To think that this book should not be sold to young girls?

[WandaWomblesaurus]

twitter.com/Waterstones/status/1623584986740953091?s=20&t=WU0D0fzc6ClGJC5R-gJnuw

Waterstones tweeted celebrating a book that is about transing girls. Here is one of the illustrations from the book.

AIBU to think that this is directly promoting self harm to young vulnerable girls?

God, what a load of offensive hyperbole. This is a graphic novel about one person's experience, not Mein bloody Kampf. Its sales seem quite modest. It's hardly a number one bestseller resulting in hordes of teenage girls transitioning. Some young people will find it helpful.

Unfortunately the key message of this book is that to achieve happiness, some girls will need to take testosterone (which has similar effects on the body to anabolic steroids) and puberty blockers (a cancer drug used to chemically castrate rapists until it was decided it was against their human rights).

That is not ok.

I'm talking about the UK.

How many under 18s have had mastectomies in the UK?

But it is true.

Some people assigned female at birth do need to transition to achieve happiness.

We know this from the very many trans men who tell us that transitioning was the right course for them and has made them happy. Why on earth do you think you know better than them?

So to achieve happiness and be accepted for who they are, namely female people who don't like dressing in a feminine way and who are sexually attracted to women, they have to adopt a male identity, take life-shortening medication to change their appearance, and have surgery? And this is progressive?

@TeaKlaxon do you think if someone is a man or a woman then they should feel pressured to have a certain type of body?

Do you think it is an acceptable belief that, for example, if you are a man, you need to have a flat chest?

And how do you know if the person assigned female at birth who is having their body chopped up, being rendered infertile, given a lifetime of worsened health and being dependent on expensive drugs for the rest of their life is one of the ones who will be delighted with the outcome, or one of the increasing number of detransitioners who are beginning their adult lives full of horror and regret as the full realisation of what has been done to them begins to dawn?

Given that apparently no one can tell this in advance. Not therapists, not surgeons, not teachers, not the person themselves. How do you know?

Trans people have been transitioning for generations.

In addition, we already know that levels of regret are extremely low among trans people who have transitioned. So are rates of detransitioning and detransitioning seems to be more commonly based on the transphobia experienced after transition than regret about the decision to transition in the first place.

So yeah, I think this author knows better than anyone on here if his decisions have had a positive or negative impact on his life.

And yes, that is disappointing for many transphobes who only want to hear from the Keira Bells of the world, because the majority of trans people who are happy with their decisions really doesn't help their claims.

So to achieve happiness and be accepted for who they are, namely female people who don't like dressing in a feminine way and who are sexually attracted to women, they have to adopt a male identity, take life-shortening medication to change their appearance, and have surgery?
Nobody has said that though, have they?
I hated dressing in a feminine way when younger, was "rough and tumble" etc - never once did I think I was male though.
You dismiss others voices by thinking it's the same for everyone.
It isn't

As was pointed out to you a few posts back, we know 51 teenage girls age 16 and 17 were sent from Scotland to England for mastectomies:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ff0b02b0-1a5d-11ec-8d6d-67649e90fafa?shareToken=b8a372ad9402f34fa6e90c8eba962015

So if you consider all the other teenage girls across the UK managed by the Tavistock, with a huge uptick of females presenting to there over years, again, it’s likely hundreds.

And being over 18 doesn’t make it ok. Women are now grieving their lost ability to breastfeed.

According to a study commissioned by NHS England, 10 years ago there were just under 250 referrals, most of them boys, to the Gender Identity Development Service (Gids), run by the Tavistock and Portman NHS foundation trust in London.

Last year, there were more than 5,000, which was twice the number in the previous year. And the largest group, about two-thirds, now consisted of “birth-registered females first presenting in adolescence with gender-related distress”, the report said.

The review team is looking into the causes behind “the considerable increase in the number of referrals” and the changing case mix, but is not expected to publish any findings until next year.

www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/24/an-explosion-what-is-behind-the-rise-in-girls-questioning-their-gender-identity

It is far, far too early to make the kind of claims you are making, given that the rates of girls applying for this treatment is utterly unprecedented.

The shit is going to hit the fan really badly over the next decade or so. Keira Bell isn't an outlier. She's just ahead of the curve

I'm now thoroughly confused.

Please can someone tell me whether or not it's transphobic to believe that one needs to have a certain type of body because of what gender they are?

In addition, we already know that levels of regret are extremely low among trans people who have transitioned

Typical TRA sentence. “We already know”. Exert something as fact when the reality is the opposite.

We DON’T know. That’s the point. A paper released this week from Australia has it at around 9%.

So are rates of detransitioning and detransitioning seems to be more commonly based on the transphobia experienced after transition than regret about the decision to transition in the first place.

Incorrect again. This is a lie.

In the past few years it has become an explosion. Many of us feel confused by what has happened, and it’s often hard to talk about it to colleagues,” said a London-based psychiatrist working in a child and adolescent mental health unit, who has been a consultant for the past 17 years.

Like all NHS employees interviewed, she asked for anonymity due to the sensitivity of the subject.

“I might have seen one child with gender dysphoria once every two years when I started practising. It was very niche and rare.” Now, somewhere between 10% and 20% of her caseload is made up of adolescents registered as female at birth who identify as non-binary or trans, with just an occasional male-registered teenager who identifies as trans.

Also from that Guardian article.

'Trans people have been transitioning for generations' is an extremely disingenuous and misleading comment. The explosion in adolescent girls with gender dysphoria is absolutely unprecedented.

Women are now grieving their lost ability to breastfeed
See - again, that's a personal thing.
I fucking hated breastfeeding - some love it
Some don't ever want to try it in the first place.
Should everyone never transition, not have autonomy over their own body because other people think they don't know what they want for themselves or in the future?
I think they know themselves better than randomers.

Children shouldn't, no. Which I believe is the point of this thread.

You miss the point spectacularly, as usual.

If you have mastectomy as a child you are never afforded the opportunity to refuse to do it, or try it and hate it. And none of these children think about the consequences of the surgery and its impact on this. They don’t understand it. They can’t consent.

No.

People who have gender dysphoria.

People who are lesbians, or butch, are not necessarily gender dysphoric. Hence why there are still lots of butch lesbians around, despite the desperate attempt to pretend they are all being 'transed'.

Whether you liked breastfeeding or not is irrelevant.

You had the opportunity to have children and to breastfeed, even if you then decided not to do it.

These girls do not have that opportunity. Their lives are destroyed before they've even begun. Why are you, whose autonomy wasn't taken away, whose body wasn't destroyed, so confident in saying that children should be able to make these decisions before they can possibly understand them?

The voices of detransitioners and whistle-blowers are getting louder all the time and one thing that's very clear is that no proper care is taken to 'first do no harm'

Article about a woman who had a mastectomy and regretted her inability to feed her child:

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fgwh.2023.1073053/full

I'm still thoroughly confused.

Please can someone tell me whether or not it's transphobic to believe that one needs to have a certain type of body because of what gender they are?

@TeaKlaxon ?

Name a famous celebrity butch lesbian under 30. Someone who doesn’t use the words queer, gender fluid, genderqueer or similar to describe themselves. But is a proud butch lesbian, same sex attracted.

That is such a sad story 😔

Census shows that numbers of people identifying as Lesbian, Gay and (especially) Bi have also increased.

I am fairly sure that Keira Bell has re-transitioned, and has certainly been seen attending trans community events.

If you have mastectomy as a child you are never afforded the opportunity to refuse to do it
Child on here means anything up to the age of 25 though as "their brains aren't developed properly yet"
Not child in the actual sense.
20 year olds for example are not children

One of the many reasons puberty blockers are a terrible idea is that they stop all the organs in the body maturing, including the brain. Then children on blockers, who still have child-stage brains, not even adolescent brains, are asked to make decisions that would be tough for a fully mature adult brain to process, e.g.

• Do I want to give up the chance to ever become pregnant?
• Do I want to give up the possibility of breastfeeding my own child?
• Do I want to take the chance that I will never have an orgasm?
• Do I want to accept a risk that I will end up living with chronic pain, incontinence and an earlier onset of various serious health conditions like osteoporosis, heart disease and dementia?

Think back to being a child and a teenager. Think about how many seem to think they're immortal and put themselves in danger because they can't safely and reliably recognise and assess risk. Think how impossible it is when you're young to grasp that one day you will grow old - and that likewise the old people you see around you were once young and felt like you.

When a child is ill, we give them a say in decision-making about their medical treatment as soon as they're old enough to grasp what's going on. That's in cases where what's happening is life-threatening or will affect their quality of life for years to come. But we don't give minors a say on matters where society as a whole has decided they're not old enough to make sensible decisions and where they don't need, or positively shouldn't have, the things that some adults have, e.g. alcohol, tattoos, driving licence, job in armed forces, living alone, being sexually active.

It goes against everything we know about child development to say they can make these huge decisions. Maybe lawsuits will bring the medical profession to its senses.