Or was I, to tell this miserable child-hating git at a restaurant where to go today

[SaveScrabulous]

Went out to lunch with ds (2.5) to a restaurant today. Just the two of us for a treat.
Ds goes out to eat reasonably often and is usually very well behaved.

Ds was so good, but made miaow noises once (as you do when you're 2 but they were not loud) and the grumpy git two tables away looks up and stares. I ask ds to be (even) quieter which he does. A little later ds got the giggles a couple of times, not even that loudly. Again every time, grumpy git clearly looks up and stares in an annoyed way. I hear his dining companion (presumably his wife) say "oh come on, he's only laughing". So clearly it wasn't just my imagination/ paranoia.
No one else in there was remotely bothered and I don't see why they would be - ds stayed sitting in his chair the whole meal, not running around and didn't do anything else loud at all (too busy scoffing his pasta and ice cream!) and I spent the rest of the time trying to work out whether to say anything to the grumpy git.

At the end of the meal I went over and calmly said "I'm so sorry if my son's jollity seems to have spoilt your meal a little". To which he replied "Yes it did a little but thank you for coming to say that - it is good of you" (no sarcasm on his part)
To which I said with deeply sarcastic tone "well it's very sad that you feel like that" and walked off.

Ok so this was not McDonalds, it was a gastro pub but it was reasonably busy, there was jazz music on so the room wasn't hushed. It is not Gordon Ramsay ffs. ARGH! I am only just calming down now. A*hole man.

You should go to Gordon Ramsay, I bet the staff would look after you very well indeed. (Have very happy memories of a lovely dinner at the Chelsea restaurant some time ago.)

Personally wouldn't have bothered saying anything. All the guy did was look in your direction.

Your ds sounds lovely, btw!

Lostpuppy - is there a rule that says I can't take my son to a gastropub and I have to stick to Happyeaters or wherever until he is whatever age? I don't understand what my financial situation has to do with anything (i.e. your 'are you loaded qn). Whether I am a multimillionaire, of average or low income is irrelevant. Maybe you were joking though?

My ds (not saying he is 'better' than yours just different! He has his own little challenges believe me!) will sit still for an hour or so in a restaurant quite happily. He stayed in his chair the whole time and wasn't running round. He was incredibly quiet for a 2 year old and we mainly just chatted about things.

Just to clarify - ok yes I agree the man only looked at us but he just kept doing it and in a very annoyed way/ daggers drawn way - and it was obvious when his wife made that comment it wasn't just my imagination.

Ok maybe it was a little over the top to say something when he didn't himself approach me but I just felt fed up by him.

FWIW I wouldn't probably take him to a very quiet grown up place just in case he did misbehave. If we had gone to The Ivy or similar I might have felt the gentleman was justified as it would be unusual to presumably find children there, however this was a gastropub in North London not The Ivy. It is a place where there are highchairs and the staff are very welcoming to kids.

Everybody judges others constantly, mothers are usually the worst for it because they are constantly comparing their little darlings to other children and judging the behaviour of other children and other mothers. Its only natural.

As for the loaded comment, my point is simply that a gastropub is typically more expensive than other places, and I dont mean happy eater or mcdonalds. There are plenty of less expensive places where children are expected and misbehaviour whilst not appreciated is not frowned upon that you could have gone.

If I'm paying £15 for my main course as is typical at a gastropub I wouldnt want or expect babies and toddlers there. But if the restaurant has high chairs in it then, especially if he's a regular, he should have known to expect children and should have kept his daggers to himself.

'Everybody judges others constantly'?!?!? WTF? Speak for yourself lostpuppy, don't go making sweeping generalised statements. I don't judge others constantly, I have better things to do with my time.

And I think children have just as much right to go into any eating establishment for a meal as any other member of our society, why should they be treated differently?

People who don't want to have their meal 'disturbed' by children should stay at home to eat.

Attitudes like yours really piss me off.

YANBU - I would have been a little more terse with him than you are.. Ithink you were very restrained!

We got withering looks this morning in Waitrose, lot's of blue rinsed biddies acting as if DD's were nuclear waste running towards them, rather than 2 little girls!

Makes me so cross, that I sometimes encourage a bit of a screech to annoy them more.

i hate kids

I think restaurants should be for people families. Children should be allowed to go anywhere to eat and be children. Children will make some noise. As will adults. If you want to eat somewhere without children go out in the evening. I really feel that we hate kids, being kids, being there full stop in this country.

I think your old git was in our local M&S cafe this morning, SaveS - dd was sitting with her back to him and squealed (not foully) with laughter over the massive comedy value to be found in biting her gingerbread man's head off. He turned around and looked absolute daggers at her! I have to say I ignored him (but I may have encouraged dd to get sillier...)

Lostpuppy, I really can't understand how you can reason "if I'm paying £15 for my main course, then I don't expect to see babies and toddlers"

We have 2 DD's, before children we ate in very good restaurants, why after having children should we stop visiting these places? We do take DD's along with us, though not in the evening as they are in bed. They both enjoy going out for lunch and are well behaved and eat what you we are eating, they have never eaten so called "kids menu" why should they?, I wouldn't.

Our DD's are 4.5 and 2.5, and are perfectly able to sit, wait for and eat their meals, as they do at home, if they do this in their homes why not in a restaurant?

I agree, CBM. What exactly is so awful about tots going to a restaurant? As I have said, it is perfectly normal in the rest of Europe. In this country the generations are too divided, I think its all wrong. Went out recently with my DSs (11 & 14!) to posh-ish pizza restuarant in town at 7pm. People kept staring, there were no other kids there. I am also still v annoyed at a notice seen in a restaurant in Devon: NO DOGS OR CHILDREN. Says it all really.

Message withdrawn

Had to laugh this morning when reading our local newspaper when this very same pub was described as 'family-friendly'!

An awful lot of this disapproval of children in restaurants comes from the bitter and twisted mindset of

"How dare they be able to afford to take their children to nice places when I couldn't"

What are you on Lostpuppy?

Is £15 the premium to be paid for a child-free zone?

Lost puppy, do you actually like children? I found your SN comment igorant in the extreme!!

As i understand, the OP was at lunch, DURING THE DAY - it is perfectly reasonable to take a child to a place like this during the day. Besides, i don;t actually £15 is that much money for a main course, in the scheme of things. A gastro pub, is a laid back atmosphere where good food can be enjoyed without the stuffy atmosphere.

I take my two year old regularly to pubs and cafes, we dont tend to eat anywhere expensive as we can't afford it right now, but we have eaten at places that charge an average of £15 for a main and they are very child friendly. I tend to make my choice on the amount of room between tables actually, as i do not expect her to have to sit still for the entire meal, that is asking for trouble, and obviously i want her to be able to move around without disturbing tables etc. I have never ever received any looks other than "oh how cute" from people, its usually older people too who look in that manner, so i think the OP just was unfortunate to encounter a miserable old fart.

I think it is all a case of common sense, i certainly wouldnt appreciate children running around later in the evening, as IF i ever manage a romantic meal for two with DP, i would like it to be just that. But actually i think DP and i would probably just look at each other with knowing smiles if there were noisy children around. It would also depend on the resturant as silver service posh resturant is probably not going to be somewhere i would enjoy going with DD, but a gastro pub, is great, an opprtunity to relax as a FAMILY and hopefully not have to endure charlie fecking chalk happy meals, or whatever other shite they serve up.