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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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What stops you voting Labour? #2

105 replies

SleepingRedSnowBootsAndThePea · 10/03/2023 19:41

Just tried to post on that thread but it had run to 1k responses already, so here is a continuation one and my answer to the OP's question.

Rachel Reeves in her recent Mumsnet interview made it clear that she's not interested in dealing with the anomalies and unfairnesses in the tax system. One example given and that she was asked about in that interview was the way single parent households/ single income households lose child benefit at half of the household income. But there are many, many more such issues creating disincentives to work across the economy.

The role of Chancellor, if the country is to improve in terms of services or living standards, is more important than that of Prime Minister. And I found her response on this critical issue very poor.

Her day one job in role should be to address the things that she can fix immediately, that ARE within her power to sort out with immediate effect. Most economic reforms will take far longer to bear fruit but the tax system, as Chancellor, she would be able to sort out, if she had the will. Yet she made it clear that she has no intention to do so.

Bizarrely for someone who I had high hopes for as a potential Chancellor - as someone who for a change does actually understand economics - she appeared to be unwilling to accept or engage with, let alone address, the massively damaging effect our tax system has on families but also on productivity, at all levels of earnings. And particularly on single mothers and childhood poverty, given that most one parent households (over 90%) are headed by women, and much of child poverty is in those households. And yet she's quite happy for them to be taxed more than other households with the same income, and have child benefit withdrawn at half the income, etc.

So, despite her protestations about wanting to address productivity - which is the only way our economy can grow so that living standards rise and public services can be funded properly - I don't believe she's serious about doing it. Even if there are big infrastructure products and jobs in green energy etc as Labour claim there would be, if the tax system isn't fixed, it won't fix the problem.

The tax system needs fixing at every level of earnings:

amp.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/13/full-time-part-time-work-no-longer-pays-uk-economy

I am hugely disappointed in her response to even the partial question on this that Mumsnet asked her in that interview in relation to child benefit. And they didn't even bother to ask her about the wider question about how she should obviously remove the disincentives at every level of the tax system: double the tax-free allowance for single people, double all the tax/ benefit thresholds for them, get rid of the absurd tax rate of 60%+ at £100k. Remove the bottlenecks that stop, at various earning thresholds, it being worthwhile for many households of any composition to work more or seek promotions etc.

The way she responded shows me she's not willing to make rational, evidence based, fair policy and is instead - depressingly - yet another politician who will pander to optics instead of doing what works and what needs to be done, for everyone.

So I can't vote for them unless their policies on this change.

OP posts:
EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 16:55

A friend who knew RR when she was at the BoE reckoned that she was exceptionally good so I have my fingers crossed that she is being fed a digest of the intelligent MN debate and is quietly mulling over plans for her first appearances at the despatch box. And formulating economic/fiscal policy for the manifesto but I am not expecting Labour to unveil policy commitments until a GE is imminent. They would be daft to do so. But I am quietly optimistic. As a swing voter, it is a major element in deciding which way I swing.

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 16:57

I liked our local Labour candidate last time around but not enough to offset Jezza.

Fromwetome · 20/03/2023 16:59

If Labour had a stronger stance on women's rights I.e gender ideology shite and concessions for single mothers then I would be more inclined.

They refuse to see the the UK is currently economically and infra-structurally unable to look after illegal migrants as it cannot even look after its own (please see our food bank usage l, housing crisis and our 3rd world healthcare, 7 million on waitlists etc) which is also another reason why I won't be voting for them. Britain is at breaking point, people are being fleeced, forced into poverty whilst still working full time, sick and ill and can't get healthcare and they want to focus on housing/ providing benefits for economic migrants. From where are they funding this exactly? And why should taxpayers pay more when our current citizens are in the same financial hardship as an illegal migrant? Makes no sense.

I have been a Labour voter my entire life, I have been a supporter of migrant rehousing my whole adult life but we need to stop for now, we are in a very bad place economically.

6 elections of Labour voting and it's my first GE where I will vote greens or a general donkey vote. I'm not putting my name to either party anymore, it's a same shit different name scenario and I am done with it personally.

Fromwetome · 20/03/2023 17:06

@SkeeSkeeGoGo I agree with your post completely, you put into words what I couldn't. I'm politically homeless too.

SleepingRedSnowBootsAndThePea · 20/03/2023 17:07

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 16:55

A friend who knew RR when she was at the BoE reckoned that she was exceptionally good so I have my fingers crossed that she is being fed a digest of the intelligent MN debate and is quietly mulling over plans for her first appearances at the despatch box. And formulating economic/fiscal policy for the manifesto but I am not expecting Labour to unveil policy commitments until a GE is imminent. They would be daft to do so. But I am quietly optimistic. As a swing voter, it is a major element in deciding which way I swing.

That is good to hear. I was optimistic that she would be good asa potential Chancellor given her background in economics and at the BOE. However, her recent interview with Mumsnet made me think again, particularly her dismissive attitude when the bottlenecks in the tax system which have been shown to be massively harming productivity and impeding growth were raised. It's baffling that she wouldn't engage on that issue and said it's "not a priority" because living standards and tax revenues to fund services for everyone are being curtailed as a result. Wouldn't be expecting her to announce policy proposals at this point but being dismissive about one of the main problems that would be part of her remit to fix in the Chancellor role was far from reassuring that she has a grip on what her priorities should be.

OP posts:
Trethew · 20/03/2023 17:31

Angela Rayner and Jeremy Corbyn - that’s why I can’t feel confident in them

Blossomtoes · 20/03/2023 17:36

Trethew · 20/03/2023 17:31

Angela Rayner and Jeremy Corbyn - that’s why I can’t feel confident in them

Jeremy Corbyn is no longer a member of the Labour Party.

Babybunting123 · 20/03/2023 17:38

Because I'm not a Socialist.

Seamstressfortheband · 20/03/2023 17:40

I can't bring myself to back anything that skanky Rayner is a part of.

hattie43 · 20/03/2023 19:29

Seamstressfortheband · 20/03/2023 17:40

I can't bring myself to back anything that skanky Rayner is a part of.

Can you just imagine her on the world stage . Embarrassing.

RobinRobinMouse · 20/03/2023 19:33

@hattie43 Still nowhere near as embarrassing as Boris Johnson or Suella Braverman though.

Blossomtoes · 20/03/2023 19:36

RobinRobinMouse · 20/03/2023 19:33

@hattie43 Still nowhere near as embarrassing as Boris Johnson or Suella Braverman though.

Indeed. And how much more embarrassing could you get than Truss and Kwarteng. Now that was embarrassment.

whittingtonmum · 20/03/2023 19:38

What stops me voting Labour? Absolutely nothing.

I can't wait to see the back of that current lot. Just please don't get me started on this billions of pounds pension give away to the rich last week. By all means do something targeted to doctors but don't include bankers, lawyers, CEOs and similar in it. I bet the rich are stuffing their millions into their pension pots as we speak so they can be inherited tax-free. The rest of us are left to pick up the bill by paying our taxes and supporting our public services while the rich are squirreling away their millions and exploiting the tax loophole of the century.

Sickening. Bring on Labour please.

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 20:36

Divergent on the Tories you hate. Suella Braverman is Marmite, and so was Kwarteng but neither is male, stale or pale. Both speak for a powerful rising tide of able, educated second generation immigrants who are powerfully opinionated and protective of what their adoptive countries should aspire to be in the future. I am starting to think that the Indian diaspora is likely to save Britain from itself.

Blossomtoes · 20/03/2023 20:39

Kwarteng is male 😂

bamboowarrior · 20/03/2023 20:43

So - y'all busy slating Labour???

I take it You are happy with the tory party dismantling our country/ trashing our health / education/ water / travel / police

I take it you are multi millionaires who doesn't need any state support / can have private security/ private health / private education/ gated community

The tory party are destroying this country and tyrning it into a trump style facist state and you wanna slate the only party who can put the brakes on

Go ahead...... and thanks so much

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 20:50

Kwarteng is male, but not pale. And fortunately discredited.

The Tories, appalling though they are currently, are the party that are more open to advancing promising talented people from all backgrounds. I think you are blindfolded @bamboowarrior .

Clavinova · 20/03/2023 20:52

Interesting poll today;

@ DeltapollUK
Labour lead is ten points in latest results from Deltapoll.
Con 35% (+8)
Lab 45% (-5)
Lib Dem 7% (-2)
Other 13% (-2)
Fieldwork: 17th - 20th March 2023
Sample: 1,054 GB adults
(Changes from 10th - 13th March 2023)

bamboowarrior · 20/03/2023 20:57

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 20:50

Kwarteng is male, but not pale. And fortunately discredited.

The Tories, appalling though they are currently, are the party that are more open to advancing promising talented people from all backgrounds. I think you are blindfolded @bamboowarrior .

You areclearly blindfolded deae friend - but good luck as the whole country burns

bamboowarrior · 20/03/2023 21:01

hattie43 · 20/03/2023 19:29

Can you just imagine her on the world stage . Embarrassing.

You Both are totally embarrassing with your disgusting comments .

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 21:01

White and English, middle class, small time entrepreneur, in an industry that was dismissed as irrelevant 20 years ago that is roaring back as central to manufacturing. Despite everything said about Brexit, and what a disaster it would be, our SME cannot keep up with demand.

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 21:02

We also can't find the additional staff needed.

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 21:24

The long era of cheap money is over. Dead. Done and dusted.

TooBigForMyBoots · 20/03/2023 22:31

EffortlessDesmond · 20/03/2023 21:24

The long era of cheap money is over. Dead. Done and dusted.

You better believe it. Austerity, Brexit, Truss and Kwarteng have all destroyed the UK economy and credit rating.

thewooster · 21/03/2023 07:39

Following on from Clavinova's post above, it's been reported in the DM today:
Labour's lead over the Tories has been slashed by 13 points as Rishi Sunak appears to be winning over voters disenchanted by the Tory chaos of the past year.
A Deltapoll survey today put the Conservatives up eight points on 35 points, their highest since Liz Truss's disastrous mini-Budget last September.
It puts them 10 points behind Labour, who have dropped five points in the past week.
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11882299/Is-Rishi-Sunak-starting-win-voters-Labours-poll-lead-Tories-cut-just-10-points.html

Also in Bloomberg but behind a paywall.

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