To ask for help - Autistic DS

[Goinggoinggone1]

Ds (13) is Autistic and has a lot of anxiety, particularly around school. I understand he has a lot of struggles due to this but he seems to take out all his frustration on his 2 siblings but mostly ds2 (10). They've never had a close relationship but recently he can't tolerate even being him near him. Anything ds2 says he has to reply with sarcasm or tells him to shut up. He says he hates him and hates living with him. He has sensory issues and hates that ds2 sings and talks loudly. I've bought him noise cancelling headphones but refuses to wear them.

Generally he's a well behaved and gentle boy but recently (teenage hormones!) he's become so moody, rude and stubborn with me too. I can deal with it (mostly) but I absolutely can't stand how he treats ds2 and the deteriorating affect it's having on the rest of us. It's led to ds2 getting angry very easily and crying multiple times a day. This then leads to DH (also Autistic) shouting and punishing ds1 which doesn't help the situation. Oh and DH has been having a go at me recently that I spoil ds1 and suggesting that I'm too soft on him and I let him get away with things. Ffs. I can't deal with any of them at the moment. But I know if we can somehow improve the relationship between both brothers then it won't escalate with everyone frustrated with each other. Anyone else in a similar situaton? Any helpful ideas?

No advice to offer - I'm autistic but no experience of DC - but bumping and wishing you all the best.

Thank you @Bo@BoardLikeAMirror

My children are pre-teens but same problem between my autistic and NT child.
I've started to read "Calm parents, happy siblings. How to stop the squabbles and raise friends for life."
It's quite helpful.

My initial thought is divide and conquer. Maybe you take DS1 and your husband takes the others more often. I know it sounds like that won't address the problem, but with anxiety and autism, until he is a bit more chilled out, he won't be able to engage with any fixes/relationship building you attempt. De-escalate first.

My autistic DD became a nightmare at that age, it's quite common. I think puberty is a difficult time for ASD youngsters.

Is your DS being seen by CAMHS? If not please get that ball rolling ASAP. Also keep school in the loop of everything that's going on... their influence may open doors for you if there is a good SEND team.

I don't want to alarm you, but when DD got to 13-14 she became completely withdrawn, violent and refused school for a year. CAMHS were rubbish for a long time and SS were quite happy for her to physically assault me and younger DD and trash the house.
Finally CAMHS referred us to a "crisis" psychiatrist who prescribed her risperidone, which calmed her immediately, and changed her antidepressants. She's 16 now and still has some problems, but much better.

Do ask for help; it takes a long time so don't wait until things are critical before you take action.

I'm sorry you're going through this 💐

Keep them away from each other, and when you want to go out tag team with DH to take one each?

We got a private family therapist in, that specialises in ASD interactions. It did help although DH (also autistic) found it the hardest of all.

Have you set clear boundaries? Have you explained clear consequences? Have they got their own space in the house they can go to when needing time away from each other (and for processing emotions)? Are they able to recognise their emotional scale (1- calm, 3-getting frustrated, 5 - lost control) and learn a strategy to help calm when they get to 3? (see www.5pointscale.com)

Thank you for all the replies and suggestions. I'm so sorry I'm unable to tag anyone as it glitches everytime I try!

Thanks for the book recommendation I will look into that incaspider

When we're out it's not as much of an issue because they tend to stay away from each other and each gravitates towards one parent. It's at home really in his safe space where ds1 can't stand noise and ds2 talking or making noise or being anywhere near him. They are both real home bodies and don't like going out, but we try and take ds2 along if one of us is going anywhere to give ds1 space and some quiet time.

No ds1 isn't under camhs. After his diagnosis they didn't want to know. A referral was made last year by the GP when his anxiety was out of control and he was school avoidant but camhs declined it because they told us anxiety is a part of ASD and that was that. I'm glad your DD is doing better Pearl, it's so hard seeing them struggle and no help being offered until crisis point.

He has been struggling with school since last year but we are taking it a day at a time. SENCO isn't the best but he listens when I write a very strong worded email or speak to the HOY. I have suggested HomeEd but Ds1 wants to stay in school. And tbh with his current attitide and behavior I would struggle to remain calm and be able to make a success of it.

My initial thought was that you’re being too soft with DS1 and he has to learn that he can’t control everyone.

However, I’m autistic too and I also can’t stand noise or loud people. As you’ve just seen, I also struggle to see things from other people’s point of view unless I really force myself to think about it

My two are both autistic and trigger each other massively. Child 1 can be extremely verbally cruel to child 2. Sometimes it tips over to aggression. It’s very hard to deal with. No advice just sympathy.

Fridaytwattery when he's calm and I try to explain things to him he just can't see why his behaviour is unacceptable. He can't see that he treats ds2 so badly and places all the blame on him. It's really hard because he then says it's not his fault he's autistic. But I've told him nobody can treat people badly no matter what condition they have. But he's always the victim. DH is hard work because he makes the situation worse by getting frustrated and snapping. He can't understand why ds1 is the way he is as his autistic traits are different to ds's.

Bourbon maybe I am a little soft on him and DH has a point. But then I can see how much he's struggling. He's frequently dysregulated due to sensory overload and anxiety from school. He has burnout last year and he couldn't even wash and slept for 2 days straight. I was fraught with worry and had to deal with it all. DH just buried his head in the sand. I'm the one beavering away in the background to make sure Ds1 is okay and his needs are being met at home and school. DH just thinks I'm making excuses for his behaviour and pandering and it really is that simple to him.

Have you looked at the calmer EarPods

they have a v good reputation

No but I will check them out thank you. The issue is he doesn't believe he should have to cover his ears because everyone should accommodate him by staying quiet. He says ds2 is unreasonably loud. He isn't.

I have absolutely nothing to offer but just to say I'm in the same boat. It is so good to know someone out there is facing the same things

Maybe a social story?
Maybe state that saying 'shut up' is not ok. He can use "please, can you try and be quiet?"
But they do need their own space and knowing when to go to that space before he tells DS2 'shut up'
Why does he refuse to wear his headphones? I explained to my DC that they have them and it's up to them to use them. If they make a choice not to, they can't blame anyone else as they made a choice to hear the noise.

I think you need to work on ds1 taking himself elsewhere in the house when he is in a grump. He might well find it hard to tolerate ds2 but he needs to start learning some strategies that do not involve being nasty to others. If he comes home heightened, maybe he needs to spend half an hour in his room with a snack and a drink calming down. Talk to him about what he needs to do. It might also be worth speaking to his sibling and empathising with how they feel. Explain the agreement and ask them to give ds1 space. There does however need to be consequences for ds1 when he is very unpleasant to ds2. However, there will be a normal level of sibling arguments. Only you know how far over the normal line he is taking it.

Ah, this sounds like anger/resentment to me. How's school going? Friendship issues?

I think this age is when DC noticed their difference far more compared to their peers. The gap seems to widen. It was a tough time (they're now at Uni and enjoying life!).

My autistic teen spends most of his time at home in his room. He finds school so tiring that he just needs to decompress on his own. He is happier when it’s just me and him for dinner, I’m quite similar. DH and DD talk a lot, DS tries to eat quickly and run away when it’s the whole family. DS eats breakfast on his own.

We are an autistic household and all present differently. Try and give your eldest space, I presume he has his own room. I would keep DS2 away from his sibling especially after school - take him to an activity etc..

Have your tried noise reducing ear plugs might be easier for him to wear?

Mine are younger, but DC1 (autistic) does take things out on DC2 (far as we know NT). DC1 struggles with noise and wanting to be alone so he does have more than one space he can retreat to that is his, and I will protect that space for him and it’s been made clear to DC2 that it’s out of bounds.

But his sheer nastyness to DC2 (and it was only them, not me or DH) got pretty out of hand at one point and I did have a fairly blunt reading of the riot act to him - I will not tolerate picking on little siblings and any rudeness, unkindness or physical aggression and he now gets sent straight to his room. If he can control his behaviour and not be rude/aggressive with me and DH he can control it with DC2. I also spelled out very bluntly that if he behaves like that with DC2 it makes DC2 feel sad, angry and all the big feelings that DC1 doesn’t like, means DC2 won’t want to play with him, makes me feel sad etc etc. He was extremely upset by that conversation because actually he adores DC2 in a funny kind of way and was devastated when I pointed out the consequences of what he was doing. But it needed saying and his behaviour did improve considerably.

That separate quiet space though has been vital for him - is it possible for your DS to have his own space somewhere? Even a shed?!

They are both real home bodies and don't like going out, but we try and take ds2 along if one of us is going anywhere to give ds1 space and some quiet time.

Does DS2 ever get to have some space and quiet time?

The fact that your DS2 is crying multiple times a day suggests he is really struggling as well.

In the short term, I think you need to provide him with some proper respite from DS1, including in his own home if that's where he prefers to be.

Longer term, hopefully something like family therapy etc will help- but you would probably have to access this privately.

Unfortunately, in the area where I live, you wouldn't be anywhere near the threshold for CAMHS.

I think you have to have clear rules about what is OK to say and what is not OK. Write them down and put them up on the wall if needed. As the adult I would be intervening quite a bit, even suggesting what he could say otherwise or do ‘it’s too loud I am going to my room’ rather than an attack on someone.

Think of practical ways that all kids needs can be met and maybe talk to them about this and get them to suggest solutions too, either one to one or in a group. Like headphones, using their own rooms, even times when someone is in control of the TV and taking turns etc.

But hormones or not, autism or not, it’s never OK to be horrible to other people including and especially family. My DS is profoundly autistic but this is one of my boundaries - no meanness! I have a lot of compassion and I think accommodating is really important to understand that some kids, like your DS, probably does have less ability to regulate, to cope but if he’s choosing not to do things like use headphones then that’s different, that’s learning to treat other people not very well which has to be quickly nipped in the bud!

It's at home really in his safe space where ds1 can't stand noise

Buts it’s also DS2s home and safe space, but he’s being upset to the point of crying multiple times a day. I think your DH has a point about you being too soft of DS1 and what about your DC3? You haven’t even mentioned them since your first post

Also from my personal experience this needs to have a lot of energy and input from us as parents straight away. Don’t wait for Camhs or anyone else. It needs to have a lot of continuous input over several weeks from us as parents and the sooner the better. For your DS it can become ingrained to be rude, and more difficult for him to change the longer you let it go on.

The other thing is to have very, very clear rules about this and stick to them and be physically around your kids at the most stressful points. If you are making dinner just bring in ready meals instead for example - its more important that your time is actively supervising this.

The last thing is prevention is always better, as others have said, maybe see if DS2 can do an activity at ‘stress times’ like after school club or have a one to one with you going out to the shop even to get something they want for dinner, if his dad can stay with DS1.