To think it’s shocking how bad Britain has fallen apart compared to other European counties

[TheColourofspring]

I am in Spain at the moment in one of the big cities. It’s clean, modern, well maintained. Transport is cheap, food is cheap, healthcare seems to work pretty well (from talking to local). Parks are noticeably well maintained- even saw park keepers! Clean & tidy.

Pensions higher, if you lose your job you get a portion of your salary in unemployment benefits while you look for another and there are no penalties. Based on the premise that if you have paid in, you will get looked after if you are in need.

I am not saying it’s perfect- no country is but it was the same when I was in France last summer.

In Britain, everything is underfunded and close to the edge. Schools, the NHS, local authorities are all at breaking point. My local parks look shabby & there is very little maintenance. Roads have pot holes. Yesterday I read an article about pharmacies being the latest at ‘crisis’ point with major drug shortages (thanks to brexit). Queues at borders, people can’t heat or eat properly, food banks, housing is ridiculous for many people.

I think it’s just so noticeable when you go to other places just how run down Britain is.

Finding it shocking and a bit depressing - like I said, all countries have their issues but I think Britain really has been pillaged by the tories & Brexit really is a disaster.

Inequality is increasingly being fuelled by the private school/state school divide.

Last year private school fees went up around 7%, whereas state schools needed to fund the teachers’ pay rises from income that was already stretched to breaking point. This disparity has been growing for years. We are now at a point where private school fees are around 5x pupil allowance at a state school.

This disparity is leading to meaningful differences in teacher pay, especially in Maths and Physics (and Computer Studies).

This means that private schools can attract well qualified STEM teachers and state schools cannot.

And, in addition, private schools are increasingly becoming a network into very high paying professions, especially finance and things like management consulting.

No other country has a similar dual track system and starves the state sector of funds to the extent we do.

An elbow injury. I simply don’t have the energy to explain how an elbow injury is low on the list of violent crime injuries. Any injury is awful and I wish your friend a speedy recovery but the UK is one of the safest countries in the world and that is just a fact.

The government do like to protect the grey vote, is that ageism to state that? Why didn't they keep the nhs levy tax or why wasn't the care cap a % rather than £

You are not wrong OP. Yes, lots of the issues are minor, but they all add up to a big negative.

This is a small thing, but I hate going food shopping now, it really depresses me. Half the produce looks as though it has been hanging around for ages, is displayed with no thought or care and everyone seems gloomy and fed up. I live in a fairly affluent area.

I keep thinking about supermarkets in France where the produce looks so fresh and well displayed. As expensive as the UK, maybe more so, but at least you get quality for your money. Yes maybe rose tinted specs, but🤷‍♀️

Every solution to a problem in the UK is met with a big no by people.

Cut benefits - No!
Reform NHS - No!
Cut unskilled immigration - No!
Longer prison sentences - No!
Social care reform - No!
Etc, etc.

What do you expect to happen? The populous gets what it deserves.

Why not see a GP privately, like you would in Europe?

@Hardbackwriter

But this is exactly what I mean about the exceptionalism expectations of where we 'should' be. Our historic 'seat at the table' was a legacy of colonialism (and basically sheer luck in sharing a language with the biggest superpower). Absolutely we therefore should have clung onto the benefits the EU brought - I voted remain, and was devastated by the result - but it was inevitable and probably correct that we had to become less globally influential as a nation.

I agree that a lot of our historic "seat at the table" was a legacy of colonialism. Colonialism (and exploitation of people) is responsible for a lot of Britain's historical wealth and plays a major part in our deluded, jingoistic perception of ourselves as a world power.

But I don't think that's the whole story. For various periods after WW2 Britain has had a strong economy and a strong social contract: much of it built by the postwar Labour governments and their belief in investing to lift people out of poverty.

There are other less appealing aspects to British economic strength, such as the financial services boom and the huge strength of the City (now apparently in terminal decline). This is obviously a very mixed blessing and Brexit has probably done for that forever. But my point is that Britain had been capable of being a strong, social democratic capitalist country on its own merits. Some of that was to do with strong links with, variously, the US and the EU (both of which recent governments have fucked up). But it was also to do with having pragmatic, accountable and grown-up government, strong public services and a business-friendly environment.

Britain is certainly a fallen world power and will never have another empire (certainly not in this century). Nor should it. But I don't think it follows that it has to shrug and accept that it is simply managing decline.

In london at least the problem with school places is an over supply coming not an under supply. So school places will be easier to come by not harder.
spent day wandering around central london yesterday. It was a hive of activity and looking beautiful.

Sick and tired of reading about litter. Go out litter picking if it bothers you. Plenty of people regularly do this, myself included. The government isn’t responsible for the litter on the streets. It’s dropped by individuals who don’t care about their environment, and think that OTHER PEOPLE should pick it up.

Maybe residents of other countries are more respectful and community minded.

@begoneday how safe do you think the UK is?

It’s really shocking. My friends who have other options have all been moving out of the uk in droves the last few years, leaving gaping holes in their industries.

London (where I live) used to be the best city in the world. Now everyone just wants out. Including me. But I’m British and a little stuck.

Well done Tories. You took a fantastic county and a brilliant city and made them worse. For what?! Power? I can’t get my head around why they wanted brexit. It’s been a disaster to manage - they obviously knew it would be a farce - why did they want it?

I agree. I think we've all gotten used to the rubbish we put up with so we don't even realise how bad it is anymore. I'm in Norway currently where I have family. Here the average wage is approx 70k. They are currently discussing giving tax breaks to everyone under that as they think under that is too little to give on decently. Granted things are more expensive here, but that's literally double the average UK wage. And it's coupled with really excellent state services, brilliant schools, great infastructure. And before anyone mentions taxes, Norwegian taxes are at similar rates to the UK - they did do loads better with their oil and invested from it rather than sell it all off like the UK did. Apparently the news here shows clips of poor grannies in the UK sitting freezing in their homes and showing the reporter their empty fridges. Great reputation for "Great" Britain.

Norway of course isn't in the EU, but are very veyr closely connected to it, and are in the EEA so enjoy most of the benefits from it.

I’m starting to think this kind of narrative is going to backfire on the left / Labour

If they can’t find a positive for the U.K. they’ll just promote doom

I’m not saying for sure either way but the GE is a fair bit off in any case

How will cutting benefits make things better? Even less money in people's pockets means even less money going into the economy.

One of the reasons the NHS is so fucked up is because of Tory "reforms" which have then been "reformed" again.

How will longer prison sentences make things better- it costs big money to keep people locked up. Better to rehabilitate people and get them into work. It can and does happen with the right resources.

We need immigration to fill the job vacancies Sunak thinks the early retired 50+ cohort should be filling.

Reform social care how? We need more of it not less, I don't see anyone shouting No! against that.

Very true - the NHS is failing/has failed but nothing will be done about it because people don't want a better system.

The Norway pension oil fund was/is an excellent idea.

But if you were someone from overseas who visited Padstow on holiday you would think 'isn't this a great place - look at the houses and places to eat and facilities' in much the same way you are doing in Spain? You don't get involved in local politics and issues when you visit a place, surely? I've recently been to Paris and thought it was quite run down, graffiti, rude people, rubbish on the streets, strikes - but I remember the bakeries, the river, the shops - and the French are struggling! I've also recently been to two major American cities - homelessness, rubbish, empty buildings but I came away thinking wow because it was new and I was on holiday.

Nowhere is eutopia and to visit somewhere on holiday is ENTIRELY different to immersing yourself in local culture, politics, daily life.

So that's a big "No!" then?

France - for context/completeness:

"Constant strikes" - Once a week ATM, max, and not universal, not across all industries...

"Current rioting" - not a feature of daily life for the vast majority of the population...wouldn't be surprised to seem some local scuffles (mostly down to the idiots in the Black Block etc) as a result of today's possible legal ruling.

Locally bins emptied on schedule with no problems, even on national strike days.

Overall it's been possible to travel/commute/work in many big towns/cities most days without running into any major problems at all..

But I know some like to paint a picture of something close to impending civil war................I can't imagine why they would do that.....................

What other countries have a NHS similar to UK? I can't think of any ........

New Zealand does

I spent most of my 90 days in mainland Europe from January and everywhere is seeing the effects of the cost of living crisis, even wealthier countries such as Germany, Austria and the Netherlands. However almost everywhere was better organised and supporting their citizens better. The only country that seemed in a worse state than the UK was Hungary. But even their produce looked better than in UK supermarkets!

Hungarians I spoke with, who politically I expected might be a little more sympathetic to Brexit, see Brexit as an ‘extraordinary act of self harm.’

The next phase for the UK is rapidly escalating social problems, especially around addictions and crime. The police have lost control already in some areas.

The solution is to suport the strikers, protest on the streets, write to your MP and oust the tories at the first opportunity.

Exactly and there is a good reason for this. We should be looming to Europe for good models on how to run healthcare but any mention of reform gets (mainly) the Left squealing about the American system and privatisation so nothing gets done.

I think it is time for your pill, chill out.

Until someone can explain how doing all of what that poster suggested will improve things then yes, it is a no! Otherwise is is just empty, distracting rhetoric-a favoured Tory pastime.