To think MN posters have a weird attitude towards potential benefit cheats?

[Moonicorn]

I say potential as they won’t all be, obviously.

But it’s almost like a ‘beak out everyone, if they want to steal from the public purse then good for them, and what’s more you should be happy to fund it’.

Whereas MPs fiddling their expenses, or tradespeople (ESPECIALLY if they owe CMS) not declaring earnings is seen as ‘immoral’ and something that should be exposed/punished.

What exactly is the difference?

We’re not bashing benefit claimants. We’re bashing fraudsters. Why do you keep mixing them up?

This.

I agree OP.
I get really irritated with the usual MN posts on here. Blatant examples of benefit fraud and posters being told to mind their own business. Well as long as I'm paying taxes and living in this country then people stealing from the public purse is my business. Why wouldn't it be?

I'll treat that with the contempt it deserves.

Of course benefit fraud is not of the same magnitude as corporate tax evasion, but that doesn't mean it doesn't matter. The tax evaders should be prosecuted too. Just because murder is worse than armed robbery is doesn't mean we should stop caring about armed robbery and only investigate murders.

I see it as a Robin Hood attitude - stealing from the rich to give to the poor. Unfortunately whilst some of it maybe a struggling single parent just about able to feed her hungry child much of it would fall into the greedy, selfish entitled attitude.

I think it is because this site is made up of mothers, of which a percentage struggle to get what they are entitled to, which typically isn't anywhere near enough and a lot less than people think, and feel that they are under attack when people mention this.

There are undoubtedly people who are extremely adept at working the system at best and dishonestly claiming at worst. The numbers are up for debate.

The issue is the injustice. Some people graft their whole lives and pay tax on the understanding that people who need help will be helped. But they are offended by the prospect of shunning the work they've done as a choice. Also, people who do need these benefits and face battles and numerous assessments are appalled by those who shouldn't be entitled getting them easily.

Its like stealing from the poppy tin to some. To others its like nicking a grape from tesco and its amazon/starbucks/mps that are the ones stealing the poppy tin.

Exactly, whilst you've said it grates you've essentially said you'd somewhat overlook it as humanistic and " trying to make ends meet" so you can see there's different circumstances where you feel needs must.

It shouldn't then be difficult to see why some feel it's less offensive/ feel it's more acceptable that benefit claimants who MAY be cheating the system for more money in comparison to MPs when you compare some of the poorest in the country gaining a few 100 to the policy makers who are in the top 1% swindling £10ks, sometimes £100ks a year, especially when it's often on stuff that the poorest that you bemoan a few 100 have to pay for such as heating.

It essentially comes from your own prejudice that those on benefits are undeserving and believe the media portrayal of those on benefits.

Part of me wonders if it would be any use as she really is so open about it, and a couple of her side businesses are on social media - so why haven't they done anything already?
They also ask for a lot of information and I don't know her exact address, just the area. I wouldn't go to the lengths of finding it out either. She's more of an acquaintance, it's a family member of hers that I know fairly well.

UC is very generous to single mothers? I’ll tell the food bank that my UC is more than enough to feed me and the kids and I shouldn’t have needed their help last month then 🙄

Shitting on your neighbours by shopping them to the government is awful.

It's punching down.

They will face cross examination and possibly loss of freedom enforced by a bunch of hypocrites who have themselves rigged the system so they can steal without consequence to live a life of luxury.

Read a bit about the Poor Laws of Britain. It should make you angry, if you have a heart.

Agreed.

NowDoYouBelieveMe · Today 11:06
Shitting on your neighbours by shopping them to the government is awful.“

Yes it is. Shitting on your neighbours by making false claims is awful, too.

There isn't a difference in the principle, OP; fraud is fraud, though of course the amounts differ

But it's probably easier for some to avoid looking at their own choices, by passing all the blame to Amazon, higher rate taxpayers, the government and so on - in other words the usual thing of "something must be done" just so long as it doesn't have to affect them

Are they not shutting on their neighbours by stealing their taxes? If not, why not?

I would. If she’s done nothing wrong she has nothing to worry about. Why should she take money you earn and that should be benefitting your children?

And as you've already said, you don't care if someone has their claim suspended, even if the report is unfounded or malicious, because it's only temporary

When you look at the stuff that's actually stolen from supermarkets it's fairly clear that most of the thieves are doing it professionally for resale, not because they're alcoholic carnivores desperate for a steak sandwich and a glass of Jack Daniel's.

I think the attitude is more about focusing on your right or wrongdoings rather than other peoples.

ie if someone asked ‘I want to commit benefit fraud AIBU?’ They would be told, yes you are.

but if someone asked ‘I want to report someone for benefit fraud AIBU’ they would be told also, yes you are, it’s none of your business, you don’t know for sure etc.

So nobody should ever be investigated?

I think it's very much down to personal experiences with benefit fraud, what shapes your opinion, I'm happy to share my personal story, so you can see how my concerns are probably different, but I appreciate that people working hard, even people working hard in receipt of UC etc, don't want others taking the piss anymore than they want corporate tax dodgers, but if you'd like to read my experience of my benefit fraudulent, I'm happy to share.
T/W - Child Sexual Abuse & Domestic Violence.

My parents were benefit frauds for 14 years.
My father used his sisters address for post but lived with us.
We had nothing, literally nothing. Some days we couldn't afford to eat more than jammy toast.
My father was a highly abusive individual, he would spend his wages and my mother's to go drinking for days on end before he'd return home to beat my mother, often her requiring hospitalisation and then he'd climb into bed and molest me.
My poor mother was terrified of him, he wouldn't leave and the first time the police came to our home the officer asked her, "what did you do to wind him up love?", he'd broken a glass over her mouth.
My mother would have been safer in prison for fraud.
My mother was privately educated from a middle class background so felt so much shame she couldn't tell anyone how fucked up her life was.
I sadly think situations such as mine are just as common as, "5 trips to florida, brand new range rover and 100 pairs of new balance trainers a month".

I still feel "scummy" that I was a kid growing up with benefit cheat parents, "lwren, never tell anyone dad lives here/don't tell anyone we're to skint for sausage and mash". Even though I really should just feel grateful I survived.

I look back and think without my father's benders would we have had more than most? My father did a variety of illegal work, including moonlighting as a taxi driver without a badge, just using a drinking buddy's car. Mum worked as a cleaner in 3 care homes, did the home help and did cash in hand shop work.

I worry for kids of benefit fraud in certain situations deeply, because if they loose that extra 300pcm, are those kids more at risk of essentially being pimped out? I believe that my father 100% would have allowed drinking buddies to have molested me for a few pints and my mother would never have been the wiser.

I think the attitude is more about focusing on your right or wrongdoings rather than other peoples.

I don’t see that logical being applied evenly on here- particularly not to any threads concerning men or the wealthy… just this…

@Moonicorn you don’t seem to see the logic in much at all. It’s attitudes like yours that do a massive detriment to those needing to claim benefits. Hopefully you’ll never find yourself in a position to need financial help from anyone, but if that day comes I really hope you realise how much of a twunt you were about it all.

I’m very sceptical of the “my neighbour’s cousin’s ex-wife is committing benefit fraud and has a big tv and isn’t REALLY a single parent and has fake nails and yells about how she hates the taxpayer- what should I do? 🥺” type threads. For some reason these people somehow know all the details and just post vaguely enough to get everyone into a rage.

Honestly, at this point MN might as well have a sticky thread for complaining about the poors and their shameless audacity to not want their kids to starve.

Yeah, I do feel it’s slightly different than the Tories robbing the country blind and billionaires paying no tax. I also remember seeing a thread on here once about someone suspecting their in-laws were committing tax fraud and they overwhelmingly got told to wind their neck in and look the other way.

Why do posters like you keep conflating ‘claiming benefits’ with ‘committing fraud’? I’m talking about the latter, not the former.