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AIBU?

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Have I been mislead? Help

51 replies

trustfall · 16/02/2023 17:12

I posted in legal matters but there's not much traffic so shamelessly posting on here.

Hi everyone. I will try to keep this short but I want to make sure every details is in here to make it as factual as possible to see if we have a leg to stand on legally.

We live in a private rented property and have done for just over a year. We are good clean tenants and have never had any complaints. In January we renewed our tenancy. The landlord increased our rent. Not by masses, but by enough to make things tight, but we accepted it as we were happy here.
A week later we are told the house was going on the market and that the estate agents will be in touch to take photos and arrange viewings etc. This all happened very quickly, and the house was on the market in just over a week after renewing our tenancy.

I have cancer and have been undergoing treatment and multiple surgeries, which the EA and landlord are aware of. When we were told the house was going on the market, the email specifically says 'the landlord is happy for you to stay in situ until a sale has been agreed. If an exchange has not been made by then, your tenancy will roll onto a periodic.
Due to this, we, rightly or wrongly, started to look for somewhere to live straight away as we didn't want to live on a knife edge here not knowing when we'd have to move, and have people traipsing in whilst my health is vulnerable. So we thought we'd get out and find somewhere. Which we have now done.

We served our 2 months notice and it has been declined, saying as the house hasn't been sold yet, we are liable to pay the rent until the end of tenancy in June. I thought this was desperately unfair, as in the email (which has now been admitted was poorly worded by the EA) that the landlord is happy for us to stay in situ until the point of sale, which we read, as if that happened before the tenancy was up, they'd serve us notice of 2 months and we would leave. So it would be only fair we could do the same.

I feel like I have totally been mislead here, as not only has the rent increased, but they renewed our tenancy, asking for more money a month, knowing they were selling. But tied us into the contract so we had to carry on paying rent until they reach a sale. The viewings that have happened so far are families and and no investors. I have been incredibly fair with viewings. I have to shield for a week during my treatment and when viewings are being done, I go and sit in my car, DH does a quick clean and if they've opened doors and touched things he wipes them down, and I come back in.

I know we don't have to accept viewings, but if we don't, and we don't get a sale agreed, we'll have to pay rent here. As well as our new place which we move into this weekend.

I feel like we have been totally mislead. Had we have known the house was going on the market days after renewing our tenancy, we of course wouldn't have renewed.

Do we have any leg to stand on legally? We are still moving. The whole thing is causing us so much stress. But I'm trying to work out if we could get any legal advice to not pay the rent here too until June or to break the clause early. And the real kicker is the landlord has done the reference for us to move out, and is now saying we have to stay until June! We just feel like it's such a misrepresentation and have been totally mislead here. We signed the tenancy to live here peacefully, not waiting for a house to sell at any point and for us to deliberately not be told this until we have renewed the tenancy.
We have a 12 month contract with 6 month break clause in June.

AIBU to think we've been mislead and this is really unfair?

Thank you. Any advice will be ever so appreciated

OP posts:
Uptownswirl · 16/02/2023 17:13

Long and short of it is if your tenancy is still active you can legally remain on site until it expires, regardless of who owns the house.

Changingplace · 16/02/2023 17:16

That do seem really unfair, I’m not sure of the legal obligation- I’d contact the charity Shelter for advice.

Sparklfairy · 16/02/2023 17:17

Have you tried contacting Shelter? I'm not sure but I think you'd have a pretty good argument for unfair contract terms in this case. So in your position, I'd check with Shelter - they have a very good live chat - and then 'break' the tenancy, leave when I wanted, and put together a waterproof defence citing unfair contract terms with all the dates, emails and paperwork ready if the LL tried to take me to court.

Nimbostratus100 · 16/02/2023 17:17

contact your local council housing department for advice, they will have someone that private tenants can ask these questions of

Also, you could contact citizens advice, and/or shelter

They sound very nasty, maximising the profit they can get from you with absolutely no human decency. Whether they are right or wrong, I dont know. But it might be the EA, not the landlord, taking the decisions on to themselves, maybe the landlord themselves might be more reasonable

best wishes xx

Uptownswirl · 16/02/2023 17:20

I've looked into buying a house with a tenant in situ - a lot of landlords are selling up now.

As the purchaser you cannot evict the tenant unless they either breach their tenancy or the tenancy comes to a natural conclusion.

If you are wanting to terminate your tenancy you can't until the 6 month break point - I've been in your situation before too.

Newusernameaug · 16/02/2023 17:22

I’ll state I know nothing legally - but fuck them! What awful people, I’d just move out and stop paying rent, sadly it means you’ll forfeit your deposit. If they take you to court then I’d really hope you’d win and common sense would prevail. Sorry you’re going through this

olympicsrock · 16/02/2023 17:22

Morally they are in the wrong but legally in the right . If your contract had a no break clause until June then surely your tenancy was ensured until June even if they sold. You shouldn’t have taken on a new place without checking this out I’m afraid.

trustfall · 16/02/2023 17:22

Nimbostratus100 · 16/02/2023 17:17

contact your local council housing department for advice, they will have someone that private tenants can ask these questions of

Also, you could contact citizens advice, and/or shelter

They sound very nasty, maximising the profit they can get from you with absolutely no human decency. Whether they are right or wrong, I dont know. But it might be the EA, not the landlord, taking the decisions on to themselves, maybe the landlord themselves might be more reasonable

best wishes xx

It's the landlord. The EA are being pretty unbiased at this point but do agree it's a tricky situation.

I will definitely do this, and contact shelter.

I'm losing sleep over this. It's so desperately unfair. Specifically as they knew my vulnerability before this all happened. They have multiple properties and they are now all on the market. I have to move out for my my own health and safety as I'm undergoing surgery and treatment until at least early summer. I'm devastated and just wish they'd let us pay our 2 month notice and let us go.

OP posts:
trustfall · 16/02/2023 17:23

Sparklfairy · 16/02/2023 17:17

Have you tried contacting Shelter? I'm not sure but I think you'd have a pretty good argument for unfair contract terms in this case. So in your position, I'd check with Shelter - they have a very good live chat - and then 'break' the tenancy, leave when I wanted, and put together a waterproof defence citing unfair contract terms with all the dates, emails and paperwork ready if the LL tried to take me to court.

Thank you. This is so helpful. I will do exactly this.

OP posts:
trustfall · 16/02/2023 17:31

olympicsrock · 16/02/2023 17:22

Morally they are in the wrong but legally in the right . If your contract had a no break clause until June then surely your tenancy was ensured until June even if they sold. You shouldn’t have taken on a new place without checking this out I’m afraid.

I understand. But the email from the EA clearly stated 'the landlord is happy for you to stay in situ until a sale is agreed. If this doesn't happen by June your tenancy will roll onto a periodic.'

So if a sale was agreed before June, that reads to me, that we'd have to move. As the landlord is only happy for us to stay in situ until a sale is agreed.

So surely it's only fair, if a landlord is looking to sell before the break clause, we can also look for a place to live? I know legally that's not how it works. But morally this feels so wrong.

OP posts:
Uptownswirl · 16/02/2023 17:33

The EA are talking out their arse. Legally your tenancy remains in place until it ends or one party breaches their end.

8fttrampoline · 16/02/2023 17:53

Shame on greedy ruthless people like this...they know you are unwell and have no problem adding stress to your life. The decent thing to do would be to let you make a clean break and move on, so you can focus on getting better.
I know none of this is constructive, but the power imbalance between landlord and tenant just seems so unfair sometimes.

R00K · 16/02/2023 17:56

Refuse all further viewings until the end of your tenancy.

Forgooodnesssakenow · 16/02/2023 17:56

Leave, let them take you to all claims court if they want to argue it. They probably won't. If they do set up a payment plan and pay it off as little monthly as you can. Fuck them!

Uptownswirl · 16/02/2023 17:57

R00K · 16/02/2023 17:56

Refuse all further viewings until the end of your tenancy.

They can't, it'll be in her tenancy agreement

trustfall · 16/02/2023 17:59

I'm just trying to figure out if we would have a legal case on the grounds of being mislead / misrepresentation of it went to court, because we're stopping our rent on 1sr March as per our notice we served.

We are moving out this weekend. I can't keep going to my car each time there's a viewing and DH having to dettol the place. But if we don't allow viewings the place won't get sold. Which is why we found somewhere else. To try and make the landlords life easier to allow for viewings, with an empty house, and for my health and safety which is paramount.

We did our notice as soon as possible, once we found a new place. Explained the reasons why. The landlord has already done the reference - which we needed to get our new rental. Which is what's even more backwards. But now the landlord is saying no.. stay / pay until June.

There is no way the landlord decided to sell in a matter of days after us increasing our rent and renewing the tenancy. Our 2 months notice ends in March, so our last rent payment will be the 1st March. Just going to have to do as PP said put a water right case together with dates of everything including ive mentioned in this post. Hopefully it won't go to court. It costs money to go to court which I don't have.

This is so morally wrong and unfair.

OP posts:
Uptownswirl · 16/02/2023 18:01

It will go to court.

If your landlord is selling off their portfolio of properties they will have the means to fight this out if you breach. It's shit but do as a PP suggested and speak to shelter or your housing department.

HirplesWithHaggis · 16/02/2023 18:02

Uptownswirl · 16/02/2023 17:57

They can't, it'll be in her tenancy agreement

They can refuse viewings regardless of what it says in the contract.

Chasingdopamine · 16/02/2023 18:05

This is obviously not legal advice but OP how much money in rent are we talking, between March and June? I’m wondering if they would bother taking you to court over it!

I am sorry to hear of your diagnosis and wish you well.

Kazplus2 · 16/02/2023 18:06

Landlord here. I would advise landlord that if you don't move now then you would intend to remain until the end of your contract, regardless of any sale he makes. You are entitled to do this and he will have to sell with a sitting tennant. It may be enough to make him compromise. My understanding is that you are entitled to quiet enjoyment of your property meaning that you can refuse viewings. In my opinion a landlord wishing a tenant to accommodate viewings should be reducing the rent to account for disruption.

RelapsedChocoholic · 16/02/2023 18:07

(I have no legal training, but lots of crappy landlords over the years)

You're not unreasonable or wrong to think it’s unfair and that you were mislead by the landlord renewing just before putting it on the market, imo.

Morally it is wrong, but legally it’s not afaik

The EA email reads to me that your tenancy is going to be broken by the landlord in June (per the break clause), and replaced with a rolling monthly tenancy instead of fixed term.

If a buyer is found sooner than June you will been served a section 21 (the 2 months notice)
There is no section 21 equivalent for tenants
(Unless they’ve taken it off the market this could still be the case)

You can stop paying rent, but the landlord can then take you to court to recover the money. The tenancy deposit schemes do not typically allow the deposit to be taken in lieu of rent, but the landlord could make it take a long time for you to get it back if they choose to.

I hope your treatment is going well 💐

trustfall · 16/02/2023 18:09

Chasingdopamine · 16/02/2023 18:05

This is obviously not legal advice but OP how much money in rent are we talking, between March and June? I’m wondering if they would bother taking you to court over it!

I am sorry to hear of your diagnosis and wish you well.

It's £1450 a month.

We just won't be able to do it on top of the rent on our new place. We had no choice to but to go, I am so vulnerable at the moment and can't mix with people. And the email clearly stated (happy for tenant to stay in situ until a point of sale) - if that happened before the end of tenancy they would be breaking the clause anyway!

I just hope and wish we can come to some sort of compromise. I don't know what that compromise would be, but I wish there could be. I can't even speak to the landlord directly as the property is fully managed through EA. I do have the landlords address, I don't know if writing to them will do anything.
I literally don't know where to turn or what to do :(

OP posts:
trustfall · 16/02/2023 18:10

RelapsedChocoholic · 16/02/2023 18:07

(I have no legal training, but lots of crappy landlords over the years)

You're not unreasonable or wrong to think it’s unfair and that you were mislead by the landlord renewing just before putting it on the market, imo.

Morally it is wrong, but legally it’s not afaik

The EA email reads to me that your tenancy is going to be broken by the landlord in June (per the break clause), and replaced with a rolling monthly tenancy instead of fixed term.

If a buyer is found sooner than June you will been served a section 21 (the 2 months notice)
There is no section 21 equivalent for tenants
(Unless they’ve taken it off the market this could still be the case)

You can stop paying rent, but the landlord can then take you to court to recover the money. The tenancy deposit schemes do not typically allow the deposit to be taken in lieu of rent, but the landlord could make it take a long time for you to get it back if they choose to.

I hope your treatment is going well 💐

Thank you, this is really helpful.

OP posts:
Kazplus2 · 16/02/2023 18:28

The landlord can serve a section 21 but the tenant does not need to leave when it has been received if they have. Where to go. I know from experience as I have had to take a tennant to court in order to sell before. (In this case that is actually what they wanted as they were after council housing).

Hankunamatata · 16/02/2023 18:34

Morally wrong, the landlord is trying to have cake amd eat it by renewing tenancy before putting it up for sale. Sadly I don't think you have any come back and will have to pay until June. A good landlord would have let you break contract or put you on a rolling contract