To think formula feeding parents are bent over a barrel?

[inpixiehollow]

Just been discussing this with a friend and interested to know peoples thoughts.
Am I being unreasonable to think that the NHS/govt should manufacture a nutritionally complete formula for babies, sold at cost price to families? Not disputing the importance of real access to proper breastfeeding support but we have to acknowledge that some women cannot/don't want to breastfeed and instead are victim to formula companies turning over huge profits. If people want fancy formulas/special additives then the option should be there but with rising cost of living I don't think its acceptable that something so necessary for many babies is getting to the point of unaffordable.
I am a massive advocate for breastfeeding so please don't take this as an attack or downplaying the massive lack of help for bf in the UK, I just wish both options were made more accessible for whatever feeding choices people make.

Yes, like I said - I didn’t even have to look for the cheapest! And yet the first one I found was easily covered by Child Benefit.
So the government is already paying to feed all babies where income is <£50K or even almost £100K for some couples.

As a tax payer: no, I don’t want to buy your formula (or your breast pads: this isn’t about feeding choices) because (a) you should pay it yourself and (b) your CB is covering it anyway 🤷🏻‍♀️

I wish there was better support, education & promotion of breast milk & feeding so more people choose/try to bf & its a normalised thing. I understand not everyone can produce breast milk, no matter how hard they try but everyone should be taught about it before baby is born & be supported properly after the baby is born, ideally in hospital for a few days & be on the nhs. It only needs to be done for the first baby too. If a mother is able to do it with that help for the first born, she’s likely to continue for the next baby & so on. Having a baby should be nurtured & time allowed for that bonding & families should also be taught to be supportive of bf, sadly so many aren’t! So if bf became the norm, ff companies wouldn’t be profiting so much, demand would decline & prices would drop.

@Twizbe and this is part of the problem!

Information on how to breastfeed can be found on Google...

Point is new mums are scared and vulnerable and need support for things like this

There are so many issues at the moment I think subsidised formula will be the last thing on the government's mind. If the baby / mother has real issues it is possible for it to be prescribed (in cases where baby isn't gaining weight). Otherwise, I do think buy it or breast feed.

I do wonder if the people replying supporting the idea are still in the baby stage.

I have a teen Ds to feed. I would love to buy him a tub of formula for the week. He is in a medium men's clothes i would love to buy baby clothes and a size 9 mens trainers.

I really don't get this idea babies should be free.

I get what your trying to say OP and the sad state of affairs isbaby banks do exist for the bare essentiado.there are alot of schemes to help lower income families with the cost child benefit, healthy start grants and charities.

I bf both of mine the first was a struggle as tongue tie, neonatal stay etc but I did get much more feeding support because of these factors.
For me it's saved a lot of money and a £15 hakaa is all I have used with the second one. I generally find bf support groups very helpful and someone is always willing to lend a pump etc outif needed

And yet @roarfeckingroarr with all the support you get with twins (loads, pre covid!) Inc a midwife physically manhandling my breasts) my milk just didn't come in so I had to buy formula. I don't think hospital would have been happy me saying oh its fine, I'm sure they can go a few days without food until my milk comes in!! In the end I managed to express and feed them for a few weeks then dried up. With DS and emergency c sec at 35 weeks I had similar issues but didn't need to actually feed him for weeks as he was ill so had time to work on in in hospital and build up

@Cuppasoupmonster I went to check the source.

This was a study by 2 Australian economists. They estimated the value of breastfeeding as an estimate of a nation's capital assets.

They calculated that the capitalised value of breastfeeding was around A$37 billion. That's comparable with the value of a huge telecoms company. It exceeded the value of livestock and plantation forests.

If women were supported to practice optimal breastfeeding then the value would be A$100 billion.

Sadly governments in general don't value women's time.

Where does the financial benefit lie? I can’t quite Place it?

Yes I agree. I breastfed three children but did a bit of formula for the last. It was expensive but that's what you have to do.

You can get loads of stuff free and cheap for babies. But if you're think formula is bad, the next 18+ years are going to be very tough because it doesn't get any cheaper.

Have sympathy for the very poorest and those who experience sudden hardship but most can afford a ton of formula, even though nobody wants to pay that much

There isn't much else to say though than the instructions.

Google can't watch you feed and see if the latch / position are optimal.

Google can't diagnose tongue tie.

Google can't give the emotional support that might be needed if things aren't going well.

Google isn't always a reliable source and the joyful formula companies do like to undermine women.

I think it's about severity of consequences.

If you give DS small portions he'll moan, and you can probably fill him up with something comparatively cheap even if it's shop brand cereal.

If you give a baby small portions they scream and scream so parents cut down the powder and give the same volume. Baby feels full but the medical consequences so giving watered down formula can be deathly.

I've formula fed from birth and was asked at almost every appointment when I was pregnant if I wanted to talk about breastfeeding, if I would discuss why I didn't want to breastfeed, given leaflets about breastfeeding etc.

I feel like the energy should be put into those who actually want to breastfeed after the initial question and asking if you need any advice/support about breastfeeding.

From what I understand (and I'm no economist)

Everything a country produces has a value including the brain power used to run organisations.

If a huge telecoms is value at producing A$30 billion of capital assets. Then the capital asset production of women breastfeeding is A$37 billion.

So this includes the production of the milk itself, the health benefits on a population level and the healthcare saving on a population level.

It's country specific because clean water and good healthcare will impact the last two.

It's an estimate because there is no balance sheets for them to go off as there are for other things produced.

Some economists compare just the value of the milk production with the value of milk production for artificial infant milk.

@Twizbe and it's fine for women who choose to BF to get that support but not those who choose not to/cannot?

@Twizbe huh? So just the overall health benefit? I’m willing to bet it doesn’t outweigh the capital generated by formula enabling women to work sooner and pay tax (sad as that is really), the tax paid on formula milk and bottles/sterilisers etc?

I couldn't make enough milk, it's as simple as that

I don’t think my comment will go down too well… because we all hate the formula companies. But hear me out 😉

But, why isn’t the current formula offering just dehydrated cow’s milk?

Because it’s better.

Formula companies spend a fortune on marketing to us, but they also spend a fuckton on R&D too. Getting a formula that’s “close” to breast milk.

You’re not just paying for the name, or the cost of producing the cute carton, or the cost of cynically advertising the follow on milk. Some of that profit is going into making it a better milk for your baby. I’m not naïve - I’m not claiming that’s where all the profit goes, and I’m not claiming it’s altruism - it’s commercial advantage.

But nonetheless that money is going into R&D to make something that makes your baby healthier.

So if we were all picking up our free tubs of Victory Baby Food, where is the R&D coming from?

How much profit will you allow the government to make for R&D?

Do you trust the government to then do good R&D, given that it has a captive audience? And given that any R&D will generally lead to a more expensive version they now have to pay for?

We all hate the formula companies, but they’re why we’re not giving our babies neat cow’s milk.

Good luck getting even better product when it’s down to a Tory government! (or any government really). They’ll be the ones saying, “are you sure we can’t change it to 5 scoops not 6, and add a bit more water? We’d save £x”

This is one reasons why governments don't tend to put the value on women's time.

Tax revenue is there in simple plain £.

Like I said I'm no economist so feel free to argue the points with someone who is, or look it up yourself to see the whole study. There are a few from various countries.

This is possibly one of the most stupid things I’ve ever seen written down in my life.

very clearly breastfeeding has numerous benefits, but to put a monetary value on it is impossible, and pointless. The fact people are considering finances when it comes to feeding babies is pretty wrong IMO.

you can’t put a price on love, care and attention. These things also don’t generate money, so the amount of value they have is academic

I formula fed 2 children and although not cheap, I think I probably would have spent more on breastfeeding supplies. With having large breasts, I would have had to invest in good nursing bras, which don't come cheap. Add on nipple shields, nipple cream, nursing pillows, milk storage bags and so on... only having to buy a box of formula a week was financially more affordable because the cost was spread out.

It's sometimes not as simple as breastfeeding vs formula feeding and formula feeding is not always a "choice" as some pp have stated. My baby was born at 35 weeks and refused to either breast or bottle feed, for the first 6 weeks of his life he was fed via an ng tube. I exclusively pumped for as long as I could, but there was no way I could physically and mentally keep up with pumping plus caring for a newborn who was so unwell, so he's now on formula. I agree that the tax payer should not subsidise formula, however stopping all promotions and discounts on formula to "promote breastfeeding" just makes it that much more difficult for people like me who just needs to feed their child. Not all people are able to breastfeed, no matter how much they would like to.

@EezyOozy I guess you just don't understand the intense pain when you are desperate for your baby to breastfeed and you do EVERYTHING possible and get all the help you can possibly find and pump constantly to keep your supply up and your baby just can't breastfeed. And then you are screwed over by paying a fortune for something too. Because it is without a shadow of a doubt one of the most difficult things I've ever faced.

No YABU most ppl should be looking into these things before they have dc. Not everything can be supported or free. Where does it end? Or should schools/institutions just take dc at birth and give them back at 18…for free. C’mon people need to start realising that they need to look after themselves and stop expecting handouts left right and centre!

I breastfed by first with no problems until he was 7 months then he just refused to boob when I got pregnant again (assuming hormone changes).
My second I was hoping to breastfeed but literally ran out of milk and had my boobs COMPLETELY shrivel up into A cups from D virtually over the course of 3 days when he was 7 weeks old. We had to change to formula and it lasts between 4-6 days, luckily he’s not fussy so we get whatever but it made up a bulk of our shopping price. So much so that whenever his grandparents visit we’re requested formula instead of presents🤷🏼‍♀️