Child's piano lesson

[Wellthatsthatthenisntit]

My DCs both do piano lessons. Age 6 and 9. Recently DC9 has begun complaining about going. It is half an hour a week (lesson) and they do two practices of about 10 mins during the week. Been going 18 months.

My view is that this is non-negotiable. It will help with their development, and future choices in life, and both doing very well with it. I gave up a musical instrument when young, which I regret, and parents never pushed me. I realise I am projecting.

For the record I am not pushy in any other way and they happily do swimming, a team sport (winter and summer) and other activities of their choosing. I don't make them do extra schoolwork or anything like that.

Family member thinks I am being horrible. AIBU?

@Wellthatsthatthenisntit I teach music to children as one of my two jobs. I agree there are massive benefits to learning an instrument and unless there are other factors at play, I'd say it's a good thing to commit to as a family. A few things jump out at me:

1. Work with your dc teacher. See if they can help you and them devise a practice plan that includes enough of what your children enjoy about the instrument. Do they really love certain songs or practice games? Use those as the beginning and end of practices.
2. FInd music they like listening to. Some of my students love The Piano Guys and their antics. It makes it fun and lets them see what can happen as they learn more and more skills. Also ensure they are listening to the music they are learning. Building that confidence by using and developing their ear, has massive benefits.
3. I think what is hard about piano is that it is a more isolated instrument. Strings for example often include group lessons. To help the social aspect, could they teach you what they are learning? Have concerts at home or over zoom for family? Where they dress up, make tickets etc etc etc. Do their friends play instruments and you could do a concert together? To love something kids often need it to be playful!
4. I don't think the practicing is enough. It's a funny one, parents often think less means that their children won't resent it. My finding is that it can send a message of 'I will only make you do this twice a week' which isn't exactly the undertone you want. Take the broadest scope with practicing - listening, games, playing, make that all part of learning. ' Run and play C, D, A, C, D' how fast can you do it? Lets pick a number out of a jar and see how many times we are going to practice that tricky bar, I bet you'll master it by the end. (This is important as it allows them to see how their 'work' allowed them to master something hard and then makes their overall piece sound better which helps encourage them too. It isn't just endlessly playing there's a skill to practice.) Another thing to make it fun is hiding the songs they need to practice around the house and they go on a scavenger hunt to find them. Or sit at the piano and play the song they are learning terribly, usually that gets laughter followed by "no, Mummy, this is how you play it". At this age the more positive associations they can make with music, the more likelihood they will enjoy it while they aren't yet at that stage where mastering a song brings that enjoyment at the same level it does for older children.
5. Use this as a teachable moment that things will be hard and we don't just give up. Learning to walk/read/do multiplications is hard. What would happen if we gave up each time? Let them know that your family will evaluate each summer what activities are for the year and everyone will get to share their feelings, thoughts and reasons.
6. Be realistic about whether the teacher is a good fit. There's a large school near me where there's no real personal attention, teachers musicians and music post grad students who are only teaching b/c they can't earn enough as musicians without it. I've had many students from that school there are some things I notice - there's no real joy after a few months, turnover is high, some of the teachers are teaching without the real skills that are needed to work with children in a way that brings reward for them. Kids need teachers who want to make this a good experience for them, not just teach them music. I have kids each year who stretch me, who make me seek out podcasts and books about how to be what they need in a teacher. Many of my students are neurodiverse, most arrive because this is their parents last attempt at making music work. I also charge a fraction of what the larger school does.
7. Make music a part of your family life - music concerts - if you live near a University many have very reasonable ones featuring their music department, various styles playing at home (fiddle, cello, bands, show tunes etc etc etc). Have other instruments around the home. Nothing pushy but increase that enjoyment.
8. Find the best time to practice - for some it's in the morning, for others it's after snack right after school, other's still it's later. Your 6 and 9 year old may need different times of the day. Use the weekend for

I don't believe there is a set amount or 'perfect' practice time. I have some students who mark one day a week as a non-practice day, others who mostly practice daily unless something crops up and others who are realistic that it will only be 4/5 days/week. I'd say trying to ensure they practice at least 4/5 days/week - again taking that widest scope of what practice is. If on a weekday it includes listening to the pieces they are learning (as I mentioned that's really important imho - build that ear skill!), practicing a tricky bar 5 x and practicing 1-2 review songs twice each, playing their current piece a few times (or parts of it that need working on), with mostly a smile on their faces, then that's success for that day. None of that should take longer than 15-20 minutes for your 9 year old. For your 6 year old they should be able to do most of that, perhaps 1 review piece, but their pieces are usually shorter.

It's a great thing you are doing @Wellthatsthatthenisntit and I really hope it works out for you and your dc! Happy playing!

Apologies a sentence seems to have disappeared. I was trying to say sometimes weekends are the best fit for the things that require the most concentration. I have a couple students who only do bowing exercises at the weekends b/c they find to do them well they need their best concentration, otherwise they rush them b/c they are tired. In their home they do music practice Sat/Sun mid-morning and tackle harder things than they do during the week with the school rush.

One last thing - try and remember you are all learning. You are learning how to be the parent of 9 and 6 year old music students, they are learning the dedication it requires to be music students. It will be trial and error, things that worked will stop working and vice versa, but with creativity and a good teacher, you will get there! Best wishes.

Correct.

This is a waste of time and money, in my opinion (my partner is a pianist and trained music teacher).

I gave up piano lessons at 11, never gave me fewer chances in life or affected my development!!!!

I had piano lessons as a child, got to grade 6 and then gave up. Really wish I'd had the chance to choose my own orchestral/band instrument instead, so much more sociable and so many more opportunities than piano. I encouraged my DC to all play at least one instrument of their choice, they persisted throughout school years with levels of enthusiasm waxing and waning and some changing of instruments. Between them they cover piano, saxophone, trumpet, cello and guitar ranging from grades 4 to 8. At the moment none of them (in 20s) are really playing, but the instruments at least get a yearly airing for family Christmas carols/songs, which I absolutely love! And they all have a skill they could resume when older if they wish.

It's definitely unreasonable to force them. Do they prefer a different instrument? Maybe an orchestral one which comes with more social possibilities?

I'm with all the others who've said practise should be daily too. My 7yo started piano in September, she does 15mins daily plus some theory now and her teacher is thrilled with her progress as is the DC!

Agree op definitely strongly encourage as long as possible, pushing within reason.

It’s well documented that not learning/ giving up a musical instrument is one of the most common regrets of adults. Surprisingly universal actually.

Encourage them to improvise and make up their own music as well.

If they wish to become accomplished musicians ( which they clearly don't!) they need to do more than 10 mins practice a week. Don't force them to go. Someone gave my dad an old piano and my parents decided I should start piano lessons.
The piano teacher was horrible and I used to dread going, my parents were sooo proud and told everyone what a great pianist I was, and made me play for guests, like a performing monkey. I wondered whether my parents were deaf because I was a terrible pianist.
Every week I was told by my parents how expensive the lessons were and how lucky I was to have them.so I just sucked it up and endured years of misery with a horrible nasty female teacher

😂

They definitely won't thank you. Can't remember the last time my clarinet got me a pay rise at work / bought my shopping / parented my child.

Seriously some of these responses 😂

ODFOD I know you probably get your kicks out of snarky comments on AIBU and love it when OPs get a kicking but most of the comments that are insightful are from actual musicians or parents of musicians. If you’d bothered to read the bulk of them are telling me I’m unreasonable for not practising enough.

I’m a music teacher, and when a child is practicing that little it’s either because they hate it and won’t or because the parent isn’t taking responsibility to make sure it happens. Honestly, when a student comes in routinely with obviously barely any practice done, I’d rather their parents let them quit as it’s difficult for them to progress and I feel a little guilty for taking the money! Either let them quit or help them to learn so they can enjoy it. The fumbly stage is nobody’s favorite; they tend to have much more fun when they’re confident and making steady progress.
fwiw, my 8yo practices 30-45m a day (broken into different time slots) five days a week, but I don’t make him take lessons, they were his choice and we discussed the time commitment before beginning and he’s been happily at it for two years.

But there’s every possibility your children won’t be musicians.

Would you think it healthy if a dad who wished he had been a professional footballer was taking advice from elite sports coaches about how to increase the training schedule for his kids, who didn’t like playing football?

Did your children choose to play the piano or did you decide for them? With DD, learning a musical instrument was non negotiable but which one she played was up to her.

I wanted her to play the piano as everyone in my family can play the piano but she hated it and wanted to play a woodwind instrument instead so she chose the flute. If I'd have made her keep playing the piano then she would never have progressed and probably have given up altogether as she didn't hate music, she just hated the piano. Instead, I let her play the flute and she has been playing for 8 years now and still loves it. It also helped that when she complained about the flute (usually because she didn't want to practice) I reminded her that she chose the instrument and she could stop playing it at any time, she just had to tell me which other instrument she wanted to play instead.

DD was born in Spain and she went to school there from the age of 1 until she was 9. I worked at a private school that had a guardería (nursery) for children up to age 3, Infantil (Kindergarten) for children 3-6 and then compulsory school (Primary/Secondary/6th form) from the age of 6-18.

In the guardería and infantil they just introduce instruments and music through play -singing songs and letting the babies bash a xylophone or tambourine to their hearts content, having the toddlers shake a maraca and tap a triangle to the beat of a song etc - to let the children get used to instruments and music.

Once they start Primary they have more structured compulsory music lessons at least once a week and DDs school had every child playing a melodica as it is the perfect instrument for small children to learn the basics on - it's a cheap instrument, they start with a long pipe to blow into so they can put the instrument on the table and look at the keys as they play, and get used to it and as they get more proficient then they can shorten the tube to just a mouthpiece and they play it like a recorder.

Also extra curricular music lessons at the music school in our neighborhood were cheap as it was run by the Ministry of Education so everything was subsidised (I think I paid about €15 a month for DDs weekly class) so when DD started school music lessons I asked her what instrument she wanted to play and signed her up to flute lessons.

I play the piano so does my daughter. I love, love, love playing it. If your children don't have a passion for it there's no point sadly.

My mum forced me to do music lessons....l used to cry walking home from school. Taught me absolutely nothing - just that my parents didn't listen to me. Was 40 years ago and l still resent them.

Listen to your child op.

How will it enhance life a choices of they want to do something else you won't let them try..
I would make a deal. Get to grade blah and if you hate it drop it.
. There are so many lessons out there for dc to try.

@MasterBeth So you are now saying I am wrong for listening to the advice that I am in fact unreasonable?

Or are you just upset that I am not crying in the corner after being brutalised on AIBU? Sometimes it can just be a healthy and robust discussion. Wacky I know.

Not exactly sure what you were expecting on this forum. Most MNs have a problem with bullying, that's why they're so good at it. Thank your kids for giving it a go and ask them what they're really interested in. If you force a child to do something they don't want to you will kill any potential love of it. I hated my forced piano lessons, I was too young and clearly not the Mozart prodigy expected. It took me decades to return to something I would have loved if I wasn't forced to.

Neither.

I am suggesting that if you only consider the advice of professional committed adult musicians, you are indulging in a kind of success bias. You cannot reverse engineer their experience and assume that repeating their behaviours will give your children the same outcome.

Your children don't enjoy playing the piano. I am suggesting making them play the piano more may not have the outcome you intend.

One of my DC enjoys music residentials so he plays music with other young musicians on those. Again, it's the social elements of playing an instrument which he enjoys and makes him want to continue playing his woodwind instrument.

Would never force my child to play an instrument she has no interest in. They're unlikely to go far in it if they don't even want to play twice a week. Plenty of us can't play the piano and are still alive to tell the tale. I've no words.

My interest in playing the piano (I had lessons for over a decade) faded when I started practicing for half an hour before my lesson. Sounds like DC9 needs to do more practice so they can feel like they're achieving something, rather than it just being a drag.

I saw a poster talk about the Simply Piano app, give that a go and see if you can get your DC back into it.

**only practicing, I meant to say. The rest of the week I just used my piano as a shelf.

I regret it now! I was quite good until I stopped caring.

They need a goal.
My DCs piano school has a concert at the end of each term. Each child learns a short, fun piece to play in public. That definitely motivates practice.

Also, although I never learned piano past preliminary level and they are now on grade 3 and better than me, I sit with them every few days and help them to learn a new bar. They like having someone with them, and then I sit with them again a couple of days later and I expect the bar to be learned.

Neither of them will be musicians, sadly (I would have loved their opportunity but I have to recognise that they are not me). However they do enjoy the challenge of pleasing me and of playing in the concerts and passing the exams. I’ve offered them the chance to stop after grade 3 but they’ve both said they’ll continue.