Euthanasie, dont legalise in UK.

[MrsMarkieParkie]

I just read that 8% of deaths in Canada last year happened via euthanasia. This doesnt sit right with me. Also, as described in the article, the protocol seems mostly the same as the US death by lethal injection.
Do we want this in the UK?

What nonsense. Can you not see how simplistic this is? Some people are vulnerable and are specifically vulnerable to abusers telling them that they would be better off dead.

Can you not appreciate that at all?

we must be allowed the choice, with the proper safeguards in place

This seems to be the view of most of us, but again, who's going to decide on those safeguards, and more to the point what will happen if they're not followed - especially if it's for a supposedly "good" reason like ensuring more resources for those with longer to live?

I'm well aware that this already exists up to a point with the use of QALYs, but there's a signifIcant difference in that, no matter how nicely it's put, the proposal is about actually killing people

No doubt we'd hear the usual "lessons will be learned" if and when it went very wrong, but we certainly wouldn't be learning them from the departed on account of them no longer having a voice

It would be a higher percentage of those who are 'sick and dying' as total deaths include sudden deaths and those preceded by short illnesses where the person hopes to recover.

@MyopicBunny
This could be safeguarded. Interested to know if you are religious?

No, I'm not religious.

How can it be safeguarded?

There are many women who are forced into abortions they don't want by their partners.

There doesn't seem to be adequate safeguarding to stop that.

Well, I certainly do want legal euthanasia in the UK. I think it is perfectly reasonable for me to choose the time and place of my own death, and I don't think that the state should have the right to prevent that.

@MyopicBunny off topic but there are, according to the most recent data available, slightly more women who are coerced into keeping an unwanted pregnancy than women who are coerced into an unwanted abortion. No safeguarding against that either.

But it's a false equivalence either way.

Unless you have a life shortening, degenerative illness, as I have, it's really not something you need to be involved it.

You have to be it to see it - and I want free choice.

No it's not. I am making the point that people can be coerced to do things they don't want, especially if vulnerable. And nobody can safeguard it.

This applies to people being forced to keep a pregnancy, too - so you've illustrated my point.

There is absolutely no way to safeguard anything absolutely.

I'm still waiting to hear how it would be 'safeguarded'

I'm also slightly offended by the notion that if you don't believe legalising euthanasia is a good thing, you must be a religious nut

@MyopicBunny you safeguard it in the same way that those countries which have legalised it the right way have done. Look at the Dutch and Belgian models, not the Canadian one. Unless you think that hordes of vulnerable people are being bumped off wholesale over there and it's a total free for all?

@MyopicBunny in the US states where it is legal, the individual has to have a terminal diagnosis with a prognosis of less than six months. Due to the general difficulty in predicting how close to death a person is unless it is quite close, in reality most of those people will be weeks or days away from dying. For me, that's a reasonable safeguard for most cases but there are also other criteria. I'm presuming you are not anti-abortion just in case there is coercion?

Unless you think that hordes of vulnerable people are being bumped off wholesale over there and it's a total free for all?

With this government in power? Anything's possible...

@DameKatyDenisesClagnuts will you stop trying to force me to admit I'm a religious nut? It's tiresome and lazy. Of course I support rights to abortion - I'm not some crazy, right wing loon.

Death is irreversible though isn't it.

Op have you had a family member in severe pain who will die in the worse pain ever and nothing can help in the next few days. My proud and beautiful gran brain tumor made her last days alive hell. Yabu. Under strick control this is needed in the UK. Urgently. Vvvv Strick control. Doctors (not just one, a team including nurses) and family working together to make terminal I'll patients last few days bearable.

If someone is already dying is a greedy relative really going to push for it to happen even more quickly? The medical staff wouldn't allow it. Yes there are risks I propose it becomes a part of advanced care planning while the patient has capacity . A doctor isn't allowed to mention it until the patient asks on separate occasions , it should then be independently validated. Medical staff should not be allowed to mention it as an option it should be all patient led.

I've watched many people die and unfortunately I haven't seen that many good deaths. The best seem to be sudden very quick. I'm not scared of dying I'm scared of being unable to tell people I'm in pain and it being very drawn out.

The country I live in it is legal. And I support it.

I would have loved that option for my dad instead of drawing out his suffering

I've watched many people die and unfortunately I haven't seen that many good deaths. The best seem to be sudden very quick. I'm not scared of dying I'm scared of being unable to tell people I'm in pain and it being very drawn out.

I admit that having not been in your place, I haven't seen the impact of these situations. And I'm sure you're right.

Don't people in final stages of life get offered morphine etc to make them comfortable? That was the case with my grandmother who died and I'm fairly sure she was not in pain but this was a long time ago.

@MyopicBunny many people think that it is possible to keep everyone pain free and comfortable in EOL situations. It isn't. Sometimes the painkillers are not enough, and that happens more often than you'd think. Add to that the fact that many people also really struggle with the complete loss of dignity and you end up with a situation where the suffering is prolonged and unbearable. That was where my grandmother was at - the dose of medication she needed to take away the pain was a lethal dose. Fortunately she was legally allowed to have it.

This is very helpful. Thank you.

I don't want it here. I don't think it's likely to be safeguarded properly.

@Jonei I do have severe reservations about introducing it under the current administration, yes.

Erm no it isn't drugs wear off some drugs don't react well in some people. It's obviously hard for some patients to verbalise their pain we do use assessment tools but I'm sure it doesn't catch all. We also are only allowed to give so much controlled drugs as after shipman there's a lot more hesitancy around prescribing large dosages. If someone has a high tolerance it can be a very large doses and it may hasten death. Some relatives also complain the patient is sedated and not talking. I think a lot of education needs to be given people about dying we shy away from it then people are shocked that it can be a horrible process.

@oakleaffy.
Someone is either terminally ill with no chance of recovery or not.or very elderly and I'll.

Forcing people to live on every single moment in pure agony is dispicable and a stain on humanity.

I agree with the right to death but it would have to be a very solid policy. Signed by the person and NoK while the person was aware enough decide.

We had to make a very similar decision when my mum was end of life. Choose more invasive treatment or let her sleep comfortably with morphine to take away the distress of struggling to breathe (end stage COPD). Knowing she had chosen a DNR when she was in hospital the year before and made it clear to all of us that was what she wanted made it easier for us to decide on the morphine and no more treatment (which would have only prolonged not cured). It was a hard decision for us but we knew she was struggling and ready to go when it reached that point.

I think people reach a point in prolonged illness especially where they know the fight is over and its just a waiting game to the end. Those are the people euthanasia would most benefit.