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AIBU?

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Original poster

Nightclub took DDs epipens

506 replies

anaphyl4xis · 04/03/2023 08:56

My DD - 18 and a 1st year uni student - went to a nightclub last night and they refused to let her keep her epipens on her. They said if she needed them
She had to go to the medical room.

She was with a group of friends and had all paid to get in and the venue also refused to refund if they decided not to go in.

AIBU to be absolutely livid and to follow this up with the company.

For context my daughter has a life threatening allergy to nuts - but not peanuts.

OP posts:
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5
RampantIvy · 04/03/2023 14:35

Those who are minimising this must be lucky enough to never have had to worry that a common food item could kill their child. The OP will likely have spent years trying to ensure her daughter’s safety and that won’t just switch off now that her daughter is 18.

Absolutely @Teakind.

I wonder if Trading Standards would be interested as well.

Ozcando · 04/03/2023 14:38

HNTTFT but I would definitely complain and be very vocal about it . A boy at my sons school died from anaphylactic shock a few years ago . It was his 18th birthday and he went to London and forgot his epipen…absolutely tragic ! He collapsed within seconds and even though he was by St Thomas Hospital he was not able to get there in time ! So the thought of the chaos of a night club horrifies me !

JudgeRudy · 04/03/2023 14:38

YANU tobe absolutely livid. YABU to think it's you who should be 'following up' anything. She's 18.

Rosscameasdoody · 04/03/2023 14:41

GrinAndVomit · 04/03/2023 13:12

Have I defended the club’s stance at any point on this thread?

Show quote history

No, but you’ve advocated for the OP to respect her daughters’ wishes and not intervene. Which, in this case, I believe would be wrong because it’s not just her safety this policy calls into question. The club needs to be taken to task because they’re breaking the law and putting peoples’ safety at risk. If not the OP, then who ? The parents of a young person who is unfortunate enough to have a reaction and die because they couldn’t access the medication ?

LavenderHillMob · 04/03/2023 14:45

cakeorwine · 04/03/2023 10:05

I wonder how spiking is done in nightclubs?

Is it with syringes that look like syringes - or is it with devices that look like Epipens

Exactly. I know nothing about spiking but I'm going to take an educated guess that the weapon of choice is small and subtle. Not a fucking Epipen.

Rosscameasdoody · 04/03/2023 14:45

JudgeRudy · 04/03/2023 14:38

YANU tobe absolutely livid. YABU to think it's you who should be 'following up' anything. She's 18.

Why is it unreasonable for the OP to follow it up ? The clubs’ policy puts everyone with a severe allergy at risk, not to mention that they are operating a discriminatory policy which is against the law. An 18 year old probably won’t appreciate the wider implications and the risk to others, and is also past the age where the OP can ban her from going to any of these establishments. The OP wants to make sure that her own DD and others are safe, so of course she isn’t being unreasonable to get involved and make sure this stops.

Rosscameasdoody · 04/03/2023 14:48

LavenderHillMob · 04/03/2023 14:45

Exactly. I know nothing about spiking but I'm going to take an educated guess that the weapon of choice is small and subtle. Not a fucking Epipen.

Show quote history

The reports I’ve seen say that people don’t realise that they’ve been injected until after they become unwell. As a user of a Metaject pen, which is a similar, pre-filled, single use device I can tell you if you’d been injected with one, you would definitely know. You have to pinch skin together, press down on the outer casing, press the plunger and count to ten. You’d have to hold someone down to do it !! I’ve never actually tried it, but I wouldn’t have thought you could use a device like this to inject through clothing either.

donttellmehesalive · 04/03/2023 14:49

I expect they are fed up of people explaining that this medication, this packet of pills, this piece of equipment is absolutely essential and must be allowed in, so they have a blanket ban - medical room and paramedic on site, all medical equipment stored there.

They are probably also trying to address the relatively recent thing of women being maliciously injected with who-knows-what in clubs.

Maybe a precedent of someone pissed using an epi pen inappropriately on someone else.

They're misguided not malicious so I think a constructive conversation would be better than a furious complaint.

JudgeRudy · 04/03/2023 14:51

Rosscameasdoody · 04/03/2023 14:45

Why is it unreasonable for the OP to follow it up ? The clubs’ policy puts everyone with a severe allergy at risk, not to mention that they are operating a discriminatory policy which is against the law. An 18 year old probably won’t appreciate the wider implications and the risk to others, and is also past the age where the OP can ban her from going to any of these establishments. The OP wants to make sure that her own DD and others are safe, so of course she isn’t being unreasonable to get involved and make sure this stops.

Show quote history

OK, I'll rephrase that. Its unreasonable but the mum to take action instead of yhe daughter.

Rainbowshit · 04/03/2023 14:54

cakeorwine
I wonder how spiking is done in nightclubs?

Is it with syringes that look like syringes - or is it with devices that look like Epipens

Exactly. I know nothing about spiking but I'm going to take an educated guess that the weapon of choice is small and subtle. Not a fucking Epipen.

An epipen is not discreet. It's brightly coloured and is not concealable in your hand. The idea that people are being spiked with modified epipens is utterly ludicrous.

Rosscameasdoody · 04/03/2023 14:58

donttellmehesalive · 04/03/2023 14:49

I expect they are fed up of people explaining that this medication, this packet of pills, this piece of equipment is absolutely essential and must be allowed in, so they have a blanket ban - medical room and paramedic on site, all medical equipment stored there.

They are probably also trying to address the relatively recent thing of women being maliciously injected with who-knows-what in clubs.

Maybe a precedent of someone pissed using an epi pen inappropriately on someone else.

They're misguided not malicious so I think a constructive conversation would be better than a furious complaint.

They’re also breaking the law by confiscating essential medication from those with severe conditions, and refusing entry if people don’t comply. It’s almost like they’ve read the Equality Act 2010 and gone out of their way to ignore it. I understand that this is a complicated issue but it’s not up to disabled people or those with health conditions, or their families, to provide a solution. It is up to them to call it out whenever they encounter it and insist that it stops before someone loses their life as a result of their unthinking and illegal door policies. The rest is up to the establishments themselves - to come up with a solution that doesn’t contravene the rights of those who are disabled or have a severe health condition. Treating them differently and denying entry unless they hand over life saving medication is not a solution.

secondaryquandries · 04/03/2023 14:58

If they have some kind of issue with drink spiking, drugs etc, I guess a work around would be to have a system where you can get agreement in advance to take in our epi pen. Sort of like a VIP guest list.

Got2besoon · 04/03/2023 14:59

YANBU at all.

An English boy died after sipping his mate's pina colada in a nightclub and going into anaphylaxis due to the dairy. He didn't have his epi pens on him.

WiseUpJanetWeiss · 04/03/2023 15:00

I expect they are fed up of people explaining that this medication, this packet of pills, this piece of equipment is absolutely essential and must be allowed in, so they have a blanket ban - medical room and paramedic on site, all medical equipment stored there.

A registered paramedic - not some chancer pretending to be one - would absolutely know the importance of not being separated from adrenaline, and would know a blanket ban on all medicines would be entirely inappropriate. And from OP’s update no way was this “paramedic” a real one.

RampantIvy · 04/03/2023 15:04

JudgeRudy · Today 14:386

YANU tobe absolutely livid. YABU to think it's you who should be 'following up' anything. She's 18.

(Sigh)
She might be an adult, but clearly has asked her mum to help advocate for her. Not everyone is as cocky and confident as you were at that age Hmm

Rosscameasdoody · 04/03/2023 15:04

secondaryquandries · 04/03/2023 14:58

If they have some kind of issue with drink spiking, drugs etc, I guess a work around would be to have a system where you can get agreement in advance to take in our epi pen. Sort of like a VIP guest list.

Shouldn’t need advance agreement, or a ‘VIP’ list. The Equality Act exists to ensure that those with a disability or health condition can enjoy the same facilities as the rest of society. Epi pens are not used for spiking. What’s needed is education for the door staff so they can recognise what represents a threat and what does not. I use a Metaject pen and have been issued with an ID card that details the medication and what it’s for. If people have similar, then showing it should be all that’s necessary - if they don’t, an inspection of the injector device should be all that’s needed, as it should hold the details of the medication, the date and pharmacy of issue.

donttellmehesalive · 04/03/2023 15:07

I just read an article about this happening at a Brighton nightclub in 2021, national news. That particular club said customers were asked to voluntarily hand over medical equipment for safekeeping in a medical room, but that anyone who refused should still have been allowed entry. They blamed over zealous door staff and promised training.

WiseUpJanetWeiss · 04/03/2023 15:07

Its unreasonable but the mum to take action instead of yhe daughter.

This isn’t some consumer protection issue. It’s a safety and equality issue that is (or at least should be) absolutely everyone’s business.

Rosscameasdoody · 04/03/2023 15:10

JudgeRudy · 04/03/2023 14:51

OK, I'll rephrase that. Its unreasonable but the mum to take action instead of yhe daughter.

Show quote history

Still not unreasonable. I agree she should discuss it with her DD because she is directly involved, but as I say, a younger person won’t necessarily grasp the wider implications and won’t be as confident to stand up to the club staff in getting it stopped - especially if, as the OP said, she’s embarrassed by the condition.

RampantIvy · 04/03/2023 15:10

The "she's 18 it isn't anything to do with you" posters are doing my head in.

When it is a life threatening allergy or health condition a good parent would and should intervene.

notthishill · 04/03/2023 15:12

I wouldn't get too worked up over storing epipens in a dedicated medical room staffed by a licensed medical practitioner unless there's a major drip feed and the club was gigantic, and the medical room was nowhere near where the OP's DD would be at any one time.

An epipen is a huge needle. I can understand why bouncers at a nightclub might feel uncomfortable with people walking around carrying huge needles and want to stash them in a medical room.

However, as the OP's DD did not feel comfortable with this policy, I think the club should have refunded entry for her mates and given them the option of all going somewhere else together.

WiseUpJanetWeiss · 04/03/2023 15:17

notthishill · 04/03/2023 15:12

I wouldn't get too worked up over storing epipens in a dedicated medical room staffed by a licensed medical practitioner unless there's a major drip feed and the club was gigantic, and the medical room was nowhere near where the OP's DD would be at any one time.

An epipen is a huge needle. I can understand why bouncers at a nightclub might feel uncomfortable with people walking around carrying huge needles and want to stash them in a medical room.

However, as the OP's DD did not feel comfortable with this policy, I think the club should have refunded entry for her mates and given them the option of all going somewhere else together.

Well there’s absolutely no evidence from the OP’s DD’s updates that there was either a registered medical practitioner or a dedicated medical room, for a start.

EqualFranknessWithYourLadyship · 04/03/2023 15:20

Well I wouldn’t have “got worked up” either before my son had anaphylaxis……

minksss · 04/03/2023 15:24

notthishill · 04/03/2023 15:12

I wouldn't get too worked up over storing epipens in a dedicated medical room staffed by a licensed medical practitioner unless there's a major drip feed and the club was gigantic, and the medical room was nowhere near where the OP's DD would be at any one time.

An epipen is a huge needle. I can understand why bouncers at a nightclub might feel uncomfortable with people walking around carrying huge needles and want to stash them in a medical room.

However, as the OP's DD did not feel comfortable with this policy, I think the club should have refunded entry for her mates and given them the option of all going somewhere else together.

I think unless you're someone familiar with anyphylaxis and the laws surrounding allergy you can't make sweeping statements like this

Rainbowshit · 04/03/2023 15:24

notthishill · 04/03/2023 15:12

I wouldn't get too worked up over storing epipens in a dedicated medical room staffed by a licensed medical practitioner unless there's a major drip feed and the club was gigantic, and the medical room was nowhere near where the OP's DD would be at any one time.

An epipen is a huge needle. I can understand why bouncers at a nightclub might feel uncomfortable with people walking around carrying huge needles and want to stash them in a medical room.

However, as the OP's DD did not feel comfortable with this policy, I think the club should have refunded entry for her mates and given them the option of all going somewhere else together.

Well you should be getting worked up because any delay in administering an epipen can be fatal. Which is why they are recommended to be kept on the person at all times and never ever in a medical room.

Posting this once again. 11 minutes delay was fatal to this child.

www.thesun.co.uk/news/4319486/school-boy-died-allergic-reaction-11-minutes-find-epipen/amp/

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