norm" to plaster yourself with chemicals to conform

Water is a chemical. Blueberries have upwards of 15 chemicals in each one.
Stop spouting utter bollocks.

Treaclemine · 18/04/2023 14:21

Talc is a mineral which forms flat sheets like mica or graphite but on a smaller scale. Asbestos forms fibres, which do damage to cells. The edges of sheet minerals can similarly do damage but much much more rarely. Talc is the softest mineral, so isn't as risky as asbestos, though that can adulterate talc.
I haven't used talc anywhere there's an aperture since I heard it had been found in the vicinity of ovaries.

gogohmm · 18/04/2023 14:41

Talc is mined so whether it has traced of asbestos relates where it was mined - the evidence I've seen suggests it was a us problem, our supplies weren't contaminated but obviously some products are imported. Unless you are a very big user I would be more concerned about other potentially cancer causing things in the environment

BeethovenNinth · 18/04/2023 14:49

I have tried to avoid talc for years and use Benecos and some other brands.

I think many large brands have used talc eg Benefit blushers I noticed used to, but they have removed it now. Oh and they are made in the US

i think it’s hard to know if the talc is contaminated. I’m trying not to think about it. If you can imagine lathering on these face powders then millions of us will be exposed

no wonder we lose trust in large corporations

BeethovenNinth · 18/04/2023 14:50

Also people still use talc in swimming hats and it flies about everywhere. Madness

EmotionalSupportWyrm · 18/04/2023 14:58

ComtesseDeSpair · 18/04/2023 13:12

I work in insurance and we view talc as the next asbestosis and mesothelioma crisis and have been reserving heavily on our Disease portfolios for about a decade now in anticipation of the lawsuits settling. That’s not to say that the exposures will realise as heavily as we’ve reserved; insurance is by its very nature prudent. But I’m surprised there’s not more public awareness, this isn’t a new exposure.

It really isn't a new exposure - I stopped using talc on my DC many years ago over concerns raised then. I haven't bought any since. My Dc are all around 30.

This article from 2013 says the debate has been going on for over a decade....
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/should-i-stop-using-talcum-powder

Should I stop using talcum powder?

A study has found an increased risk of between 20% and 30% for ovarian cancer in women who used talc for what some call 'intimate personal hygiene'

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/should-i-stop-using-talcum-powder

Willyoujustbequiet · 18/04/2023 15:04

Treaclemine · 18/04/2023 14:21

Talc is a mineral which forms flat sheets like mica or graphite but on a smaller scale. Asbestos forms fibres, which do damage to cells. The edges of sheet minerals can similarly do damage but much much more rarely. Talc is the softest mineral, so isn't as risky as asbestos, though that can adulterate talc.
I haven't used talc anywhere there's an aperture since I heard it had been found in the vicinity of ovaries.

I think a lot of people have avoided talc for the same reason as you but there will be millions of women who had no idea it could be in make up.

It doesn't bear thinking about if true.

Willyoujustbequiet · 18/04/2023 15:09

EmotionalSupportWyrm · 18/04/2023 14:58

It really isn't a new exposure - I stopped using talc on my DC many years ago over concerns raised then. I haven't bought any since. My Dc are all around 30.

This article from 2013 says the debate has been going on for over a decade....
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/should-i-stop-using-talcum-powder

If that is the case and the big cosmetic companies knew it was carcinogenic/potentially but put it in their make up anyway then that is just like tobacco companies that suppressed the evidence regarding smoking and lung cancer.

Mummynew08 · 18/04/2023 15:30

I agree with @Nimbostratus100 that make up is really unnecessary in the first place.

But also, people are being unreasonable to buy Avon in the first place, it's a pyramid scheme isn't it

Nounoufgs · 18/04/2023 15:35

This is terrible! I am thanking my lucky stars I’ve never worn these products. The question I have is- how did nobody know until now?

Was this covered up?

ComtesseDeSpair · 18/04/2023 15:53

Nounoufgs · 18/04/2023 15:35

This is terrible! I am thanking my lucky stars I’ve never worn these products. The question I have is- how did nobody know until now?

Was this covered up?

Companies have been selling harmful products for centuries and continue to do so. The only difference now is that where there is sufficient evidence they are supposed to warn consumers of known or suspected harms - see e.g. tobacco and nicotine products, alcohol, asbestos, energy drinks, fire retardants, carcinogens, some artificial colours as just a few.

However, large industries and companies have enormous, bullish litigation departments and lobby groups which exist to make sure that their sales interests aren’t damaged, as do their insurers to ensure they don’t have to acknowledge a harm and pay out. I work in insurance: I know how hard industry works to defend the indefensible to protect financial interests.

In general, companies know about the emerging risks and harms of their products long before unequivocal evidence forces them to acknowledge it and either post warnings to consumers or remove a product from sale.

That consumers buy products which later turn out to be harmful isn’t because consumers are vain or stupid or unintelligent. It’s because consumers don’t stand a chance against these companies. In the example of non-industrial talc exposure, parents were encouraged for decades to use J&J talc as part of their baby’s essential routine for skin health and protection. There were even huge deals done with the healthcare industry in the US to promote it. That this has turned out to have been probably not such a good idea after all doesn’t speak to the stupidity of those parents but more to the trust that people had decades ago (and indeed it seems still today - several people on this thread have stated the belief that companies aren’t allowed to knowingly sell harmful products, easily disproved) for what large companies told them, and in advertising as truth.

Nimbostratus100 · 18/04/2023 17:41

Endlesssummer2022 · 18/04/2023 11:58

Do you wear sunscreen?

again, that is not random