To think a lot of posts on this social services Facebook group can’t be entirely truthful?

[TheObstinateHeadstrongGirl]

5 years ago, my DD made a disclosure about a family friend which we reported to the police. As a result we had children’s services involved in our lives and had a horrendous excuse for a social worker who cast doubt of my DD’s experience. FWIW: I know the vast majority of social workers are excellent, sadly we had a very brief experience with a really incompetent one, so I’m not in the “all social workers are evil” camp. I can’t imagine how hard it must be to do that job in a broken country with failing systems.

Anyway, at the time I joined a Facebook support group for those who have children’s services involved to get advice on how to handle everything that was going on. I never left the group, for no particular reason. And for some reason Facebook’s algorithm have been putting the posts on my feed more recently.

Some of the posts are very strange.

Posters claiming they’re on a child protection plan because their relatives are in the army. Or because they have a messy house. Some claim they don’t know why they’re at PLO level (which is a pre-cursor to court action). Loads of posts claiming SS are involved for no reason whatsoever, including pregnant women who look like they’re gonna have their babies removed and they don’t know why. Not all obviously but a large amount claim this.

AIBU to think that children aren’t placed on the child protection register for living in a messy house and there must be more to it?

This is a good point.

I often think if you don’t have the nouse to challenge lies, to correct errors and to stand up for yourself you’d be fucked if SS came into your life.

Surely you can record whatever you like in your home? It just wouldn’t be treated as something official

I can honestly say that in all the core meetings I’ve sat through and all the visits I’ve done never has someone asked for the interaction to be recorded.

I can only speak for myself obviously, others may have different experiences.

My experience of "lying" by social workers (although this is elder care rather than children) is someone wilfully misinterpreting what was said and then having a hissy fit because they don't get what they want. So FIL would ask for something, be told "it's highly unlikely we would be able to do that " and take it as a promise it would be done and then have a hossy fit when it didn't happen. Original conversation witnessed by other family members. Then he would tell everyone SS had gone back on promises and get sympathy from his mates.

it is really hard to comprehend but having read a few studies recently, some people just do not have the same mental ability as others - they can not think things through in the same way or comprehend certain ideas or points of view. I just thought soome people were idiots but actually they just cannot process things in the same way.
I think they truly believe what they are saying but just cant see that dirty dishes and animal waste is not just 'normal clutter'.

These stories are unsurprising when lack of insight of the parents is one of the main reasons they can’t make the necessary changes to provide good enough parenting to their children. If they understood and addressed them then they wouldn’t be in this situation.

There are of course many shades of grey and some possibly unfair decisions at the margins.

My house is messy and I've had professionals come round and they've never involved SS so obviously more to it than that.

So you have had a terrible experience with SS but don’t believe others when they share theirs?

I think YAB way more U than you realise unfortunately

Babies absolutely do get removed at birth if there is a belief of significant risk of harm.

Leiland James being one

I have said I can well believe people get an incompetent social worker. But I’m afraid I do find it hard to believe that children are at risk of being removed just because their house is a bit messy on one occasion.

I suppose it is easier and more comfortable to deny or minimise; because if you admitted it, you might feel obliged to do something about it, or at least accept some responsibility for the consequences of your actions or inactions.

Much , much more comfortable to deny it, or make up a story about victimisation.

Home education isn’t for you I’m afraid, your English is shocking!

DH has a friend who fosters babies that are removed at birth. They are virtually all bor addicted to drugs.

@bluelollipop99 I've referred to this on the thread earlier and I'm not sure why it's been ignored, but however much people like to frame social workers as being 'the child protection police' our job is not characterised by interviewing/interrogating parents.
The majority of the conversations we have are about trying to understand behaviour and change behaviour or support families to develop plans.

We leave the investigating to the police. There are certain points in child protection where things are recorded - but minuted rather than audio recording - such as child protection conferences, plo meetings (where parents have a solicitor present) for example.

Again as I've mentioned earlier my main objection to recording is that it wouldn't work and wouldn't benefit the family. At others have said, families aren't likely to open up to us. Many of the accusations about lies are about different interpretations of things said rather than a direct lie. Unless recorded in a proper studio with proper processes, audio recording wouldn't be acceptable as 'evidence' - eg a parent could claim it's not them, the audio is too poor etc. The processes for audio recording by the police are very very formal and rightly so. We wouldn't be able to do our jobs if that is how we approached every interaction with a family.

I've done two meetings and a visit with different families today. None of them involved grilling a parent about suspected child abuse. Two involved working with parents where domestic abuse was a feature about how we can support them and reduce the likelihood of the children being affected, one was to a vulnerable parent with mental health issues. None of that would benefit from audio recording. Yes there could be something unexpected that crops up, but it would be disproportionate to record everyone 'just in case'.

Well yes that’s exactly the point I’m trying to make as you said children aren’t removed due to risk of future harm. They are

It’s a way of your kids never bettering themselves, never being able to hold done a job, not knowing how to budget …just like the parents who spout this shite, life’s better on benefits when you are as thick as mince!

Couldn't agree more with this

I forgot to add, again I mentioned this earlier but in terms of parents recording, I won't and don't agree to it the sole reason that I've been recorded in secret before and that information has been used, edited (to remove context) and shared publicly, breaking the child's confidentially. A whole community posting on Facebook about how outraged they are does not help a child. It doesn't result in 'justice' for the family. What i will do if a parent tells me they're worried about me lying, is I'll try and agree some other means to mitigate that worry - by typing a summary of key points discussed and agreeing any corrections and sharing it before I leave. Or that they can have someone else with them at any visits/meetings. But, and I get people might not believe me about this, it's very rare that I've been accused of lying by families. A big part of what I do is be really transparent with parents - being direct about what my concerns are, as well as what I see the positives are. Be honest about what WOULD make me concerned enough to want to start the process of removal. By asking parents to check paperwork that I share. Unsurprisingly if you offer basic respect to people are honest and transparent with them they are far less likely to accuse you of lying/of hiding things.

Yep. Not something done lightly.

But they haven’t harmed THAT child - children DO get removed at birth for risk of potential harm, even if they’ve never so much as had a glass of sneery at Christmas or a sneaky cig in pregnancy

I'm just place making so I can come back later when I'm off the bus and share my experience with SS.