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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask if any of you are aware that your child is the "blacksheep"

32 replies

2ApplesShortOfABasket · 03/02/2023 08:24

My DS is loving, kind and supportive. He is also reactive, disrespectful and aggressive.

He is 15 now and the relationship between him and his siblings is at an all time low. They no longer have time for him. Any attempt to speak to him ends up with him storming off or screaming in our faces. He gaslights any conversation by saying that "we don't care for him". He speaks disrespectfully to his siblings even in passing.

I know that I can't control how someone behaves but I feel so bad for him as he is ruining his relationships. I am also aware that he feels like the odd one out. I don't want him to grow up feeling like the "blacksheep" of the family but I don't know how I can support him.

He does not see the problem and feels completely justified for his actions. I try to explain that it is not the conversation but the way he reacts which means people are not willing to engage.

OP posts:
henchhen · 03/02/2023 08:33

I don't have any advice I'm afraid but I'm watching with interest as I have a 12 year old who is the same. He does have a diagnosis of ADHD and ODD and meds help a little. When he's not shouting and gaslighting, he's a delight! I try to spend time with them all separately so no one feels left out but he certainly does his best to ruin his relationships with everyone. It's difficult.

Amuseaboosh · 03/02/2023 08:37

2ApplesShortOfABasket · 03/02/2023 08:24

My DS is loving, kind and supportive. He is also reactive, disrespectful and aggressive.

He is 15 now and the relationship between him and his siblings is at an all time low. They no longer have time for him. Any attempt to speak to him ends up with him storming off or screaming in our faces. He gaslights any conversation by saying that "we don't care for him". He speaks disrespectfully to his siblings even in passing.

I know that I can't control how someone behaves but I feel so bad for him as he is ruining his relationships. I am also aware that he feels like the odd one out. I don't want him to grow up feeling like the "blacksheep" of the family but I don't know how I can support him.

He does not see the problem and feels completely justified for his actions. I try to explain that it is not the conversation but the way he reacts which means people are not willing to engage.

Hi OP, can you give some more context as to what the sibling struggles are?

Do you think he has a point? In that he's always felt like the odd one out? What are his friendships/relationships with the wider family like? What's he like in school?

I'm sorry you're going through this, you must feel so torn.

Fundays12 · 03/02/2023 08:44

OP my son eldest is like this. He is horrible to his 2 younger siblings. Hits them puts them down, kicks them, slaps them, punched them, screams and shouts at them and constantly tries to belittle them then wonders why they don't like him. He has ASD and ADHD and refuses to acknowledge his behaviour impacts negatively on his sibling or the rest of the family. They don't like him and I understand why. They are very close to each other. We have spent hours working with him, therapists, autism practitioners and specialist school staff to try get him to learn new behaviour strategies but he doesn't see any behaviour of his as unacceptable so it means he doesn't learn and the gap widens between them

Longwhiskers · 03/02/2023 08:52

No advice sorry but watching with interest as my 8 yr old is often vile to his little sister . He’s doing the autism test ADOS in a couple of weeks. We’re watching a drama on Apple at the moment where the brother really cares and looks after his little sibling and it brings tears to my eyes. She hides from him sometimes and says ‘he hates me.’ It causes me a lot of sadness and I try very hard to encourage him to be nice to her. Unfortunately she’s now learned over the years to be wary of him and I don’t see how it’s going to change. :(

HiddenGiraffes · 03/02/2023 08:55

Why are you (and another replier) using the term gaslighting about your child's behaviour? Do you really feel like they're deliberately manipulating you to make you feel like you've lost your grip on the truth, rather than expressing their real, deep hurt and feelings of rejection?

Original poster
2ApplesShortOfABasket · 03/02/2023 08:58

He is very helpful and is the one that I would go to for anything practical. He thrives from it. However, I would say that it can be done in a "macho" way which irritates his sisters as he dismisses them as though they are defenceless. This is in no way the model that I have presented to him.

With his siblings (and his dad) he is very dismissive and acts like they are unimportant. They used to tell him how hurtful it was to them but he would cut them off emotionally and showed no compassion so they gave up. They stopped inviting him to play family games because they said that "he would always ruin them". It is sad because they all spend time together and have a close bond and he sits on the outside. He doesn't seem to care much unless he is arguing with us and then he claims that nobody cares.

He is the odd one out and when he was younger, I used to try and intervene but I have given up as it was affecting my relationship with my other children. He doesn't respect boundaries at all. He interrupts alot. When he was younger, he was assessed for ADHD and he didn't meet the markers but I still think he shows signs. I just think that he is good at masking outside of the home.

He loves his grandad. He can do no wrong. They have shared interests and my DS goes out of his way for him.

He had lots of friends and he is extremely kind. He has girl friends who he looks out for and treats them with respect. He is great in school and gets on well with teachers.

OP posts:
Workbaseddrama · 03/02/2023 09:00

He sounds like a typical 15 year old to me. Mop up the tears, support them all as best you can and hang in there for the next 3 years

Original poster
2ApplesShortOfABasket · 03/02/2023 09:03

@HiddenGiraffes

Unfortunately I do. Although I don't doubt that they come from pain and rejection, he resorts to gaslighting as a form of protection and attack. It has become a developed technique, especially when communicating with his siblings which is why I use the term.

OP posts:
Original poster
2ApplesShortOfABasket · 03/02/2023 09:05

Also the aggression that he uses is not because he has lost control, it seems to be used to manipulate the situation so that the other person backs down.

OP posts:
louise5754 · 03/02/2023 09:08

My 12 year old is awful to her sister 10. It's no excuse but I think because she is stressed and emotional with school and her friends she knows it's someone "safe" to take her aggression out of.

louise5754 · 03/02/2023 09:09

DD10 can stick up for herself. She's not intimidated but DD12 will just go into her room specifically to torment her. She will bang on her door every time she walks past, or open the door or turn the light on when she wants it off or turn it off when she wants it on!!!!

louise5754 · 03/02/2023 09:12

Workbaseddrama · 03/02/2023 09:00

He sounds like a typical 15 year old to me. Mop up the tears, support them all as best you can and hang in there for the next 3 years

Why three years where is it going in three years?

Workbaseddrama · 03/02/2023 09:15

louise5754 · 03/02/2023 09:12

Why three years where is it going in three years?

Show quote history

They turn 18 and, in my experience, seem to mellow out due to life changes (uni, work, expectation to move out etc)

SalviaOfficinalis · 03/02/2023 09:16

My older brother was always a complete knob to me. We could barely tolerate being in the same room as each other. Luckily he became an okay adult and we get on okay now.

Some of it might be the teenage hormones going mad - apparently they produce a “disgust” reaction to stop people being attracted to their own family members. Maybe his disgust reaction had gone a bit overboard.

Does he do anything active? He may need an outlet for all that testosterone and aggression- boxing/running/ martial arts.

L1ttledrummergirl · 03/02/2023 09:16

Mindfulness worked wonders in my house, it teaches self regulation but does need to be practiced.
Also stop the rest of the family from excluding him, I can understand why as its the easy route and keeps the peace. We would and do always invite them to play with the proviso that they can leave whenever they like. We keep them in play so they can return if they like and the option is always available to refuse the invite. That way, if they start getting intense, we can check on then before it blows up, they have an out and a safe environment to recognise when those feelings are occurring.

My dc are all adults now, we still play games and we have the same rules. All is calm and they have reestablished those bonds.

louise5754 · 03/02/2023 09:17

@Workbaseddrama

Ah yes got you.

Boringcookingquestion · 03/02/2023 09:19

I think at 15 he’s still at an age where you and his dad should be intervening to help him learn appropriate behaviour. Especially if you think he may have ADHD.

I don’t mean to sound dismissive of how hard it is for you, but you sound like you’ve accepted that this is just how he is? Lots of teens think that they know best, are dismissive, and have emotional outbursts… our job as parents is to help them learn to do better.

What happens when he screams at his siblings? How do you help him get to the bottom of his feelings that no one cares about him (it doesn’t sound like gaslighting, as you say it’s coming from a place of pain and sounds like he believes what he’s saying)?

AdamRyan · 03/02/2023 09:23

He's a teenager and their brains are developing so fast they lose empathy etc
This is a great book about why and what typically happens - all my teens have loved it as it explains why they feel so shit and isolated

Blame My Brain: the Amazing Teenage Brain Revealed g.co/kgs/Cxzpgo

Qwertyfudge · 03/02/2023 09:36

I’m not sure that what the op is describing has just appeared on the teenage years? One of my dc is like this, they have asd. The other dc are able to forgive each other much more readily if one behaves badly in one way or another because they are shown the same forgiveness and are becoming much closer as the years go on. It does often feel like we are being gaslit, they never back down from a lie just double down, sometimes I think they actually start to believe what they are saying, it’s hard for the siblings to feel the same closeness when that’s how their interactions work.

RudsyFarmer · 03/02/2023 09:43

louise5754 · 03/02/2023 09:09

DD10 can stick up for herself. She's not intimidated but DD12 will just go into her room specifically to torment her. She will bang on her door every time she walks past, or open the door or turn the light on when she wants it off or turn it off when she wants it on!!!!

What do you do in that situation? When it was happening to me I really wanted my mum to step it but she didn’t. If my kids were doing this I’d have to get involved.

Nosleepforthismum · 03/02/2023 09:44

Sounds tough OP but does he have any consequences at all for screaming at his siblings? I was a horrid teenager and made daily dramatic statements of “everyone hates me” to anyone that would listen. Sounds partly like typical teenage angst but I really don’t think he should be allowed to behave aggressively towards his sisters without punishment. Phone confiscated, no gaming, no lifts, no pocket money etc? My mum would come down on me like a ton of bricks for any behaviour like that and adopted a tough “my house, my rules” approach. I hated her during my teenage years, genuinely hated her but I’m now in my 30’s and she is my best friend and all round favourite person. Sometimes a bit of tough love is needed.

declutteringmymind · 03/02/2023 09:47

Have you told him exactly what you have told us? That you are worried that his behaviour will affect his relationships long term. Can you point out other relationships that you know of that are like this to explain?

Sleepless1096 · 03/02/2023 09:55

When I was that age, I remember someone telling me that relationships are not about who is right and who is wrong. Instead, they're about kindness, compromise and building connections. Sometimes you have to listen rather than talk. People don't like people who are always going on about how superior they are and how unfair life is. I'd tell your DS that if he wants people to like him as he goes through life, he needs to get his head around this.

stargirl1701 · 03/02/2023 10:02

My DD1 is the same at 10 years old. She is autistic. We are currently trying a code word which means she should go to her room.

It is endlessly wearying though.

ThisMustBeMyDream · 03/02/2023 10:09

I am another one coming here with a similar sounding DS (mine is 10) who also has autism and adhd. There seems to be a real theme here and it sounds like it might be wise to explore a diagnosis again. My ds had his diagnosis at 6, but at 3 didn't met the threshold on the ADOS assessment for autism.
I don't have a lot of advice for the situation because I have the same struggles between siblings and rivalry. Unfortunately my eldest is 20, so he doesn't have much to do with the younger 2 who are 10 and 7. So my 7 year old bears the brunt of his brothers company (they have to share a room currently). I am looking in to respite options to give the younger a break from him. It is really relentless here.
I wish I had some answers. I can only see my ds worsening over the teen years really. He can see no other POV other than his own which is totally distorted and not based in any reality. Exhausting for everyone.