Who would want to be a teacher now?

[Painauchocolats]

I've just read an article (found on the DM) that a 53 year old teacher has taken her own life before she was due to appear in court for accidentally catching a pupil's hair. This was whilst she tried to confiscate the girl's mobile phone.

A male teacher (also in the DM) faces being struck off for shouting 'Who the hell do you think you are?" At some pupils who filmed tik toks during his lesson, and slammed his hand on the desk.

Sometimes teachers lose their temper, especially if this behaviour is incessant. Who can blame them? This is why pupils' behaviour is so poor these days, because there are no consequences, and because of things like this.

I think what would make the biggest difference is being able to exclude.

And yet there are vocal (and successful) campaigns to ban school exclusions altogether. They think that it is school exclusions that end up with young people in prison rather than the behaviour that led to them being excluded being the same as the behaviour that puts them in prison.

Fucking ridiculous, particularly when backed by one of the main teaching unions.

It starts early. In primary school, parents refuse to believe that their child misbehaved. They blindly believe their version of events even when witnessed by an adult. You see it on mn all the time - my child wouldn't lie. By not backing up the school you lose an important opportunity. By secondary, their behaviour is worse but you're still blaming the school, the teachers, the other kids. I have spoken to so many parents over the years who wished they'd been firmer when there were early warning signs.

@Whirlwindinacup

Excellent practise.

Also excellent point about them getting involved in messages that upset them.
Two teens separate occasions, one in maths getting involved in some family issues and wouldn't put the phone away and another time nasty messages going around between class and others outside. Pupil getting riled up, no chance of concentrating.

When we excluded a child for beating up another child so seriously that they had to go to hospital, the parents insisted that we were making it up. Even in the face of the cctv.

I was threatened with rape by a student once. The then head told me he was "only joking". There was no punishment. I assume the women he went on to rape didn't think it was "only a joke". He's done a lot of prison time for offences against women.

Having been a secondary school teacher and left because of the behaviour of one class, I think the only answer is to have the lessons filmed/recorded. Then parents can see how their children behave and whether the teacher is responding properly.

God no.

What you'd actually have is parents queueing up to demand access to footage showing that the teacher was a bit snarky or didn't immediately help their kid when they put their hand up or made some minor teaching error or whatever.

You'd also have parents watching the footage and then going 'but Billy was also talking and the teacher is telling off my Johnny, because they pick on Johnny blah blah"

You also have girls insisting they couldn't come in because they'd not straightened their hair or whatever. And kids kicking off about their human rights.

I'm fed up with parents excusing bad behaviour. A parent complained to the head when I accused her son of misogyny - he told a girl that she liked sitting next to a certain boy because she liked to suck his d*. This is in primary school, a middle class child, off to private secondary. Apparently he didn't understand the meaning of what he was saying and I was out of order. Threatened to go to governors if I didn't apologise- I didn't, instead I pointed out he used it in context and the girl he said it knew exactly what he meant. I also suggested they asked their son if he would say the same to a boy. The time dealt with these types of instances is so draining.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. It's really demoralising to spend ages trying to discipline, educate and ultimately help the child to make better choices in the future and come up against parents who don't support you.

I sent the link to the news article to my husband (also a teacher). His words, “you’d hope that family would have that death on their conscience but they won’t care”.

That’s how disillusioned us “old” teachers are.

@CurlyhairedAssassin
if you’re not willing to support the school’s behaviour policies then please take your child elsewhere as while we are happy to work with you to help your child to behave, we will simply not tolerate abuse towards our staff from your children or from you. I will not hesitate to take your child off our roll if necessary. Our staff are my most important asset in an education climate such as this with a recruitment and retention crisis, and we want to keep our excellent teachers. We also want to keep our excellent pupils happy and thriving. Any bullying towards another child will be dealt with severely. I’m also not tolerant of vast amounts of staff time being wasted on parental complaints about the slightest non-issue. If there is anyone who is not happy with this strict approach, please leave now. I don’t care if anyone is not happy with my stance, I like to think I am firm but fair and if you don’t like that then feel free to complain to Ofsted.

I went to an open evening for a secondary school where the headteacher said very similar to this! It’s got a great reputation for results and behaviour. Sadly my DS didn’t get a place here- it’s very over subscribed and they allocate places on ‘random selection’.

My DS got a place at an ‘inadequate’ school. The behaviour was awful and my DS learnt more during lockdown at home as there weren’t constant distractions. It’s since been taken over by an outstanding academy.

It’s completely turned around. They expelled all the disruptive children and they have strict standards. Detentions are given out the same day so parents can’t dispute them (we are notified by text/email of this). My DS is much happier now and I’ve see how things can change with good management.

They can still dispute them though.

I’m a secondary school teacher and wouldn’t touch primary with a bargepole. I teach because I love my subject and there are schools out there that are supportive and have bright interested students. I’m not denying there’s a crisis at the moment but it is still possible to be a happy teacher. I’m 27 years in, 56, and not planning to retire for a good few years yet.

They expelled all the disruptive children

It is made very difficult and expensive for schools to do this.

This thread has been a shocking, appalling read. I wish there were a way that parents could be liable for the children they’ve created (and received thousands of pounds of free money to do so), given the societal impact of their horrific parenting. But just as in the classroom, there are no consequences. People are free to produce as many kids as they like, not bother raising them, then abuse those running around trying to sort it out for them.

I don’t know what the answer is. I really don’t. But I sincerely hope that every teacher posting on this thread who wants to leave does so, and finds a wonderful new job where they won’t have to deal with this anymore.

See all the MN threads where posters give advice on how to force a school into keeping a violent child in the classroom.

YES YES YES YES YES YES YES

When it gets reported to you remove the privilege

I don't agree with this. Surely we need to have some trust in our teachers. Sure some of them get it wrong. We're all human after all. But the majority are doing the best job that they can. Why would we put them under this level of scrutiny. It's not normal behaviour. But I suppose it comes of an era where everything is recorded, photographed, documented. It's not healthy for humans though. If parents can't take a step back and support the school in their role, then maybe they should remove their child from the school instead.

As much as I am sure there are a lot of unruly students and out of control lessons, the move more recently has been towards the super strict academy type schools, hasn’t it?

The fabric of society is in shreds, all around us it's falling apart. I don't know where this is going to end but it's not going to be good. I'm glad I'm 68 and my life's nearly done TBH. I wouldn't like to be young in the world now, especially if you're not rich.

Kids have been spoilt stupid since the 90s. This is the result two generations later. It’s ruined society and there’s no going back from it. They have too much power and are too self-centred to care about the ramifications of abusing that power. They understand, but they don’t care.

Personally, I’d rather my kids got walloped with a ruler to be kept in line than cause some poor teacher to take their own life. I realise that’s heresy on here, but I honestly don’t care. Kids need discipline, end of. It’s not like the lack of it is making them any happier, is it?

www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4741177-dds-teacher-wont-let-it-go?reply=123842847

We’ve got a live one folks 🙄

I remember as a kid being a bit bewildered about the line about kids being disruptive because lessons were boring. (This was in the eighties). As far as I was concerned, things could be boring, but you still had to knuckle down and do them, because they had to be done. Why don't parents educate their children that life is going to have dull, hard, boring bits, and they've got to be endured, because they cannot be cured?

Because that is life. Most people aren't going to have glamorous, interesting jobs.

Was just about to post this - how ironic!

Today is a dark day to be a teacher.