To think most people are concerned about climate change... but

[hopewithoutpanic]

Don't know what they can personally do to make an impact?

We can see the fires, floods and impact climate change is having in both near and far places.

It has to be a concern, right? This is something that could make our planet dramatically different within our and our children's lifetimes.

Would I be correct in thinking the issue is that is individuals just don't know what (aside from recycling / trying to reduce meat etc) they can do to make a real difference?

This sadly. Each and every one of us in the UK could die tomorrow. The whole place could become completely rewilded. It would make not the blindest bit of difference to global warming. The world is not going to reach net zero. It is not in our gift to change this.

I just don't think that's true. There's no fundamental reason we can't decarbonise the electricity grid to keep us warm and keep the routers on. Difficult, yes. Expensive, yes. But with a huge global effort comparable to World War II, achievable, and with enormous upsides.

And local food is hugely overrated. As long as you're not flying it in then food should be grown wherever it's most efficient to grow it. The carbon cost of moving it by land or sea from farm to consumer is a trivial portion of the entire carbon footprint of most foods. Lentils shipped in from India are a far lower carbon option than sausages from soy fed pigs from the farm down the road.

I certainly feel helpless. And that’s the most frightening thing. This is a small island. What we do will make very little difference on the global level. Even if the U.K. sunk into the ocean and vanished, it would make no difference to the planet. China produces the majority of carbon, followed by the USA and India. And whereas Europe has one of the lowest birth rates in the world, Africa has the highest. African women have five children, on average, and the population of Africa is going to double by 2050. What’s going to happen when a billion Africans demand new cars and long haul flights?

I don't understand how anyone can be this selfish.

Because I don’t have to be any other way. Human life isn’t precious, and the planet will exist after we’ve gone.

Because humans (like other animals) by their very nature, are selfish.
If it came down to your baby or the baby of someone you've never met getting that last valuable resource of something vital to survival, what would you choose?
Anyone that says the stranger, is lying.

On a much grander scale, why would people seriously impact their own way of life for faceless strangers?

If we are all in it together globally, great.

Most will see their loved ones right first, and its a very romantic idea to think otherwise.

@ComtesseDeSpair

That's not why you said in your previous post.

You said you didn't care about the humans who are alive after you are dead.

What’s going to happen when a billion Africans demand new cars and long haul flights

Probably nothing. It will be great if Africa can get to the living standards of Europe tbh and it should be celebrated.

Besides, birth rates naturally drop as a country gets richer. Population worldwide is falling far faster than anyone predicted (not that we should listen much to expert ‘predictions’ considering how they completely messed up Covid. Models are garbage)

We could all stop getting new stuff when we don't need it, iPhone? Still working you don't need a new one, they use fomo to get you to upgrade. Going to a wedding, do you really need a new outfit?

On the I don’t care line I find it more difficult to understand if the pp has dc

@MarshaBradyo Same but it’s a weirdly common viewpoint. I’m far more interested in climate change - and have made far more personal changes to minimise my own footprint - than the majority of my colleagues, who’ve got kids and say they’re not really that worried. It’s bizarre.

I do what I can but I’m loathe to make my
life more uncomfortable whilst those at the top don’t make any change whatsoever, continue building on green space and driving massive cars.

i live rurally and work in community nursing covering that wide rural area so my car is non negotiable, I can’t change to electric yet as no driveway, can’t park near my house and the infrastructure will likely be miles behind the more heavily populated areas.

healthcare has masses of waste though it makes me sick, unopened meds, injections etc thrown out when they could be relabelled, blood bottles with no agents in them expiring for god knows what reason, masses of ppe, single use commodes, zimmers etc really makes me cross

That's an anti mitigation bullshit post reinforcing an anti mitigation bullshit post.

Oh give over, what utter tripe.

What sickened me - was reading how the govt are paying renewable energy companies to stop producing as it is overloading the national grid. Why not stop burning so many fossil fuels given how much renewables are generating?
Scotland is 97% renewable for electricity …..

I have an appointment next week. I can either take at least an hour on the bus (with at least 20 minutes walking time on top of that), or I can take a 20 minute car ride. Guess what I'm doing?

A lot of places (yes, rural) don't have public transport. The only way to get there is to drive.

In winter, there are lots of sick people on public transport, which I then catch. I don't have that problem in my car.

I don’t live particularly rurally - my nearest city is 6 miles down the road - but there’s still only 1 bus an hour, it doesn’t run early enough for me to get to work, and even if it did, I couldn’t get back to school on time to pick the kids up without significantly reducing my working hours. And I’d have to cross a 50 mph road with the kids in tow to get home anyway. So I use my car. Like most people do. Public transport works (or can work) great in city centres. It doesn’t work so well outside of that. It just doesn’t. You don’t need to live very rurally for it to be a problem.

This is super misleading: fullfact.org/environment/scotland-renewable-energy/

@FamilyLife2point4 reading how the govt are paying renewable energy companies to stop producing as it is overloading the national grid

I've heard this a couple of times but never actually seen a report or any evidence, could you link please?

This explains constraint payments, both the physics and the economics - there is a physical limit to what can be transmitted through any single piece of equipment, and the locations of generation and demand don't always (or even often) match up.

It will be one of the big challenges for the grid in the years ahead and realistically we are going to need a big upgrade and changes to the transmission and distribution networks. But that means money on people's bills.

@Daftasabroom here is a link www.cityam.com/national-grid-pays-wind-farm-operators-82m-to-turn-off-fans-amid-calls-to-ramp-up-battery-plans/?amp=1

a whopping 82million - yet uk govt claim ‘there is no magic money tree’ - really? Going to guess the profits these generate for Tory MPs are worth more …….. whilst the poor are being plunged further into poverty and debt, whilst Shell announces record breaking profits - seriously? Makes me want to scream!
Scotland need rid of the rUK too when we aren’t allowed to nationalise our 97% renewable electricity- tories are disgusting to stop this!

@MintyFreshOne - 3 seconds of googling and several articles back it up. Why not let Scotland nationalise this? Why not do away with the nuclear on our doorstep?
Going to guess because someone profits, and it’s not the Scottish people benefiting from their own resources!

www.cityam.com/national-grid-pays-wind-farm-operators-82m-to-turn-off-fans-amid-calls-to-ramp-up-battery-plans/?amp=1

Did you even read it to understand why that figure is incredibly misleading? Are you lying or just ignoring details that don’t fit your priors?

Thanks @JassyRadlett Ah I was aware of that. It's just part of the overall deal for the renewables operators as far as I'm concerned. I'd see that as a temporary fix as in due course we'll have CCUS and power to liquid.

The National Grid future scenarios is interesting.

@MintyFreshOne I could attach all the other articles - but I’ll pop up different screenshots from different sites.

The fact that Scotland is 97% renewable, (bearing in mind renewables isn’t a profit driven business like oil/coal) and generates its own gas but Scottish people aren’t able to benefit from this industry on their doorstep (bearing in mind the further you transport energy, the more waste and less efficient) and are getting charged wholesale utility prices - (I was confused at this on the energy sites last month - presumed they would be much lower but when looked up it’s higher) must be lining someone’s pocket, whilst polluting the planet.

when brought up in conversation with colleagues they quote the McCrone agreement but when we looked that up - only 45p from every £1 generated is given back to Scotland (how is that fair - why not give them it all ?)